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Help for Gus. Metacam dosage and advice

Good luck with the antibiotics. If he has an infection and this can tackle it you should start to see improvement between 24 and 48 hours really. If there's no change after 3 days (we've only had this once) it's either that the problem is not bacterial infection or that the bacteria are resistant to the antibiotic and you can get another. But Baytril is pretty effective and nearly always the one given to pigs. Always complete the course - even if he seems to magically get better half way through! How old is he by the way?

I once had a girl who survived on syringe food for a number of weeks being unable to eat anything else at all. We never found out her problem - there was no pain or infection we could spot (although she was treated for both) - but she might have had trouble swallowing. She could chew but would chew for ages and not swallow. When we saw she couldn't eat we took her to the vet who said her teeth had overgrown, and she had her molars ground but they didn't touch her incisors. These must also have overgrown as after a few more weeks she was struggling to chew her syringe food and her vet noticed she couldn't actually close her mouth! Her incisors were burred down (too short but no matter as they grew back) and immediately she could chew again. If your boy has struggled to chew for a number of weeks this is something to watch out for. Ivy was about 1.1 kilo to start but dropped to 950g and then was able to maintain that for 6 weeks on syringe food alone but it did take a very long time to do the feeds - about 6 hours a day - it was really slow as she couldn't take more than about 0.3ml into her mouth at a time and then of course didn't seem to swallow. She had about 45ml per day between the hours of 7am and 11pm. This was split between 4 feeding sessions (along with her antibiotics and painkillers and gut stimulant!) I did get the impression that after about 7 or 8ml she was physically full. She also didn't seem keen on the syringe - she was hungry but obviously had trouble trying to eat which must have been very depressing for her. If your boy will at least take his syringe food with appetite that's something.
 
Free Ranger said:
Good luck with the antibiotics. If he has an infection and this can tackle it you should start to see improvement between 24 and 48 hours really. If there's no change after 3 days (we've only had this once) it's either that the problem is not bacterial infection or that the bacteria are resistant to the antibiotic and you can get another. But Baytril is pretty effective and nearly always the one given to pigs. Always complete the course - even if he seems to magically get better half way through! How old is he by the way?

I once had a girl who survived on syringe food for a number of weeks being unable to eat anything else at all. We never found out her problem - there was no pain or infection we could spot (although she was treated for both) - but she might have had trouble swallowing. She could chew but would chew for ages and not swallow. When we saw she couldn't eat we took her to the vet who said her teeth had overgrown, and she had her molars ground but they didn't touch her incisors. These must also have overgrown as after a few more weeks she was struggling to chew her syringe food and her vet noticed she couldn't actually close her mouth! Her incisors were burred down (too short but no matter as they grew back) and immediately she could chew again. If your boy has struggled to chew for a number of weeks this is something to watch out for. Ivy was about 1.1 kilo to start but dropped to 950g and then was able to maintain that for 6 weeks on syringe food alone but it did take a very long time to do the feeds - about 6 hours a day - it was really slow as she couldn't take more than about 0.3ml into her mouth at a time and then of course didn't seem to swallow. She had about 45ml per day between the hours of 7am and 11pm. This was split between 4 feeding sessions (along with her antibiotics and painkillers and gut stimulant!) I did get the impression that after about 7 or 8ml she was physically full. She also didn't seem keen on the syringe - she was hungry but obviously had trouble trying to eat which must have been very depressing for her. If your boy will at least take his syringe food with appetite that's something.
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What gut stimulation did you use? Sounds very much like gus x
 
Piggies&buns said:
This is concerning then if he has lost weight despite being fed at that amount?
If he is eating 5mls every half an hour then in 12 hours he is getting 120mls of syringe feed. At that amount he should not be losing weight at all, never mind losing it so rapidly.

What hours are you feeding between/are you feeding overnight?
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Feeding up until 1 am ..then starting at 8 am. Tonight will be all night
 
Buggster10 said:
Feeding up until 1 am ..then starting at 8 am. Tonight will be all night
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Piggies&buns said:
This is concerning then if he has lost weight despite being fed at that amount?
If he is eating 5mls every half an hour then in 12 hours he is getting 120mls of syringe feed. At that amount he should not be losing weight at all, never mind losing it so rapidly.

What hours are you feeding between/are you feeding overnight?
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It's very concerning.
 
Buggster10 said:
Feeding up until 1 am ..then starting at 8 am. Tonight will be all night
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Feeding needs to be sustainable for you also, and if you are doing it every half an hour all night then you are going to be absolutely exhausted.
It would be better for you if you could see if he will feed less often but take more at each sitting.

I am concerned that if you are getting 5ml every 30 minutes, 10ml an hour, over 17/18 hours, then he is eating 170-180ml in a day so he should not really be losing weight.

Is he able to eat anything independently? I think you said he couldn’t earlier in the thread?

I'm going to tag @VickiA to see if she has any ideas.

Youve got to give the antibiotics times to work (a few days) to see if they start to make any difference, hopefully they will. If not, I would go back to the vet.
I would keep a very close eye on how much pain he seems to be in. 0.13ml of cat metacam once a day doesn’t sound like very much to me
 
He can't eat on his own.:( I'm so so upset:( he not eating any syringe food today xx
 
I think at this point I’d consider having him admitted. Could you find out your nearest specialist vets and somehow get there, even if it’s a further travel?
 
Spaniel said:
I think at this point I’d consider having him admitted. Could you find out your nearest specialist vets and somehow get there, even if it’s a further travel?
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They want to give him til tomorrow then decide
 
Well had two MLS today so far ...doesn't want syringe in mouth yet goes towards like he wants it but is grinding teeth and moving jaw side to side..taking him ages to take 1 ml. Given fibreplex today too
 
I’m so sorry you are going through this. Sending you a hug 🤗 and healing vibes to Gus ❤️
 
Buggster10 said:
They want to give him til tomorrow then decide
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If you could ask them to check the metacam dose or contact a specialist for advice? I know he’s a lower weight but it seems very low and if he has pain/inflammation then it just won’t do anything really.

Our vet was saying to me recently that it’s great that guinea pigs have been acknowledged in regards to metacam bottles but it’s sad also because most still under-dose dog metacam so going even less strength at a low dose is worrying.

I’m not trying to worry you, just share info.

Have you tried leaving pellet mush in a bowl in the cage for him to help himself?

It’s so upsetting when they are ill. You’re doing so much and it’s exhausting :(
 
Spaniel said:
If you could ask them to check the metacam dose or contact a specialist for advice? I know he’s a lower weight but it seems very low and if he has pain/inflammation then it just won’t do anything really.

Our vet was saying to me recently that it’s great that guinea pigs have been acknowledged in regards to metacam bottles but it’s sad also because most still under-dose dog metacam so going even less strength at a low dose is worrying.

I’m not trying to worry you, just share info.

Have you tried leaving pellet mush in a bowl in the cage for him to help himself?

It’s so upsetting when they are ill. You’re doing so much and it’s exhausting :(
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Ok thanks. Will do. Will try the mushed up pellets in his cage too
 
I can only echo the advice spaniel has given.
He sounds like he might be in discomfort, the metacam dose sounds very low to be doing much (particularly as it’s only once a day, they metabolise pain meds in about 12 hours, so for the other 12 hours he will not be receiving any pain relief).
If he’s only had 2mls of feed all day, then given everything including his weight loss, I would personally not be happy to give it another day before getting him back to the vet. I’d go tonight as an emergency to be honest
 
They only thing they will do next I'd put him under to see if it is back teeth but they don't think he will pull through.
 
Yes, the vet should have given you a twice daily dose - a piggy savvy vet would have done so.

I know it’s scary with the risk that he may not get through an anaesthetic, but the reality is, something is wrong with him and without finding out what, he won’t get better. If it is that his back teeth have overgrown, then he needs dental work done
 
Buggster10 said:
They only thing they will do next I'd put him under to see if it is back teeth but they don't think he will pull through.
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He is a low weight now to undergo being put under.

The back teeth can be checked during a regular appointment by clearing the food out first. It doesn’t let you see everything but near enough everything. It can also provide clues - if there’s more food on one side for example or if there’s excess saliva in one area.

It could be that he now needs fluids under the skin and his meds injected (it works quicker this way) and his syringe feeds continued. This is usually what the emergency/out of hours/overnight vets will do.
 
Thanks. She did have a good look then let me look. No overgrowth but possibly one little spur but said couldn't be sure...nothing worried her looking in there. He is 5 years old now too x
 
Buggster10 said:
So shall I increase the metacam.
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No you can’t do it on your own. Only the vet can tell you what to give. If your vet is an exotic specialist then I would have expected them to have already prescribed it twice a day.

I can understand them wanting to give the antibiotics time to work, but if they do think it’s teeth then they do need to be checked and I would have thought they would already have done so. As spaniel has said, they don’t need to be out under for a dental check, but it is easier.
 
Piggies&buns said:
No you can’t do it on your own. Only the vet can tell you what to give. If your vet is an exotic specialist then I would have expected them to have already prescribed it twice a day.

I can understand them wanting to give the antibiotics time to work, but if they do think it’s teeth then they do need to be checked and I would have thought they would already have done so. As spaniel has said, they don’t need to be out under for a dental check, but it is easier.
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They were checked. She could see parsley so moved it out the way to look either side..
 
I think it’s now emergency care or travel to a vet who can do the teeth consciously, so the Northampton one. I know it’s far and may not be possible for you but I think I’d be considering between those two options now.

Maybe extra support whilst the antibiotics kick in? Maybe ask your vet if injecting them would make any difference or if there’s anything stronger they can give whilst he’s there?

I can’t think of anything else. You’re his owner and know him best so depending on how he is in himself, you can only do what you feel is best and go with that.

Best of luck. He’s a very cute little guy.
 
So from your updates it might not be his teeth but they’d have to sedate to check for sure but they don’t think he’d survive that?

So they’re giving metacam and antibiotics to hopefully stabilise him to hopefully get stronger and gain weight? That makes sense. In that case focus on the metacam dose (really push for dog metacam twice a day) and more intensive care and go from there.
 
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