Engel's Herd

Just realized I've been on this forum over a year now. Wow.

When I first joined I knew nothing about pigs, didn't know anyone who kept them either. Never held one, nothing. So thank you for your support and time. I would tag you all but guarantee I'll miss someone, hopefully you know who you are though.

Also, to think Eileithyia-Eris and Jupiter will be a year old at the end of the month is crazy.

Today I spent time with the pigs and they all melted on my chest at one point or another. Not as in hot, but relaxed. Normally they're too busy to sit still, (except Po. Po is a snuggle bug). So was nice to have them feel so comfortable and safe. Jupi kept coming up to me so I could give him head scritches, then popcorn away, then come back for more. For the first time ever he looked as if he had a smile on his face. (Which made me smile and shed a few tears. It was just so pure and lovely, it made my day).

Me and Mumma (Eris) always have cuddles and she seems to enjoy them. I often talk to her and she'll come right up to me, lay down and listen. She'll now happily be picked up. There's a lot of trust there. Not sure if that's down to when she was pregnant. I did treat everyday as if it was special just incase anything happened to her during labour.

For the first time ever I've heard Po rumble while with his dad. Of course he'd probably had done before but this is the first time I've witnessed it. They carried on wiggling their bums even when lay down together before shooting of pop-corning and wheeking together. Never a dull moment with those 2.

The babies have both grown up to be very confident pigs. A lot more confident than the parents in many aspects. More confident with people, more confident in exploring new spaces, they are the first to try things. Mia is a law to herself and will happily jump out of the hutch and wonder across the shed and stare into the face of my dogs before waddling away without a care in the world. No fear in that pig at all.
 
I’ve put in heat pads for my four today. Apparently it’s supposed to get better from tomorrow…
 
Warm during the day today but meant to drop to 11° tonight and remain the same throughout the week.

Weighed everyone today:
Po- 990g
Jupi- 1092g
Mia- 982g
Eris- 1052g
They lost some weight over the hot period, not an alarming amount though it's nice to see them putting it back on.

Had a snuggle with everyone as usual but only snapped a photo with Mumma.

IMG_20210810_173224331.webp

All my pigs sit like this on my hand when picked up. I try to have them lay normally but nope. Whatevers comfortable I guess.
 
Starting to drop cooler now at nights. Meant to go down to 11 again tonight and the rest of the week nights. Started putting in their heat pads just to be on the safe side. Hasn't dropped below 15 in the shed yet. I've added a lot of hay. Is this enough? Or do you mean fill it from floor to ceiling quite literally?
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Cuddles with Po and Mia
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If it is still above 15 degrees in your hutch and shed, then I personally wouldnt start adding anything too much extra otherwise when it does start to get cold in there you have less adjustments available to you to keep them warm.

Obviously it depends on what actually happens with the temperatures, but I dont usually start adding extra hay and certainly not heat pads until much towards the end of September. Mine are still free roaming the shed all night just on aubiose bedding with normal amounts of hay for eating. It's still around 18 degrees in there in the mornings.
For me, I build it up in increments - the first thing I do is start to lock them back into the hutch at night, the next thing is to pull down the front hutch cover, then add extra hay (again adding a little extra at first, then building it up until it is stuffed full), then pull two covers. Then one heat pad. Finally building up to the hutch absolutely stuffed full with hay and the addition of all the heat pads - one at first, building up to all four once it is closer to winter.
 
Please welcome newbies Cyril and Basil! Born on 29th June, so they're 8 weeks old now. (Definitely boys!)

Their mum got dropped off at P@H as an unwanted pet and told them that she'd never been near a male. Obviously a lie. I know the staff pretty well and we often talk and share information ect. Anyways for the past few weeks when I've popped in for bits and bobs they kept dropping these boys into conversation while asking would I take them. Please note this p@h doesn't sell animals it has a rehoming section and they have turned so many people away because their setups are not suitable.

Now I do intend on keeping them as a seperate pair to Jupi and Po, however, would it be worth intro-ing them temporarily through the school months? (Until testosterone start spiking at 4 months?) Or just keep them seperate? They are very unsure of everything including foods. Just looking for opinions 🙂

Here's a pigture!IMG_20210826_181904311.webp

Cyril (left) (aby? He's got a swirl on the left shoulder which sticks up)
Basil (right) (rex?)
 
Gorgeous piggies!

It would not be worth introducing them during the school months. Doing so would cause problems for your other two boys. It’s not worth the risk. Do keep them entirely separate.
Are they going to be living in the shed as well? Jupiter and Apollo may be used to your girls, but you will need to be careful about Cyril and Basil getting the smell of the girls.
 
Theyve only been separated from their sisters for 2 weeks 🙄. From what I understand they were small so could stay longer. Currently they're in the house but will go into the shed. Was just wondering if it was worth the intro or not.

Could they live side by side? Like half hutch and the floor of the shed? (Seperated by mesh) or will that upset Jupi and Po?

Also at their age could they live outside or is it best to keep them in a bit?
 
Babies who don’t yet meet the 250g at 3 weeks of age can stay on with sows for a bit longer but they still need to be separated if they reach 250g by 5 weeks of age. Nothing you can about it though only hope the sisters and mum haven’t become pregnant by them.

No I don’t think it’s worth the introduction. Even if the two babies are fine by it, it’s a huge risk to the other boys‘ relationship, particularly as they are teenagers themselves.

If theyve always been inside then its a bit too late in the year for them to be able to acclimatise now, particularly with them being so young. It would probably be best for them to stay indoors until next Spring. Move them out when it gets warmer in April time and then they can stay out. It’s likely they will have to live indoors until next spring.

Cyril and Basil can live side by side with Jupiter and Apollo. Boars living as neighbours is usually absolutely fine.
But, its of course best for the girls to be at the bottom of a stacked cage, not the boys.
Boys who have always been around girls tend to have a less strong reaction, but if you’ve got to keep the two youngsters indoors, then they will spend months away from sow scents, so putting them into the shed next spring might cause issues - particularly as they will be well into their teens by then. Something you’d have to play by ear really. All I can say is that introducing sow smells to bonded boars who aren’t used to sow smells is risky for their bond
 
Piggies&buns said:
Babies who don’t yet meet the 250g at 3 weeks of age can stay on with sows for a bit longer but they still need to be separated if they reach 250g by 5 weeks of age. Nothing you can about it though only hope the sisters and mum haven’t become pregnant by them.

No I don’t think it’s worth the introduction. Even if the two babies are fine by it, it’s a huge risk to the other boys‘ relationship, particularly as they are teenagers themselves.

If theyve always been inside then its a bit too late in the year for them to be able to acclimatise now, particularly with them being so young. It would probably be best for them to stay indoors until next Spring. Move them out when it gets warmer in April time and then they can stay out. It’s likely they will have to live indoors until next spring.

Cyril and Basil can live side by side with Jupiter and Apollo. Boars living as neighbours is usually absolutely fine.
But, its of course best for the girls to be at the bottom of a stacked cage, not the boys.
Boys who have always been around girls tend to have a less strong reaction, but if you’ve got to keep the two youngsters indoors, then they will spend months away from sow scents, so putting them into the shed next spring might cause issues - particularly as they will be well into their teens by then. Something you’d have to play by ear really. All I can say is that introducing sow smells to bonded boars who aren’t used to sow smells is risky for their bond
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I know it's not the done thing, but I have heard of boar quartets working. Jupi is very laid back boar and tbh so's Po. They've even been in a side by side cage with the girls when I misplaced grids and didn't have enough for a stacked cage (seperated by mesh obviously). While there was some mutual sniffing, they decided to share the same hay pile (boys pulled it through the mesh despite having their own right behind them. 🙄 That had no impact whatsoever. That's the only reason I'm considering it.

Could I see the boys reactions through bars first or attempt an intro of some sort to see where they stand? As I said I know this is normally advised against.

Re stacked cages, I understand :)
 
Sub adult boar quartets are even more unstable than trios. We can only warn you that doing so is risky.
Their reaction through the grids is no indication of what will happen when you put them together. An introduction will force a change in hierarchy, particularly as the babies reach their teens, and this could be a big problem. Of course if you wish to do it knowing the risks then it is of course your decision, but bear in mind that if there is a failure, you may not be able to put them back into two separate pairs - it could result in one pair and two singles, or all four ending up as singles.
For four boars you will need an enclosure measuring 4 metres by 1 metre to give them all a square metre of territory each.

Adding More Guinea Pigs Or Merging Pairs – What Works And What Not?
 
Piggies&buns, would a c&c cage with a bunny box type thing in it be ok in the shed? The sheds secure and insulated, plenty of hay, snuggle safes and covers. Should be alright, right? During the winter I know it'll be difficult but if it gets too cold they'll be coming in anyway.
 
I would say no to a c&c in a shed. The new boys are gorgeous!
 
Siikibam said:
I would say no to a c&c in a shed. The new boys are gorgeous!
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Merab's Slave said:
What cute piggies.
Great to know they have found a lovely home with you.
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Thank you both. They're both very skittish and not confident at all. Real difference between them and Po and Mia.

Will be weighing them tonight so will be interesting to see their weights. Compared to the others at their age.
 
Engel said:
Piggies&buns, would a c&c cage with a bunny box type thing in it be ok in the shed? The sheds secure and insulated, plenty of hay, snuggle safes and covers. Should be alright, right? During the winter I know it'll be difficult but if it gets too cold they'll be coming in anyway.
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As their only housing in the shed, I personally wouldn’t. A c&c will offer no way of trapping warmth in like a hutch so you probably wouldn’t even get to the end of September/beginning of October before it’s too cold for them. Whereas the others in the hutch will likely be fine (with lots of warming measures) well into winter.

As you know, my set up is very similar to yours - hutch with c&c playpen surrounding the shed. While my boys have constant access between hutch and shed during summer, there is going to come a time very soon when they will start to be locked into the hutch at night, then with additional measures added as the seasons progress. But the hutch itself and warming measures (in my shed anyway) mean they are mostly able to spend all winter in there safely (only once in the past three winters has it got too cold and that wasn’t until February of this winter).
 
Piggies&buns said:
As their only housing in the shed, I personally wouldn’t. A c&c will offer no way of trapping warmth in like a hutch so you probably wouldn’t even get to the end of September/beginning of October before it’s too cold for them. Whereas the others in the hutch will likely be fine (with lots of warming measures) well into winter.

As you know, my set up is very similar to yours - hutch with c&c playpen surrounding the shed. While my boys have constant access between hutch and shed during summer, there is going to come a time very soon when they will start to be locked into the hutch at night, then with additional measures added as the seasons progress. But the hutch itself and warming measures (in my shed anyway) mean they are mostly able to spend all winter in there safely (only once in the past three winters has it got too cold and that wasn’t until February of this winter).
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Ok I'll look into getting/making a single 6ft hutch to stack or attach to the top.
 
Can anyone recommend a single storey hutch? Preferably 6ft. All the ones I have found are double hutches.
 
Piggies&buns said:
Home and Roost have 6ft singles
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Do you know if they're light enough to sit on top of the bluebell?

Another thing, (late night scrolling and sleep deprived so bare with me), 3ft hutches. Could I get 2 and knock a wall out and push them together? Get a custom cover ofc. This is the photo I saved.
Screenshot_20210827-133805.webp

I know it would need adapting to ensure it stays stable.
 
Hmm, I doubt it would be light enough to sit on top. Chartwell hutches are pretty sturdy and well made.

I don’t see a reason why you couldn’t get two 3 foot hutches and join them together BUT the hutch in that picture looks narrow (you’re looking for 2 foot deep regardless of the length)
 
Piggies&buns said:
Hmm, I doubt it would be light enough to sit on top. Chartwell hutches are pretty sturdy and well made.

I don’t see a reason why you couldn’t get two 3 foot hutches and join them together BUT the hutch in that picture looks narrow (you’re looking for 2 foot deep regardless of the length)
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Yeh I thought that.

Yeh I'm not sure on depth. But will look for 2ft if not I'll make my own. It's more the style I was wondering about. The bluebell is mostly ply and thin wood so using similar materials would be ok wouldn't it.
 
Engel said:
Yeh I thought that.

Yeh I'm not sure on depth. But will look for 2ft if not I'll make my own. It's more the style I was wondering about. The bluebell is mostly ply and thin wood so using similar materials would be ok wouldn't it.
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I think I've seen something like that one before, but I think it was being sold as a tortoise or hedgehog shelter rather than a permanent piggy hutch. I think the smallest decent commercial hutch you'll get is a 4ft.

Yes it would be ok - it wouldnt be much different to the bluebell - and as it is kept in your shed then you wouldnt have to worry about the wood getting wet (that's the biggest issue with ply outside)

I was wondering though, whether you may be able to fit a reinforced shelf to your shed or something similar and put a commercial 6ft hutch on that? Not sure if it would still be too heavy for a shelf or whether it would even be possible but was just a thought
 
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