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6 year Old Pig with health issues

Free Ranger said:
We've treated this with soaking in Epsom salts and after drying applied a very light dab of Sudocreme which is a nappy cream you buy over here. But we've never had to do this for long periods of time - some members have reported that regular use of this cream can thin the skin and make the problem worse. I'm also wondering if you're just going to be stuck between a rock and a hard place and that the regular soaking to keep her bits clean has softened her feet a little :hmm:

One of my older girls carried a persistent bumble towards the end which didn't heal but had spates of being better and then worse. It was connected to her having arthritis which wasn't being treated at that time as she seemed to move around OK and I was just assuming all older piggies were a bit stiff. Thinking of you and Margaret x
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Try epsom salts and a thin layer of flamazine (silver sulfadiazine) cream afterwards, which is also available in the USA.

Regular soaking or overuse of any foot cream can unfortunately mean that bugs can get into the skin. Older/frailer piggies standing in their excrement are particularly prone.
See chapter 4 of our mobility issues care piggies guide (the recommendations are from an experienced exotics nurse specialising in guinea pigs): Looking After Guinea Pigs With Limited or No Mobility
 
Thanks @Free Ranger and @Wiebke . I started some epsom salt soaks this weekend and will see how it goes. Have some pictures out to my vet and will also lump this into my follow up on 5/31. It doesn't seem to be getting worse (?) at least and with her poops normalizing she is luckily cleaner on her hands

Unfortunately I noticed yet another strange thing last night into today. I thought I was imagining it at first but now I know for sure after some tests. She seems like she "lost her voice." When I was rattling some veggie bags this evening she got excited like normal, ran around, climbed her cage bars, etc. but when I saw her try to wheek it seemed like just a kind of exhale sound. And even when I was probing/cleaning under her belly she would normally squeak some complaints but nothing came out.

Her weight and appetite are still the same as they have been. I was thinking this was some kind of URI thing but she shows no other symptoms that I can pinpoint: no (further) weight loss, no discharge, no sneezing/coughing, and even her coat looks decent. And honestly if it was a URI she is already on two antibiotics that would hope might forestall it. Unsure what else this could be and open to any thoughts.

Thanks to everyone as always.
 
Devout_Haruhiist said:
Thanks @Free Ranger and @Wiebke . I started some epsom salt soaks this weekend and will see how it goes. Have some pictures out to my vet and will also lump this into my follow up on 5/31. It doesn't seem to be getting worse (?) at least and with her poops normalizing she is luckily cleaner on her hands

Unfortunately I noticed yet another strange thing last night into today. I thought I was imagining it at first but now I know for sure after some tests. She seems like she "lost her voice." When I was rattling some veggie bags this evening she got excited like normal, ran around, climbed her cage bars, etc. but when I saw her try to wheek it seemed like just a kind of exhale sound. And even when I was probing/cleaning under her belly she would normally squeak some complaints but nothing came out.

Her weight and appetite are still the same as they have been. I was thinking this was some kind of URI thing but she shows no other symptoms that I can pinpoint: no (further) weight loss, no discharge, no sneezing/coughing, and even her coat looks decent. And honestly if it was a URI she is already on two antibiotics that would hope might forestall it. Unsure what else this could be and open to any thoughts.

Thanks to everyone as always.
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Hi

Guinea pigs losing their 'big wheek' as adults is not uncommon. They will sound rather hoarse for the remainder of their lives but it is nothing to worry about. It is not illness-related.

There is a sterile (i.e. non bacterial) cystitis that doesn't react to antibiotics but it is not connected to bladder stones. A bacterial cystitis can result from bacteria in the bladder getting into the damaged bladder wall areas.

All the best.
 
My fat fluffy girl has a hoarse wheek most of the time. At first it sounded like she wanted to wheek but was too terrified and did it sort of under her breath! Flora is more vocal and Louise tries to join in - sometimes she does manage a proper one. But she doesn't have any breathing trouble.
 
Thought I would give another update on Margaret since it has been a little while.

She went to the vet for another check-in last Tuesday. The vet did an ultrasound and it seems like her bladder is clearing up nicely again from her infection. We did decide to continue her on the antibiotics for longer since last time as soon as she came off them the infection reappeared. Jury is still out on her tooth. Seems to be growing back ok but hard to tell at the moment since it's fairly short. Her foot pad seemed to mostly heal and at this stage it is just about keeping it clean. While at the vet, aside from her low weight, everything else seemed ok (heart, lungs, poops, etc.). The soft poop bouts she was having seemed to pass and we are back to mostly solid small to medium poops. Still grit in the pee but I have not noticed pain any more.

That said her weight has still been an issue. Previously when I posted she had dropped from being in the 810s on average to the 790s. Since then the new average has been around 775 for the last week or so. That said it was originally down in the 760s and then bounced back the low 780s the last few days so I was hopeful. Appetite remains decent enough and she is still getting 3-4 syringe feedings a day with critical care. I have noticed she is a little less interested in the Critical Care recently. Whereas before she would take the whole 8-10 mL serving without really any coaxing, now she will take about half and then need a little coaxing. That said I guess if her weight is not dropping she is getting "enough."

She is still very lopsided at times. Still a mystery here for both the vet and me. She seems to be able to walk fine but when she does settle she always favors the distended side and can really flop onto it, kind of folding that leg inward to do so. Not sure what is going on there. That said she does seem to be in ok spirits. Excited for veggies, stands up on her cage bars, etc.

Biggest concern, which just popped up literally in the last hour or two, is I thought I noticed some crackling breathing. I am not 100% sure yet since I haven't taken her out (she was eating and I did not want to interrupt her) but it sounds different from the stomach/gassy noises I have heard from her the past few months. I am not sure if this could be caused by something temporary or if it's a definite sign of URI which I am dreading. I have not really seen other symptoms yet (like coughing/sneezing, discharge, etc.). I also cannot talk to the vet or see him again until Monday because everything is closed Sunday here. And furthermore, not sure what the vet might do given she is already on 2 antibiotics (Bactrim and Orbax) for her UTI.
 
I think it would have to be very unfortunate to develop a URI while already on 2 antibiotics so hopefully this is just a short-term blip. The rest sounds about as good news as can be expected I guess. She's still in cheerful and able to stand up at the bars, she still wants her veg. She is likely not mourning her previous good health as she's busy living in the moment and you are looking after her so well that any new problems like her balding belly or sore foot are being dealt with as they come up. I hope I get a nurse like you as I get old! 💕
 
Devout_Haruhiist said:
Thought I would give another update on Margaret since it has been a little while.

She went to the vet for another check-in last Tuesday. The vet did an ultrasound and it seems like her bladder is clearing up nicely again from her infection. We did decide to continue her on the antibiotics for longer since last time as soon as she came off them the infection reappeared. Jury is still out on her tooth. Seems to be growing back ok but hard to tell at the moment since it's fairly short. Her foot pad seemed to mostly heal and at this stage it is just about keeping it clean. While at the vet, aside from her low weight, everything else seemed ok (heart, lungs, poops, etc.). The soft poop bouts she was having seemed to pass and we are back to mostly solid small to medium poops. Still grit in the pee but I have not noticed pain any more.

That said her weight has still been an issue. Previously when I posted she had dropped from being in the 810s on average to the 790s. Since then the new average has been around 775 for the last week or so. That said it was originally down in the 760s and then bounced back the low 780s the last few days so I was hopeful. Appetite remains decent enough and she is still getting 3-4 syringe feedings a day with critical care. I have noticed she is a little less interested in the Critical Care recently. Whereas before she would take the whole 8-10 mL serving without really any coaxing, now she will take about half and then need a little coaxing. That said I guess if her weight is not dropping she is getting "enough."

She is still very lopsided at times. Still a mystery here for both the vet and me. She seems to be able to walk fine but when she does settle she always favors the distended side and can really flop onto it, kind of folding that leg inward to do so. Not sure what is going on there. That said she does seem to be in ok spirits. Excited for veggies, stands up on her cage bars, etc.

Biggest concern, which just popped up literally in the last hour or two, is I thought I noticed some crackling breathing. I am not 100% sure yet since I haven't taken her out (she was eating and I did not want to interrupt her) but it sounds different from the stomach/gassy noises I have heard from her the past few months. I am not sure if this could be caused by something temporary or if it's a definite sign of URI which I am dreading. I have not really seen other symptoms yet (like coughing/sneezing, discharge, etc.). I also cannot talk to the vet or see him again until Monday because everything is closed Sunday here. And furthermore, not sure what the vet might do given she is already on 2 antibiotics (Bactrim and Orbax) for her UTI.
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Try a bowl of steaming water next to the cage and see whether that can ease the breathing.
 
Thanks, I will try that. Hoping to slip in to the vet tomorrow morning or Tuesday the latest. She seems to still be in decent spirits, appetite, and weight through the day despite the crackle continuing. I am somewhat surprised her weight is staying as stable as it is given she was dropping only a few days ago. I am a bit worried that maybe the weight is coming from fluid or something like that, not sure if that can happen. Hate to see something like this cropping up when she was just kicking her UTI and poo problems.
 
Devout_Haruhiist said:
Thanks, I will try that. Hoping to slip in to the vet tomorrow morning or Tuesday the latest. She seems to still be in decent spirits, appetite, and weight through the day despite the crackle continuing. I am somewhat surprised her weight is staying as stable as it is given she was dropping only a few days ago. I am a bit worried that maybe the weight is coming from fluid or something like that, not sure if that can happen. Hate to see something like this cropping up when she was just kicking her UTI and poo problems.
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The problem with a lowered immune system is that all the opportunists can kick in and you end up with a rat-tail of secondary headaches. :(
With the older/frailer piggies it is in my own experience always a toss up between those where the immune system gives way or where an organ gives way first.

Hopefully it is just a minor thing. All the best!
 
Update from today's vet visit. Looks like it is heart problems and she has some fluid in her lungs. She started on a diuretic and heart medicine. She is still in relatively good spirits and eating so I am hoping there is still some hope.
 
Devout_Haruhiist said:
Update from today's vet visit. Looks like it is heart problems and she has some fluid in her lungs. She started on a diuretic and heart medicine. She is still in relatively good spirits and eating so I am hoping there is still some hope.
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All the best!

Please accept that your girl's body is getting frailer and that it will at some point give out. When the chips are down, piggies are only small animals and their body can take only so much.

Make the best of the time she is well in herself but be aware that your time with her is becoming more limited. It is harder to accept with a slow, gradual decline and a major battle from you because you are investing so much of your own time and strength and so many emotions into her. :(

I am not saying this in order to spoil it for you but to help you to not go into a total free fall emotionally when your precious girl's time has finally come and she is leaving you absolutely distraught. Just treasure very new day she is still there and concentrate on creating a special memory for every day you have her with you.
 
Thanks, Wiebke. I definitely understand. Sometimes I feel I have more acceptance now than I did a month ago, but sometimes I think it's just some denial on my part. Regardless I will continue to do my best to give her the best care I can. She still surprises me with her good spirits sometimes which makes me happy to see.
 
Devout_Haruhiist said:
Thanks, Wiebke. I definitely understand. Sometimes I feel I have more acceptance now than I did a month ago, but sometimes I think it's just some denial on my part. Regardless I will continue to do my best to give her the best care I can. She still surprises me with her good spirits sometimes which makes me happy to see.
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It is a painful time as your own grieving process is already underway underneath it all. You can never fully accept it but the more you can appreciate the good things you share during this time, the more you can take from it for the long term.

It is also very difficult when you are dealing with a rat-tail of complications and unexpected issues, resulting from a slowly weakening body and immune system because of the constant up and down and the queue of new problems getting longer rather than shorter is emotionally so very draining on you. All you can do is hanging on in there. Accept the pain and don't feel like you cannot have a little cry when it gets too much. It has to all come out, one way or other at some point anyway. :(

But you will hopefully find that unless you are in denial (which you aren't) that apart from the pain of your loss and the practical need to reorganise your automatic daily routine (very hard and often painfully jarring), you have already done a lot of your grieving home work in these months and will find it to a good extent easier afterwards when you compare it to a sudden death.
Be aware that things may well speed up and that the actual end can come very suddenly and very quickly once the defences are fully breached. It will always happen far too soon, no matter how much you are braced for it. The reality of a loss is always a shock.

I hope that the meds will buy her little more time and more comfort.
 
Yeah ☹️


Oh and I meant to mention what she is actually getting.


Twice a day she is getting:
0.2 mL of a 10 mg/mL solution of the furosemide (so 2 mg twice a day for a total of 4mg daily)
And
a quarter of a 2.5mg Enalapril tablet (dissolved) (so .625 mg twice a day for a total of 1.25 mg daily)

And for reference is is ~780g atm in weight

Not sure how this compares to other dosages people have used. It seems about aligned with, at least for the furosemide, what is mentioned on the guinea lynx page for these medicines.
 
Devout_Haruhiist said:
Yeah ☹️


Oh and I meant to mention what she is actually getting.


Twice a day she is getting:
0.2 mL of a 10 mg/mL solution of the furosemide (so 2 mg twice a day for a total of 4mg daily)
And
a quarter of a 2.5mg Enalapril tablet (dissolved) (so .625 mg twice a day for a total of 1.25 mg daily)

And for reference is is ~780g atm in weight

Not sure how this compares to other dosages people have used. It seems about aligned with, at least for the furosemide, what is mentioned on the guinea lynx page for these medicines.
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I hope that other members can help you as I have never had a confirmed heart piggy so far.
None of my suspects presenting with at least three symptoms has ever reacted to heart meds...

@Piggies&buns @PigglePuggle
 
Furoseminde is a diuretic, which helps clear excess fluid from the body- commonly used for piggies with less than optimal heart function, and/or fluid on the lungs- the dose sounds appropriate.
Enalapil is an ACE inhibitor, medicine to reduce blood pressure- not heard of its use in guinea pigs, but it is used in dogs.

These medicines may help support some of the symptoms of heart failure and buy your old girl a bit more time- once piggies get to 6 years old, which is equivalent to a human being about 80 years old, everything is really about treating any symptoms to maintain quality of life for a few more weeks or months of happy todays x
 
PigglePuggle said:
Furoseminde is a diuretic, which helps clear excess fluid from the body- commonly used for piggies with less than optimal heart function, and/or fluid on the lungs- the dose sounds appropriate.
Enalapil is an ACE inhibitor, medicine to reduce blood pressure- not heard of its use in guinea pigs, but it is used in dogs.

These medicines may help support some of the symptoms of heart failure and buy your old girl a bit more time- once piggies get to 6 years old, which is equivalent to a human being about 80 years old, everything is really about treating any symptoms to maintain quality of life for a few more weeks or months of happy todays x
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Thank you, @PigglePuggle .

I've not heard about enalapil before and wasn't sure whether the furosemide dosage was OK as I was I given tablets I had to chop up the couple of times suspected heart piggies had them as a tester years ago. Medications and dosages is not my area outside the usual stuff.

With heart meds in piggies, you generally see a very improvement or none at all.
 
Thanks! Well, I am hoping it all can give her some relief. The vet did tell me it might be ~a week or more potentially to see an effect from the diuretic on her fluid and ultimately on her crackly breathing. So far she seems "stable"- has not gotten worse and appetite is decent but still has the same crackle. Poops are ok but a little small/dark sometimes. She does seem to be drinking more (from the diuretic) which is good.
 
Also I was curious if there is any expectation of some slight weight loss if she is draining the fluids. For awhile (1 or 2 weeks) before this she was holding at around 770-780 grams. Then she started gaining weight to around 790 prior to the crackling starting and the recent diagnosis. Now I am noticing her back down in the 770s again. Not sure if this is a sign she is losing weight a little generally again or a good sign that maybe some of that liquid is draining. (And thus maybe it was partially artificial weight gain in the first place).
 
Thought I would give a little update on Margaret.

She has been on her heart medicines for about 10 days now. Thankfully, and I'll admit somewhat to my surprise, her crackling in her breathing stopped around last Sunday (after a week on the medicines). I know this could be temporary but she seems to be in much better spirits. Still on all of her medicines and some syringe feeding, but she has started squeaking (in a good way) a little again and comes out to eat on her own pretty well. The only issue is her weight, which was up around the time of her starting this medication (albeit maybe due to a bad reason-- the fluid buildup), is slowly ticking down again. But I am very pleased with how she is doing at the moment.

She is also still having that lopsidedness and might be having some slight trouble with her back left leg. She can still walk fairly briskly when she needs to and stands up on her hindlegs while I am prepping her veggies sometimes, but I also notice that if she is lying down her left leg is quite folded under her, almost crumpled, and she sometimes stumbles/has a hard time getting up from it. Nothing was noted on her xrays so this might just be something she has to deal with. Her poops have generally been ok but occasionally, maybe once or twice a week, she makes some messy soft ones and I have to clean her hands or bottom. I have someone else coming to visit for the weekend and while I of course will keep her on her routine, I hope having another person around won't throw her off.
 
"Squeaking in a good way..." 💕
She's a lucky girl to have such a devoted owner. It's interesting with visitors - mine generally hide at first and then make up their minds. They were very wary of my lovely neighbour with piggie experience who was actually looking after them but my friend who dropped in recently - and who they've never seen before - well they seemed to think she must have pockets full of veg!
 
Wanted to let you all know some bad news. Margaret was doing fairly well on her heart medications for a few weeks and, despite being on a lot of medicine and syringe food, had a pretty good few weeks. But her condition started to decline the last few days, chest filled up with a lot of fluid again and she started having trouble breathing and a lot of pain when moved. So yesterday I had to make the difficult decision to let her go.

It was a long and difficult struggle but I was always happy whenever she seemed to be rallying from one thing or another. I am still haunted by the events of yesterday but I could hear her pain and saw her condition just worsening quickly. She was my longest lived pig and probably the closest I have ever been to a pet.

I wanted to thank everyone here on the forum for the advice which helped us along and for listening to my anxious, late night posts about her condition.
 
I'm so sorry to hear your news. It is inevitable, but we just never know when things are going to turn downhill. Margaret was able to make the best of her end of life situation thanks to your tender care You gave her your all, and that's all you could give. She knew she was loved 💕
Take care of yourself x
 
Thanks, everyone. I hope that the info in this thread on everything she went through will be helpful to future piggies and pig owners.
 
You have been such an example of a devoted owner caring for a much loved piggy as she came to the end of her long life.
What a wonderful legacy x
 
I’m so sorry Margaret had to go over the bridge. I bet she’s popcorning high, pain free, remembering how loved she was. ❤️
 
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