Pets at Home.
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S
sonya
i have a few near me too...i ALWAYS go to the smaller pet shops and give them my business as they are both make sure the animals are well cared for and started thier businesess because they are genuine animal lovers ...
i have a nice small pet shop near me who care for their animals, they have rabbits and guinea pigs together but they advise everyone not to but they don't have enough room for 4 huge pens, cos they have male and female (they actually sex them right!)
N
neep_neep
Perhaps because PetSmart isn't even in this country any more?
C
Cavy Crazy
Neep neep I don't think sarcasim like that is called for, you know what Sonya means.
First of all the college I attended made it quite clear that rabbits and guinea pigs should not live together (they also made sure their females and males were properly sexed and separated). Secondly many of these books are outdated and when they were written it was believed to be alright keeping these two species together, however, since many of these books have been written the health and safety issues have been brought to the surface. As for the vets the handful I know advise against keeping rabbits and guinea pigs together and the vets you are on about that don't advise this I think you will find they don't have that much knowledge of keeping, caring or treating either of the species. Fourthly it does matter if it takes a little while, a month, two months fine but a year or more is way unacceptable. Last but not least, you are probably right about people finding something to complain about rescues, however, if pets at home wasn't in business there wouldn't be a need for these rescues. On that note does this mean pets at home won't be selling animals anymore? ? :
neep_neep said:As do plenty of books on the subject, many animal care college courses, and even vets! I told a woman she could NOT keep them together, and she basically called me stupid because her "vet said that they would be fine, I think he's a bit more qualified than YOU" 98)
When all this 'official' literature is floating about saying it's ok...well, what are people supposed to believe?
To be quite frank, does it matter that it takes a little while? It's actually HAPPENING, which is more than can be said for many *many* other places. My hope is that they will start taking note if the major chain sets an example.
Though i'm sure that even when stores direct customers to rescues, people will still find something to complain about ;D
I won't try and convince you about the whole rescue thing, you probably don't want to hear it, so i'll just let you believe it when you see it. Easiest way all round
First of all the college I attended made it quite clear that rabbits and guinea pigs should not live together (they also made sure their females and males were properly sexed and separated). Secondly many of these books are outdated and when they were written it was believed to be alright keeping these two species together, however, since many of these books have been written the health and safety issues have been brought to the surface. As for the vets the handful I know advise against keeping rabbits and guinea pigs together and the vets you are on about that don't advise this I think you will find they don't have that much knowledge of keeping, caring or treating either of the species. Fourthly it does matter if it takes a little while, a month, two months fine but a year or more is way unacceptable. Last but not least, you are probably right about people finding something to complain about rescues, however, if pets at home wasn't in business there wouldn't be a need for these rescues. On that note does this mean pets at home won't be selling animals anymore? ? :
G
Guinea-Tia-Flossie
It's the staff that really p*ss me off! I've only told one person this as i thought it was too gross for the forum but now the subject has come up i may as well share
Last time i went into P@H i saw some very cute gerbils. I stood and watched them for a minute before i realised that 3 gerbils were huddled over a dead one! My friend went to go and get a member of staff to tell them, and while he'd gone i noticed that the 3 gerbils were actually grooming the dead one. I thought ''aw that's sweet'' until the grooming started to become a bit rough. When the member of staff came back, i told him the gerbil that was dead looked like the other 3 were eating him! He pulled the other 3 gerbils off to reveal a half eaten gerbil! It was the grossest thing I've ever seen. What if a young child discovered that?
That day i can guarantee there were at least 8 staff on the shop floor, 3 of which were standing chatting at the tills. How long could this gerbil have been dead, when it was stiff and half eaten? At least an hour or two i reckon and it's a disgrace they didn't notice!
It's a reccuring thing on here i have noticed, that member of the public notices sick, dead or injured animals before the staff do....WHY? ? ?
Last time i went into P@H i saw some very cute gerbils. I stood and watched them for a minute before i realised that 3 gerbils were huddled over a dead one! My friend went to go and get a member of staff to tell them, and while he'd gone i noticed that the 3 gerbils were actually grooming the dead one. I thought ''aw that's sweet'' until the grooming started to become a bit rough. When the member of staff came back, i told him the gerbil that was dead looked like the other 3 were eating him! He pulled the other 3 gerbils off to reveal a half eaten gerbil! It was the grossest thing I've ever seen. What if a young child discovered that?
That day i can guarantee there were at least 8 staff on the shop floor, 3 of which were standing chatting at the tills. How long could this gerbil have been dead, when it was stiff and half eaten? At least an hour or two i reckon and it's a disgrace they didn't notice!
It's a reccuring thing on here i have noticed, that member of the public notices sick, dead or injured animals before the staff do....WHY? ? ?
Ive done that before,told them they have dead fish in their tanks and all they seemed interested in was chatting among themselves
at one time there must have been 7 of them just standing talking and various times when Ive looked for someone to ask about something,the only person i found was one guy on the tills >
at one time there must have been 7 of them just standing talking and various times when Ive looked for someone to ask about something,the only person i found was one guy on the tills >
C
Cavy Crazy
That is horrible Guinea-Tia-Flossie, it has made my sick crawl. The store should be a shamed of itself. :'( :tickedoff: Like Puggies Rule I have seen quite a few dead fish in my store, but a dead small mamal or bird never. :tickedoff: I feel quite lucky now, as my local pets at home is not as bad as most of yours.
N
neep_neep
It wasn't supposed to be sarcasm, I was just stating a fact. It's incredibly difficult to shop somewhere no longer in the country, and many people seem to be under some impression that they are the same place, but just changed the name? The two companies are totally different, I would't judge Morrisons on what Safeway's used to sell or do!
Yes, YOUR college may have been right. Which is why you are a well-informed individual, who reads and writes on forums like these, because you know the right ways to look after your guinea pigs. However, my own course stated that rabbits and guineas are fine together, and of course everybody else who took and is currently taking the course will be told the same.
So clearly, these courses need to be updated and qualifications need to be brought into line with current thinking. Otherwise, like I said, people will just be rolling out with qualifications and reckon they know best, spreading mis-information further.
We, as consciencious guinea pig/rabbit people KNOW about all the health and safety issues. However, those people who get told by the 'qualified' shop keepers that bunnies and guineas are fine together, and are then sold an outdated book, will have no clue. There is a remote possibility that they may go on the internet looking for information, but it's not a given fact. Most people are quite happy with a book and a bit of advice, and don't feel the need to seek further information on the off-chance that the book may be wrong.
Again, vets can be hit and miss just like college courses...like you said, there are plenty who do not specialise in small animals and are cat and dog focused, or perhaps they qualified in their small animal training many years ago and so were taught that they are ok together. So again, it's all about education and bringing things up to date.
Which is what P@H are trying to do - bring information up to date and make it widely available to the public. Free care leaflets which say that they shouldn't be kept together, spending an absolute fortune on refitting over 150 stores to make sure that they get separated.
I still don't understand why it *ultimately* matters how long it takes. It's getting done, and to me, that's all that matters.
Sadly, sadly untrue If only things were that simple.
Totally agree with Guinea-Tia-Flossie, it's the staff that really irritate me too. They have a job to do, which certainly does NOT involve standing around chatting! I hate the fact that people can claim in an interview that they are animal lovers etc., but when they actually get the job they're just useless :tickedoff:
Yes, YOUR college may have been right. Which is why you are a well-informed individual, who reads and writes on forums like these, because you know the right ways to look after your guinea pigs. However, my own course stated that rabbits and guineas are fine together, and of course everybody else who took and is currently taking the course will be told the same.
So clearly, these courses need to be updated and qualifications need to be brought into line with current thinking. Otherwise, like I said, people will just be rolling out with qualifications and reckon they know best, spreading mis-information further.
We, as consciencious guinea pig/rabbit people KNOW about all the health and safety issues. However, those people who get told by the 'qualified' shop keepers that bunnies and guineas are fine together, and are then sold an outdated book, will have no clue. There is a remote possibility that they may go on the internet looking for information, but it's not a given fact. Most people are quite happy with a book and a bit of advice, and don't feel the need to seek further information on the off-chance that the book may be wrong.
Again, vets can be hit and miss just like college courses...like you said, there are plenty who do not specialise in small animals and are cat and dog focused, or perhaps they qualified in their small animal training many years ago and so were taught that they are ok together. So again, it's all about education and bringing things up to date.
Which is what P@H are trying to do - bring information up to date and make it widely available to the public. Free care leaflets which say that they shouldn't be kept together, spending an absolute fortune on refitting over 150 stores to make sure that they get separated.
I still don't understand why it *ultimately* matters how long it takes. It's getting done, and to me, that's all that matters.
Sadly, sadly untrue
If only things were that simple.Totally agree with Guinea-Tia-Flossie, it's the staff that really irritate me too. They have a job to do, which certainly does NOT involve standing around chatting! I hate the fact that people can claim in an interview that they are animal lovers etc., but when they actually get the job they're just useless :tickedoff:
C
Cavy Crazy
neep_neep said:
Sadly, sadly untrue
So why are guineas and rabbits in rescues? ? Go and ask all the rescues how many of their cases have been down to pets at home. How many animals they have in their rescues due to incorrect sexing. How can you protect such a corrupt company, I am so ashamed to say I shop at pets at home but they ran all the little stores out of business, so I have no choice. Oh and why are there half eaten gerbils in the stores ( sorry Guinea-Tia-Flossie had to bring it up)? :tickedoff:
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smiler
Thats is sooo horrible :'( :tickedoff:
I stand by the point 'why do they have to sell animals'?? :tickedoff: :tickedoff:
I know some people feel a misplaced loyalty to where they work, but i wouldnt work at p@h for anything
And all the people in my p@h are very simple and can barely string a sentance together...i went in there for a collar for my patterdale terrier when he was a baby and they didnt seem to sell collars small enough so i wandered rouund the shop until i found someone that worked there and asked if they had a collar smaller than the ones on display or what was the smallest one they sell....he then put his hand round my puppies neck to check the size ? and then ran around the shop trying to find a colleague to show his hand to ? :
I was less than impressed! 98)
so you are saying they tell customers to do something they cant even pull their finger out and do themselves!
My oh is a sales manager for one of the biggest print companies in the uk and he just told me them 'spending a fortune' is a load of bullsh*t it will cost them jack to produce them because of the bulk they are brought in and the print package they use.
If you are going to keep animals on such a large scale as pets at home, you would hope they would do more then ask someone and read a book :
And the amount they charge...the units for keeping the animals in is nothing! :tickedoff:
And the small pet stores (3 of them) near me are 100% more educated and caring than pets at home could ever be! Oh well done pets at home, you are thinking about seperating rabbits and guineas that all the other pet shops have done months ago, congratulations :
:'( :tickedoff:I stand by the point 'why do they have to sell animals'?? :tickedoff: :tickedoff:
I know some people feel a misplaced loyalty to where they work, but i wouldnt work at p@h for anything
And all the people in my p@h are very simple and can barely string a sentance together...i went in there for a collar for my patterdale terrier when he was a baby and they didnt seem to sell collars small enough so i wandered rouund the shop until i found someone that worked there and asked if they had a collar smaller than the ones on display or what was the smallest one they sell....he then put his hand round my puppies neck to check the size ? and then ran around the shop trying to find a colleague to show his hand to ? :
I was less than impressed! 98)
so you are saying they tell customers to do something they cant even pull their finger out and do themselves!
My oh is a sales manager for one of the biggest print companies in the uk and he just told me them 'spending a fortune' is a load of bullsh*t it will cost them jack to produce them because of the bulk they are brought in and the print package they use.
If you are going to keep animals on such a large scale as pets at home, you would hope they would do more then ask someone and read a book :
And the amount they charge...the units for keeping the animals in is nothing! :tickedoff:
And the small pet stores (3 of them) near me are 100% more educated and caring than pets at home could ever be! Oh well done pets at home, you are thinking about seperating rabbits and guineas that all the other pet shops have done months ago, congratulations :
Niki
Senior Guinea Pig
Oh well done pets at home, you are thinking about seperating rabbits and guineas that all the other pet shops have done months ago, congratulations
Sadly this isn't the case where i live in Leeds, there are 2 petshops both owned by the same person but run by different managers. In his big store the rabbits & piggies are kept separately in quite big enclosures but his original smaller store has them in together in small glass tanks - can't be much bigger than 15" wide x 18" long :o I go in periodically just to see if they've improved & i have asked different members of staff why they're together & in such small spaces when their other store has them housed differently.
I've been told "it's the manager" "they can live together" "they're fine in that amount of space" When i've challenged them i've been told "if you don't like, don't come in" >
Sadly this isn't the case where i live in Leeds, there are 2 petshops both owned by the same person but run by different managers. In his big store the rabbits & piggies are kept separately in quite big enclosures but his original smaller store has them in together in small glass tanks - can't be much bigger than 15" wide x 18" long :o I go in periodically just to see if they've improved & i have asked different members of staff why they're together & in such small spaces when their other store has them housed differently.
I've been told "it's the manager" "they can live together" "they're fine in that amount of space" When i've challenged them i've been told "if you don't like, don't come in" >
N
neep_neep
Perhaps ask how many *aren't* down to pets at home. There are plenty, WORSE small pet shops around, plus all those folk who fancy a stab at breeding cute little bunnies but then can't cope when they become over-run.
Corrupt? Are you joking? How is it 'corrupt'? Sorry, but that sentence makes no sense at all. I blame the sh!t staff for mis-sexing, not the company.
You'll find that they ARE 'pulling their finger out' and doing it themselves....as has been stated repeatedly.
If you read what I said, I was actually referring to spending a fortune on replacing all the rabbit and guinea pig runs and small animal cages.
If you are going to keep animals on such a large scale as pets at home, you would hope they would do more then ask someone and read a book :
I was referring to customers of OTHER pet shops :
Pets at home speaks with places such as the RWA and Cavyrescue to get their input.
Oh well done pets at home, you are thinking about seperating rabbits and guineas that all the other pet shops have done months ago, congratulations :
Well done to your shops, but every single one local to me still keeps theirs together. So hardly 'all' :
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our PAH opened in feb and I cannot fault them to be honest so maybe I have the new style store that the older ones are being upgraded to , I do not shop in PAH but keep an eye on it as I have heard the storys from on here, I use my small pet shop that is 100% perfect I would defy anyone to find fault with it, the owner keeps any pigs or rabbits that do not sell once they are 20 weeks, all animals have vet care any ill or ill looking are never sold all are sexed correctly they have hugh runs for all animals, it is run by a big animal lover
we have spoken in depth she only gets her animals from people like me never breeders going to the main land to do so, she is everything your PAH isn't, BUT we do agree that changes for anything never happens overnight, animals have been sold in pet shops for donkeys years dogs and cats have been stopped being sold in pet shops but that took years unlike us lot on here, people do not compare guineas and rabbits etc the same as dogs (shame but true) it will happen but in its own time I do believe the new laws to protect animals will eventually end sellling of animals in shops , no amount of bitching will stop it now, the staff in our local PAH seem friendly I told one yesterday the pigs needed more hay which she did so, so not every story is the same, and as for the dead gerbil I would have written to my local paper about that shaming them, as well as getting the RSPCA involved, the end of animals being sold in pet shops is coming but have you not thought that then there will be piggy farms like puppy farms springing up, theres if and buts and reasons for and against, and as much as I hate the selling of animals in pet shops its going to happen for a while yet so maybe we should be getting them reported and use the new laws to protect the ones that are being sold, if i had seen something bad yesterday my nextstop would have been the RSPCA and trading standards
we have spoken in depth she only gets her animals from people like me never breeders going to the main land to do so, she is everything your PAH isn't, BUT we do agree that changes for anything never happens overnight, animals have been sold in pet shops for donkeys years dogs and cats have been stopped being sold in pet shops but that took years unlike us lot on here, people do not compare guineas and rabbits etc the same as dogs (shame but true) it will happen but in its own time I do believe the new laws to protect animals will eventually end sellling of animals in shops , no amount of bitching will stop it now, the staff in our local PAH seem friendly I told one yesterday the pigs needed more hay which she did so, so not every story is the same, and as for the dead gerbil I would have written to my local paper about that shaming them, as well as getting the RSPCA involved, the end of animals being sold in pet shops is coming but have you not thought that then there will be piggy farms like puppy farms springing up, theres if and buts and reasons for and against, and as much as I hate the selling of animals in pet shops its going to happen for a while yet so maybe we should be getting them reported and use the new laws to protect the ones that are being sold, if i had seen something bad yesterday my nextstop would have been the RSPCA and trading standards
C
Cavy Crazy
neep_neep said:
I'm sorry I thought the stores employed these people? ?
S
smiler
Pets at homes usp is that the staff are supposed to be educated animal lovers
They have the money and the resorces to get it done NOW and they arent! It could all be done by 2 or 3 weeks time...dont try and tell me it cant be, i can get you some quotes for the exact thing they use if you like! I'm not stupid, ive worked in buying for a construction company and the amount of places there are to outsorce to is amazing!
If they speak with places lke cavy rescue they would understand how urgent it is they sort themselves out! I would be interested to see if they have actually spoken to them as i very much doubt it! :
And if all small pet shops dont do it...fair enough thats bad, but as you keep saying p@h have 150 stores, so the finance, suppsed education and the time is all readily available unlike some of the pet stores that may not have the money, space or education pets at home claim to have, and after pets at home comes in and pushes them out of business I'm not suprised they cant afford it!
And the company are responsible for the staff they employ...if they cant even be bothered to make sure the staff know what they are doing, what does that say about the sh*t state of p@h? hahaha CC sooo true!
They have the money and the resorces to get it done NOW and they arent! It could all be done by 2 or 3 weeks time...dont try and tell me it cant be, i can get you some quotes for the exact thing they use if you like! I'm not stupid, ive worked in buying for a construction company and the amount of places there are to outsorce to is amazing!
If they speak with places lke cavy rescue they would understand how urgent it is they sort themselves out! I would be interested to see if they have actually spoken to them as i very much doubt it! :
And if all small pet shops dont do it...fair enough thats bad, but as you keep saying p@h have 150 stores, so the finance, suppsed education and the time is all readily available unlike some of the pet stores that may not have the money, space or education pets at home claim to have, and after pets at home comes in and pushes them out of business I'm not suprised they cant afford it!
And the company are responsible for the staff they employ...if they cant even be bothered to make sure the staff know what they are doing, what does that say about the sh*t state of p@h? hahaha CC sooo true!
N
neep_neep
Believe it or not, somebody could have a flawless interview, claim that they've had pets for years, love animals etc. We all try our best in interviews, so it's not a far-fetched scenario.
But it's only when people are hired and actually working do you know whether they are useless or not. It makes absolutely No business sense whatsoever to hire useless people deliberately ;D
Unfortunately, with all these rules and regulations nowadays, you can't just fire someone for being 'useless'. Which, I agree, is a damned shame!
I've had the misfortune to work with members of staff who got the job and then just didn't want to learn. 98) Complete imbeciles. But the managers thought they were doing the right thing because they'd kept pets, reckoned they loved animals etc...
Unfortunately there are still shops that do
It's not even illegal Why don't you give Stella a ring, i'm sure she'll let you know the details.
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smiler
I was refering the the missexing....it either has a penis or it doesnt....its taught once...badda boom..but they still get it wrong more than half the time. harry probably got every girl in his pen pregnant, all of them way too early because someone is incapable of even seperating the sexes! ?
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I have not seen dog and cats sold in pet shops for many years and I did believe it was illegal, still do, and agree people who take jobs then dont follow their training and learn and then use this information for the company should be dismissed.
N
neep_neep
Yep, I absolutely 100% agree with you! I really don't understand how it is physically possible to mis-sex guinea pigs ;D And the other animals too. It really is just laziness or stupidity, I don't know which, and I don't understand the mindset of these people. 98)
G
Guinea-Tia-Flossie
Michellemuffin♥ said:
I'm not sure whether it's illegal to sell dogs, but i don't think it is for cats. I've seen many kittens in a certain pet shop not long ago. He always has a board up outside his shop saying ''Kittens Sold Here''
C
Cavy Crazy
This is getting ridiculous now, we are just going to go round in circles. This is a friendly forum and I hope it will stay that way. Neep neep I could give a list of rescues that are full of animals down to pets at home but what is the point you won't want to listen, same as I don't won't to listen to how pets at home is going to improve their stores, they should have done this a couple of years ago. Many members feel the exact same way as I do and just because a few of the stores are up to the standard they should be, the great majority are not and until they are/ have done what you are saying they will do I will see pets at home just being in the animal business for profit, nothing more and nothing less. End of topic, I think we have all said enough and I for one am not going to reply anymore to this thread, just in case I say something I regret.
S
sonya
neep-neep......PAHbrought out petsmart in the uk..so i thought as the shop in south wales i was working in was petsmart one week.....the following week i passed in was PAH....on the outside and all the advertising but still exactly the same inside with all the same emplyees.......
http://www.ukbusinesspark.co.uk/petsmart.htm see this link....
http://www.ukbusinesspark.co.uk/petsmart.htm see this link....
S
smiler
I agree with you cc...i am trying very hard not to say anything *bad*
I was just thinking, if they must have animals why dont they JUST have rescue animals...then i remembered...if they did that they couldnt make a profit :
I'm just going to try so hard not to say anything more as its pointless, i feel very strongly about this and some promise of a change sometime in the future but not sure when : is lame and I'm bored of that being the only 'defense
p@h should not sell animals!
I was just thinking, if they must have animals why dont they JUST have rescue animals...then i remembered...if they did that they couldnt make a profit :
I'm just going to try so hard not to say anything more as its pointless, i feel very strongly about this and some promise of a change sometime in the future but not sure when :
is lame and I'm bored of that being the only 'defensep@h should not sell animals!
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Crazy cavy I agree its getting crazy but you along with others must accept everyone has their own opinion and just because it does not go along with yours does not make it wrong, PAH always starts arguments some for and against , personally I can see they are a business and to them that is what matters, thats one side but to us its a place where animals are often suffering but at least they are changing and as said change is good, you cannot wave a magic wand and pow its all gone away in the real world it just doesn't happen, change takes time which PAH are doing as long as they are heading in the right directon and as I have seen proof in my local store things are improving nothing you say will change PAH for the time being , so please agree to disagree, we all have our own opinons and a good forum respects that, which this one does and if kittens are being sold I think I would ring up trading standards and RSPCA to check it out as I am sure both cats and dogs cannot be sold in shops its got be nearly 15 years plus that I have seen this happen hubby agrees.
C
Cavy Crazy
Totally agree Smiler, I just want the topic to be put to rest now as we all feel differently. Who started this topic off? > Only joking it's a good topic we all know how we feel now.
Michellemuffin I have said understand it will take time but the time they are taking the stores won't be sorted in my lifetime. I understand everyone has different opinions and I am not saying my opinion is right that is why I want to end the topic. Like I have said I'm not going to waste my time going round in circles.
Only joking it's a good topic we all know how we feel now. Michellemuffin I have said understand it will take time but the time they are taking the stores won't be sorted in my lifetime. I understand everyone has different opinions and I am not saying my opinion is right that is why I want to end the topic. Like I have said I'm not going to waste my time going round in circles.
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