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Wet and Swollen bottom

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GuineaGang96

Junior Guinea Pig
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Hi All,

I have just been to my vets as my Peggy (3.5 years) had a really wet bottom that was also swollen, and in all honesty smells pretty bad.

She is doing really well in herself, eating, running around freely and standing on her back legs when veg comes through.

The vet pretty much narrowed it down to either a UTI or kidney failure, and gave me two options of a round of Baytrill to target the potential infection, or we take blood test where we would have to have local anaesthetic. Wishing to avoid additional stress when she is currently doing really well, I agreed to give her antibiotics and come back if no signs of improvement.

The vet gave me enough for roughly 4 days of Baytrill, however since getting back and reading up on this, it would seem atleast 10 days are needed to see if things clear up (Assuming she doesn't get worse)

I just wanted to get other people's thoughts as this wasn't my usual vet, and I am a bit sceptical.
 
So sorry to hear this, is there any crying while weeing?
 
sport_billy said:
So sorry to hear this, is there any crying while weeing?
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Not that I have noticed no. I have noticed she is not pooing well though.

I will monitor her behaviour over next few days whilst giving her medication, if signs of improvement I will ask for another 5 days of antibiotic. If no improvement/deterioration I will take her back and get further tests.

She has improved a lot from yesterday evening when I first noticed, and is fully herself today and this evening.
 
Sorry to bump this post up again, I was just looking for some further advice and thought it would be useful to have the above context .

Peggy SEEMS to be doing really well. No signs of pain and running about freely. She is eating as much as her sisters and doesn't seems to be drinking any more than usual.

I was slightly concerned last night as she looked quite fuzzy and seemed a bit more hidden, but this lasted about 10 minutes and then she was back to normal so may have been overthinking.

My main concern is her backside area still looks swollen, and is still a bit damp (Although significantly dryer than when I first noticed an issue with her when she was soaked all down the back of her legs aswell)

I was just looking to get people's opinions on whether I should take her back to the vets for further tests if no signs of reduced swelling tomorrow morning, or should I wait a couple of days longer to see if the antibiotics take effect?

Money is tight, and the vets is expensive, so I would like to avoid any unnecessary trips if the antibiotics need more time, but I will of course do what is best for Peggy!
 
I'm sorry to hear this.

I would go back to the vet if the swelling is still there. Antibiotics start working within a few days but four days isn’t a very long course if there is an infection - they would just get to work and then suddenly the course ends which would allow any bacteria present to take off again.

Have you switched from the routine weekly weight checks and are instead weighing her daily (each morning) so you can monitor that she is indeed still eating enough hay (hay intake can’t be gauged by eye).

Is she pooping any better?
Is she urinating freely or is it dribbling out?

I hope she is ok
 
Piggies&buns said:
I'm sorry to hear this.

I would go back to the vet if the swelling is still there. Antibiotics start working within a few days but four days isn’t a very long course if there is an infection - they would just get to work and then suddenly the course ends which would allow any bacteria present to take off again.

Have you switched from the routine weekly weight checks and are instead weighing her daily (each morning) so you can monitor that she is indeed still eating enough hay (hay intake can’t be gauged by eye).

Is she pooping any better?
Is she urinating freely or is it dribbling out?

I hope she is ok
Click to expand...
I have been daily weighing and no drop in weight (No difference bigger than 30 grams each day and not dropping consecutive days). I will weight her tomorrow morning and asses her and if reduction in the swelling I will ask for an appointment). If there was a significant reduction in swelling tomorrow, I will ask for 5 more days of antibiotics to finish a 10 day course.

Pooping is much better, as is her weeing from what I have seen, though my pigs have an annoying habit of weeing in their hay tray so it is difficult to see at times.

Thank you for your message and wishes. It's reassuring to get a second opinion and make sure I am doing what is best by her. I knew deep down she probably needed to go, I am just worried about getting bad news. I rescued her when she was little after she had been badly attacked by another guinea pig and she does seem to be a little bit less robust than the others.
 
Skipped a stage and just booked Peggy in with my favourite vet at 9am tomorrow morning.

I gave her another weigh and she’s same as this morning, but I just can’t see a major change happening overnight so thought it best to get her in sooner rather than later.
 
I’m glad you’ve got her booked in.

Best to only weigh once a day (in the morning) - weighing twice a day just picks up unhelpful fluctuations and the days food so isn’t a true reflection

Let us know how you get on tomorrow. I hope she is ok
 
Semi-positive update (I think): Took Peggy to the vets and we agreed to get her in for an X-ray and ultrasound today as suspected it may be a kidney stone.

I have just had a call from the vets to explain it is a kidney stone, however the slightly positive news is this is 2x3 mm, and has moved to the urethra, so there is hope that, with some additional pain killers, she should be able to pass the stone by herself.

The worry of course is the stone blocks the urethra stopping her weeing, in which case I am aware I need to get her to the vets immediately as this is life threatening (And painful from what I have read online).

Any hints/tips for looking after a Guinea pig with bladder stones would be really appreciate, as I want to do everything I can to make sure she is as comfortable as possible, and reduce any chance of her getting blocked and needing surgery.

I am half tempted to isolate her for a few days and move her in to my home office whilst I work so I can make sure she is weeing, and hear any possible crying she may make when weeing.
 
I’m sorry to hear that.
I did wonder, when you said she was swollen, whether a stone was going to be a possibility.

I would not advise you to isolate her - she needs to stay with her friend at all times, so if you want her in your office for closer monitoring, then they both need to go together.
Separating them causes stress which won’t help her recovery, and it can, in some cases, permanently destroy the bond and mean they refuse to go back together again.

It would be a good idea to review her diet - check you are not overfeeding pellets (which are a major factor) or feeding too many high calcium/oxalate veggies.

I have added a guide below which will help further

I hope she is ok

Wiebke's Guide to Pees and Stones
 
Piggies&buns said:
I’m sorry to hear that.
I did wonder, when you said she was swollen, whether a stone was going to be a possibility.

I would not advise you to isolate her - she needs to stay with her friend at all times, so if you want her in your office for closer monitoring, then they both need to go together.
Separating them causes stress which won’t help her recovery, and it can, in some cases, permanently destroy the bond and mean they refuse to go back together again.

It would be a good idea to review her diet - check you are not overfeeding pellets or feeding too many high calcium/oxalate veggies.

I have added a guide below which will help further

I hope she is ok

Wiebke's Guide to Pees and Stones
Click to expand...
Thanks again for your response.

Upon further reading, I realise this prognosis was not as positive as I thought, but atleast I know what I need to monitor for.

Completely appreciate your point regarding not isolating her, I will just work in their room to keep a close eye and make sure she is weeing. Unfortunately all three of them won't fit in my home office as their hutch has taken up the majority of the bigger spare room.

Funnily enough I posted recently as I was concerned I was feeding to much veg, and this issue has occurred since cutting down on this (I know this is likely a coincidence as I am following the guide on hear for feeding Hay/Veg/Pellets now)

Thank you for the guide, I am going to bring her home now back to her sisters and will give it a good read after to make sure I give her the best chance.
 
It’s about finding a balance in the diet.

I personally feed my piggies more than one cup of veg per day and in summer they are on grass all day (they’re actually getting a bit of grazing time on the lawn now) but I don’t feed pellets.

Sending best wishes
 
Piggies&buns said:
It’s about finding a balance in the diet.

I personally feed my piggies more than one cup of veg per day and in summer they are on grass all day (they’re actually getting a bit of grazing time on the lawn now) but I don’t feed pellets.

Sending best wishes
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Reading that follow up thread, I think I am going to cut down on the pellets even more now it is the summer and they will be on grass daily. I am feeding a cup of veg a day per pig (Cucumber, Romaine or Mixed lettuce leaves, pepper) and they get a handful of grass a day now.

Mowed the lawn this weekend so they will be back out on the weekend when it has had a few days to grow.
 
Update: Peggy is still struggling a bit (To be expected)

95% of the time she seems fully herself. She is still weeing regularly (though still getting on herself) and no crying.

She seems more uncomfortable today as I have noticed her hunched up at times, though still running around and no loss of appetite.

She is currently taking the following medication:
- Meloxicam: 0.26ml twice daily.
- Gabapentin: 0.08ml twice daily.
- Catease: Half a pill daily.

I was just wondering if there is anything else I can be doing to help her if she is uncomfortable i.e. increase the amount of meloxicam, and if I should be syringing a few ml of water to try and help flush the stone, though she is drinking a good amount independently.
 
GuineaGang96 said:
Update: Peggy is still struggling a bit (To be expected)

95% of the time she seems fully herself. She is still weeing regularly (though still getting on herself) and no crying.

She seems more uncomfortable today as I have noticed her hunched up at times, though still running around and no loss of appetite.

She is currently taking the following medication:
- Meloxicam: 0.26ml twice daily.
- Gabapentin: 0.08ml twice daily.
- Catease: Half a pill daily.

I was just wondering if there is anything else I can be doing to help her if she is uncomfortable i.e. increase the amount of meloxicam, and if I should be syringing a few ml of water to try and help flush the stone, though she is drinking a good amount independently.
Click to expand...
Peggy is making a mockery of me and has been herself ever since this post. I will continue to monitor her (I have set up my home office in their room) and if any more concerns I will contact my vet.
 
GuineaGang96 said:
Peggy is making a mockery of me and has been herself ever since this post. I will continue to monitor her (I have set up my home office in their room) and if any more concerns I will contact my vet.
Click to expand...

Just keep on monitoring and contact your vet if there is a real and noticeable deterioration.

Is your meloxicam 0.5 mg/ml (cat strength) or 1.5 mg/ml (dog strength)? Meloxicam comes in either version but the dog one is three times stronger than the cat one, so it makes quite a difference.

There is not a lot else you can do. If there are problems with stones or sludge, you could ask your vet to consider frusol (furosemide). This is a diuretic that causes bigger/stronger pees to flush the bladder so there is less material and fewer bacteria hanging around in the bladder for the formation of more stones or sludge.
A guinea pig sanctuary working with one the of UK vets most experienced with guinea pigs has had this prescribed and reports that they have never had a recurrence of stones since then, especially not in the critical weeks after a stone removal before any diet changes can come through the system.
Bladderstone - best diet quick fix

Please do not squirt any water into your piggy's mouth. Over-hydration can kill.
What you can do at this time of year, depending on whether you have access, is starting to add some fresh growing grass and dandelion to the diet; dandelion is mildly diuretic and encourages bigger pees as well; grass is high vitamin C and fluid. Please replace any pellets with fresh and dry forage.

Here are our tips on how to introduce safe fresh grass without causing potentially fatal diarrhea or bloating: Fresh Grass and Lawn Time - Tips for Avoiding Spring Time Deaths

I hope that this helps you? It can be difficult taking a step back again after a crisis without having some jitters.
 
Wiebke said:
Just keep on monitoring and contact your vet if there is a real and noticeable deterioration.

Is your meloxicam 0.5 mg/ml (cat strength) or 1.5 mg/ml (dog strength)? Meloxicam comes in either version but the dog one is three times stronger than the cat one, so it makes quite a difference.

There is not a lot else you can do. If there are problems with stones or sludge, you could ask your vet to consider frusol (furosemide). This is a diuretic that causes bigger/stronger pees to flush the bladder so there is less material and fewer bacteria hanging around in the bladder for the formation of more stones or sludge.
A guinea pig sanctuary working with one the of UK vets most experienced with guinea pigs has had this prescribed and reports that they have never had a recurrence of stones since then, especially not in the critical weeks after a stone removal before any diet changes can come through the system.
Bladderstone - best diet quick fix

Please do not squirt any water into your piggy's mouth. Over-hydration can kill.
What you can do at this time of year, depending on whether you have access, is starting to add some fresh growing grass and dandelion to the diet; dandelion is mildly diuretic and encourages bigger pees as well; grass is high vitamin C and fluid. Please replace any pellets with fresh and dry forage.

Here are our tips on how to introduce safe fresh grass without causing potentially fatal diarrhea or bloating: Fresh Grass and Lawn Time - Tips for Avoiding Spring Time Deaths

I hope that this helps you? It can be difficult taking a step back again after a crisis without having some jitters.
Click to expand...
Thank you for your response - I felt guilty after my update as I realised I should just be monitoring at this point and contacting the vets if I noticed her struggling or she doesn't wee regularly, and others may need the response more!

Meloxicam is 1.5mg dog strength.

It's very helpful to know there is no more I can be doing other than monitoring her and contacting the vets if any changes.

I was reading the link you have attached earlier as @Piggies&buns kindly attached this previously and it has had some really helpful information. Fortunately my Piggies diets match the diet recommendations due to previous help from this forum.

I have cut out Pellets and I have been feeding them grass daily. Will Add dandelion to that!

Mowed the lawn Saturday so just waiting for this to grow a bit longer as I am always wary on putting them on freshly cut gras (And making sure there's no mowed clippings) and also the weather to get a couple of degrees warmer. At the moment they get 2 hours a day free roaming and I give them hand cut grass.

I will try to refrain from posting again unless absolutely necessary :)
 
Please don't feel bad; you are not wasting our time. We have created a friendly and supportive place where we look after the stressed out owners as much as their piggies because that is important, too.

The more we as a community can support you in your worries and stress, the better you can look after your piggies. It is perfectly normal that your anxiety is hightened at this stage. You are actually in very good company on this forum because this is a place where everybody can and is welcome to talk about their concerns and will be taken seriously without having to fear ridicule. As a community, we help each other not just with guinea pig care but also each other as owners to get through the bad times and share the good ones. ;)
 
Thank you so much for your responses, it really is great to have somewhere to come to make sure you are doing the right thing, and the amount of advice I have had from the forum is invaluable.

Peggy has been doing really well since yesterday, to the point where I would have thought she had passed the stone if her bottom wasn't still swollen.
 
GuineaGang96 said:
Thank you so much for your responses, it really is great to have somewhere to come to make sure you are doing the right thing, and the amount of advice I have had from the forum is invaluable.

Peggy has been doing really well since yesterday, to the point where I would have thought she had passed the stone if her bottom wasn't still swollen.
Click to expand...

Have you checked whether the stone has fetched up just inside the muscle ring at the exit, like it usually does in sows with urethral stones? It feels hard under the skin just above the genitalia on the belly side.

This x-ray picture of my Teggy in 2020 (courtesy of my vet) shows this; Teggy's stone was about as large as could pass down the urethra and not cause a blockage. She was one of many piggies with a pandemic related bladder stone as a result of the shortages in low calcium veg at the start of the pandemic and during the first Lockdown; especially when you were told to shield. She was 5 years at the time but thankfully made a full recovery. :(

Teggy, urethral stone 2020.webp Teggy, urethral stone 2020 size.webp
 
Wiebke said:
Have you checked whether the stone has fetched up just inside the muscle ring at the exit, like it usually does in sows with urethral stones? It feels hard under the skin just above the genitalia on the belly side.

This x-ray picture of my Teggy in 2020 (courtesy of my vet) shows this; Teggy's stone was about as large as could pass down the urethra and not cause a blockage. She was one of many piggies with a pandemic related bladder stone as a result of the shortages in low calcium veg at the start of the pandemic and during the first Lockdown; especially when you were told to shield. She was 5 years at the time but thankfully made a full recovery. :(

View attachment 267608 View attachment 267607
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I haven't in all honesty, I am very nervous about handling her and causing any pain or even causing a block (This may not be rational, I am just a worrier!)

My partner is at work, however we are giving her a clean each evening around the area, so will have a little feel around - Is this something we should try help her pass, or take back to the vet if it we can feel the lump under the skin?

What a soldier Teggy was, that looks larger than 5mm which is what our vet said is the largest they would like her to pass naturally. Peggy's is approximately 3x2mm.

I have been so concerned about the stone getting stuck and stopping her weeing, however she is weeing today and her bum is no longer wet, so still no signs of blockage, and if Teggy was able to pass that, it gives me hope Peggy can do the same!
 
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Update:

Peggy has been really good the past couple of days, very little signs of pain, just the occasional hunching when she is napping in between eating and drinking water.

No crying pains when peeing, and her poops have gone back to normal this morning.

My one concern is she is still swollen on her genitals (I thought it was bum at first though I don’t think it is)

The vet gave medicine and said to go back in two weeks for a check up, or sooner if she deteriorates, but I just wanted to be sure I shouldn’t be taking her back sooner if she’s still swollen there?

At the moment I’ve been closely monitoring, and ready to call the vets if I see her laying in the same spot for a long time, not eating, not drinking and of course not peeing. Just want to make sure I’m doing the best for Peggy
 
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