Undecided!

Hi Guinea folk!
I wanted to thank you all for your advice and sharing your personal experiences.

I have now come to a final decision; *drum roll* The 2 bonded adult boars!
The lady who runs her small rescue set up has sent me some more updates and pics of them and I’m already smitten! They’re handled regularly and used to nail trims, so for a first time owner I think this is the best decision.
I’d love your opinion and constructive feedback regarding set-up;
I have a Midwest enclosure and have added a plastic tray (the storage ones you put under beds) which is almost the same size as the enclosure itself. It will be used as their “hay tray”. I calculated and it’s 3 square meters - which I realise is just short of the most ideal size for 2 boars, but once acclimatised they will get plenty of “roaming time”. Also originally I had a set up in the spare room which was bigger but in the current weather the upstairs room is far too hot atm, so they’ll be in the cooler living room. Btw I’ve since added a 2nd water bottle.
Question: should I get rid of the large wooden hide (fits 2) for now?
 

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How lovely!

Do be aware that roaming time does not count - their cage has to be big enough particularly for boars. Boars need 12 square feet (1.1 square metres)

All hides need to have two exits. So no, don’t get rid of the wooden hide but you do need to pull it away from the edge of the cage so they can move freely around it.
You don’t want any dead ends in the cage where boars are concerned as one piggy can become trapped and that is where potential issues can spark up.

It may be big enough for them to both be in but you can’t ever assume they will share - most won’t once they are settled and feel more secure. This is why there always needs to be two of everything.

You would remove the green plushy hide in the corner though as that only has one exit.

I would also recommend you remove the food bowl.
We don’t recommend the use of food bowls at all. It can cause food hogging issues and also removes their ability to forage - eating from a bowl is a rather mindless activity and is over in minutes. Instead scatter feed their veg and pellets into their hay piles to encourage foraging and preventing the dominant from being able to hog food.
 
Congratulations on your excellent choice, can't wait to see pictures.
Advice as above but I personally would cut down the edge of the storage tray to minimise the chances of them catching any dangley bits. Also add in some bath mats/pee pads to retain scent as your cage liner is full sized (I have those too, very cute), also adds comfort and can be changed more frequently so the main fleece lasts longer.
For giving more space, there are c&c grid sets on amazon for only about £20. For cosiness you can use cuddle cups, add some grids on top for attaching hammocks or get freestanding hammocks all are ideal to stop one boy getting cornered.
 
Piggies&buns said:
How lovely!

Do be aware that roaming time does not count - their cage has to be big enough particularly for boars. Boars need 12 square feet (1.1 square metres)

All hides need to have two exits. So no, don’t get rid of the wooden hide but you do need to pull it away from the edge of the cage so they can move freely around it.
You don’t want any dead ends in the cage where boars are concerned as one piggy can become trapped and that is where potential issues can spark up.

It may be big enough for them to both be in but you can’t ever assume they will share - most won’t once they are settled and feel more secure. This is why there always needs to be two of everything.

You would remove the green plushy hide in the corner though as that only has one exit.

I would also recommend you remove the food bowl.
We don’t recommend the use of food bowls at all. It can cause food hogging issues and also removes their ability to forage - eating from a bowl is a rather mindless activity and is over in minutes. Instead scatter feed their veg and pellets into their hay piles to encourage foraging and preventing the dominant from being able to hog food.
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Thanks! Some very good points that I’ll take onboard. I think what I’ll do it revise the set up a bit and change a few things around implementing the suggestions you’ve given.
Yeh, I wasn’t sure of the whole bowl thing tbh, but I was thinking of scattering veg anyway to encourage foraging.
 
Congratulations, good choice! I would take the hay tray out and just have hay in a pile on the floor. The tray won't save any mess, they just kick the hay everywhere anyway. Without the tray they will have more unobstructed running around room as the cage is a bit small. No tray also means less chance of one of them patrolling it and keeping the other one out, trays in my experience tend to make an extra territory.
 
fluffysal said:
Congratulations on your excellent choice, can't wait to see pictures.
Advice as above but I personally would cut down the edge of the storage tray to minimise the chances of them catching any dangley bits. Also add in some bath mats/pee pads to retain scent as your cage liner is full sized (I have those too, very cute), also adds comfort and can be changed more frequently so the main fleece lasts longer.
For giving more space, there are c&c grid sets on amazon for only about £20. For cosiness you can use cuddle cups, add some grids on top for attaching hammocks or get freestanding hammocks all are ideal to stop one boy getting cornered
Click to expand...

piggieminder said:
Congratulations, good choice! I would take the hay tray out and just have hay in a pile on the floor. The tray won't save any mess, they just kick the hay everywhere anyway. Without the tray they will have more unobstructed running around room as the cage is a bit small. No tray also means less chance of one of them patrolling it and keeping the other one out, trays in my experience tend to make an extra territory.
Click to expand...
Thanks! Oh that’s a good point about territorial guarding behaviour - not something I thought about when it came to the subject of hay trays tbh!
rattata said:
Hi Guinea folk!
I wanted to thank you all for your advice and sharing your personal experiences.

I have now come to a final decision; *drum roll* The 2 bonded adult boars!
The lady who runs her small rescue set up has sent me some more updates and pics of them and I’m already smitten! They’re handled regularly and used to nail trims, so for a first time owner I think this is the best decision.
I’d love your opinion and constructive feedback regarding set-up;
I have a Midwest enclosure and have added a plastic tray (the storage ones you put under beds) which is almost the same size as the enclosure itself. It will be used as their “hay tray”. I calculated and it’s 3 square meters - which I realise is just short of the most ideal size for 2 boars, but once acclimatised they will get plenty of “roaming time”. Also originally I had a set up in the spare room which was bigger but in the current weather the upstairs room is far too hot atm, so they’ll be in the cooler living room. Btw I’ve since added a 2nd water bottle.
Question: should I get rid of the large wooden hide (fits 2) for now?
Click to expand...
@Piggies&buns @piggieminder @fluffysal
I’ve updated the enclosure
 

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If you could remove the hay tray and expand that part of the cage out to meet the end of the Midwest (removing the grid between the two) to make one large square cage then then would be perfect for two boys.
It looks like you would need to get some plastic sheeting to protect the floor or a piece of correx of course
 
Piggies&buns said:
If you could remove the hay tray and expand that part of the cage out to meet the end of the Midwest (removing the grid between the two) to make one large square cage then then would be perfect for two boys.
It looks like you would need to get some plastic sheeting to protect the floor or a piece of correx of course
Click to expand...
Ahhh gotcha! Ok I’ll try that later today. I’ve got old carpet and tarpaulin, which should work
 
rattata said:
Thanks! Oh that’s a good point about territorial guarding behaviour - not something I thought about when it came to the subject of hay trays tbh!

@Piggies&buns @piggieminder @fluffysal
I’ve updated the enclosure
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Newer update! Excuse the mess as I’ve been rearranging. Also the c & c connections will be added once I’m happy with it.
I’ve seen those large hay tidy/bags from a well known site and experimented making my own. Not sure if I’ll keep the puppy pad (60cmx60) in there or just add paper pellets instead for under the hay?
 

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No expert at all but think I would take the divided bits from the middle just more room to run without stopping so to speak. 💙
Great choice of guinea pigs though we expect lots of photos x
 
My concern here is that the ramp and dividing wall closes off the spaces and could now cause territories, as well as cutting into running space.
I would remove the wall and the ramp between the two cages entirely and just have one completely open square cage.
A dominant piggy could claim the ramp as their own and completely prevent the other from using it thus other piggy loses access to half the cage and all the hay.

The hay bag has effectively become a one entrance hide and could pose a dead end/territory issue.
They may also chew the bag.

I would just throw hay straight into the cage floor in two different places.
 
Please ignore the mess and lack of activities in the cage - tomorrow is clean out day and they have just finished destroying their haycubes (one remnant remains 😄) and carrot cottage - but this is the cage for my pair (the white piggy on the left hand side is in the neighboring cage). It’s a 4x3 c&c so measures 150x112cm.
I just throw hay in as mine are bedded on it (being in a shed I can’t use fleece) but the idea is that they have a large open space to move around and all hides are multi exit so there are no dead ends. The wooden rectangular house on the right has three exits.
 

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Piggies&buns said:
My concern here is that the ramp and dividing wall closes off the spaces and could now cause territories, as well as cutting into running space.
I would remove the wall and the ramp between the two cages entirely and just have one completely open square cage.
Click to expand...

Just to note you can't do that with the Midwest as it's designed, each 4x2 space is designed as a standalone cage with the ramp wall used as a connector between two. To change that would mean taking a saw to it at the very least.

I had a similar setup with Comet and Blitzen and they were fine with it, but @rattata if you want to stick with it, I'd try for making both sides as similar as possible. One has less chance of losing out on hay or pellets that way.
 
Thanks for mentioning that @Lorcan!
As a Midwest is 120x60cm I’ve never had personal experience of them nor how to join them!

So there would be no way of using the dividing wall - disconnecting the two pieces which make that middle divider and turning those pieces so they make two new sides one on the left and one on the right and then connecting to the end wall?

If not, then definitely make each side identical if they then choose to only stay in what may become their own half
 
@Lorcan @Piggies&buns
Thanks guys! The set up you have looks amazing but unfortunately I am somewhat limited to space in my home. If it wouldnt be summer they’d be upstairs in the spare room and have more space, but its far too hot in there for now.
And yes @Lorcan thats the issue with these Midwest set-ups. Tbh on paper it sounded brilliant but I’m definitely not getting it again lol!
So even if the two boars are best mates and stick closely together all the time, and never fight - once they get put in a different environment everything can change within their dynamic completely for a while?
 
rattata said:
@Lorcan @Piggies&buns
So even if the two boars are best mates and stick closely together all the time, and never fight - once they get put in a environment everything can change within their dynamic completely for a while?
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Any change in environment will cause two weeks of hierarchy sort out and reestablishing. This occurs even in well and long term bonded pairs.
In a well bonded pair, it will cause nothing more than dominance which settles down without issue.
In pairs where there is an underlying issue or power struggle it can cause the submissive to take their chance to dominate. This can result in a breakdown in the bond.
This is why two of everything, no dead ends, a big space are very important.

This an even go down to the weekly cage clean and why we recommend to never clean the whole cage in one go. You want some scent to remain in the cage at all times so they still recognise it as their own space.
When Dexter was alive and lived with popcorn, nothing fazed them - I could clean the whole cage in one go and it never affected them, not even when they were younger. Since Dexter died and popcorn (6 yrs old) was bonded with wilbur (almost 2 yrs old), I do not dare clean the whole cage in one go. Wilbur can be a bit of a nuisance and gets quite territorial!

Please don’t worry though, just be aware of the situation and how best to deal with boars - is respecting the hierarchy. The chances are your piggies will have no issue!

Reacting to group or territorial changes: Dominance and group establishment/re-establishment
 
It did work really well for Comet and Blitzen, but I'd have trouble with the goblins if I tried housing them in a set of Midwest. @Piggies&buns no, it comes with the six panels attached, you unfold them to make the rectangular shape and then velcro on the base. Bonus for me was casge cleaning time, I put the ramp up and cleaned out one half while they stayed in the other. If you remove one of the panels, they won't come apart with any ease and then you have the base, which would no longer fit.
 
Piggies&buns said:
Any change in environment will cause two weeks of hierarchy sort out and reestablishing. This occurs even in well and long term bonded pairs.
In a well bonded pair, it will cause nothing more than dominance which settles down without issue.
In pairs where there is an underlying issue or power struggle it can cause the submissive to take their chance to dominate. This can result in a breakdown in the bond.
This is why two of everything, no dead ends, a big space are very important.

This an even go down to the weekly cage clean and why we recommend to never clean the whole cage in one go. You want some scent to remain in the cage at all times so they still recognise it as their own space.
When Dexter was alive and lived with popcorn, nothing fazed them - I could clean the whole cage in one go and it never affected them, not even when they were younger. Since Dexter died and popcorn (6 yrs old) was bonded with wilbur (almost 2 yrs old), I do not dare clean the whole cage in one go. Wilbur can be a bit of a nuisance and gets quite territorial!

Please don’t worry though, just be aware of the situation and how best to deal with boars - is respecting the hierarchy. The chances are your piggies will have no issue!

Reacting to group or territorial changes: Dominance and group establishment/re-establishment
Click to expand...
Thank you so much - this has been really helpful! I forget to say that the rescue lady I’m getting them from has said she’ll pop some soiled (shavings) bedding and some of their hay they’ll be eating that day into a bag for me and we’ll put it in the enclosure for them before they go in.
I just really want to set them up for success, and as this is all new to me it’s also a little nerve racking haha
 
Lorcan said:
It did work really well for Comet and Blitzen, but I'd have trouble with the goblins if I tried housing them in a set of Midwest. @Piggies&buns no, it comes with the six panels attached, you unfold them to make the rectangular shape and then velcro on the base. Bonus for me was casge cleaning time, I put the ramp up and cleaned out one half while they stayed in the other. If you remove one of the panels, they won't come apart with any ease and then you have the base, which would no longer fit.
Click to expand...
It was the prospect of a simple way to keep the enclosure clean with its handy base that drew me to it! Now in hindsight I think I’ll just go with c & c setups in the future, but the Midwest will be always handy to have around as a back-up
 
I think if you're able to give a home to the boar pair, that's great! The babies will have a much easier time finding a home. I personally have only had sows and am not sure what role gender plays in personality and overall friendlinesss. I've had some sows who were very high strung, some who were very chill, some who loved cuddles and would sleep on my lap and some who only tolerated being patted for short times. They've all been very unique personalities. I think any pigs you get you will fall in love with, they all bring something special to the table, they are definitely big personalities in small packages!
 
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