Rescue Boar bumblefoot not eating, drinking

[Wiebke]

I have a fresh poop from his buddy. How do I make this poop soup? How much water per one poop? Do I mash the poop in water? Sorry I’ve never done this before so newbie

You shortly soak any VERY fresh poo in a little water and then immediately syringe some of the water. The process between dropping the poo and it being syringed should take less than 5 minutes as the microbiome will die off very quickly. But it has shown to be more effective than probiotic powder if done correctly; it is one of the few home tips that has stood the test of time as it mimics natural behaviour in recovering piggies.

Take your healthy piggy out of the cage and feed them a little veg or a treat; this will stimulate pooing, so you won't have to wait long for a perfectly fresh one.
The 'recipe' with the tips for poo soup is in the probiotics guide.

 

[Guineasmama]

Yes gave it fresh... all done within 5 mins. Will make another one a couple of hours after he’s had his next critical care m. Thank you for all your help.

 

[Free Ranger]

The other thing is that the Epsom salts soak is a laxative and can cause runny bum if they drink even a little of it. I found out the hard way with an old girl who had a quick slurp before I could catch her (why I don't know - it must be gross) the next day she had very soft mushy poops and a crusty undercarriage! I panicked a bit but apart from a crampy tum and a dirty bum she seemed OK in herself and it cleared up after 48 hours - although I had to stop the soaks in case she did it again! I'd read about the laxative effect and so was trying to soak her front foot in a small lid but apparently not small enough.

FYI: We're typically prescribed 2 x 0.22ml metacam per day for a pig of roughly 1kg BUT this is the 'dog' version which is 1.5mg/ml (cat is 0.5).
We give the doses 12 hours apart so something like 7 am and 7 pm or whatever suits. Guinea pigs apparently have a high metabolic rate so they can burn through it. On one occasion we tried increasing the dose even higher but I can tell you that didn't suit my sow and it suppressed her appetite. However, 2 x 0.22ml doses was fine - didn't affect appetite and they usually like the taste so it's popular. The vet that advised this had an elderly boar with a bladder stone which he couldn't pass and as he was too old for surgery she had been managing his final months with metacam. My sow also had stone trouble but since that time the dose prescribed has always been the 2 x 0.2ish ml for any of my 1 kilo-ish pigs (or '4 units' depending on which syringe is included in the packet).

 

[Guineasmama]

The other thing is that the Epsom salts soak is a laxative and can cause runny bum if they drink even a little of it. I found out the hard way with an old girl who had a quick slurp before I could catch her (why I don't know - it must be gross) the next day she had very soft mushy poops and a crusty undercarriage! I panicked a bit but apart from a crampy tum and a dirty bum she seemed OK in herself and it cleared up after 48 hours - although I had to stop the soaks in case she did it again! I'd read about the laxative effect and so was trying to soak her front foot in a small lid but apparently not small enough.

FYI: We're typically prescribed 2 x 0.22ml metacam per day for a pig of roughly 1kg BUT this is the 'dog' version which is 1.5mg/ml (cat is 0.5).
We give the doses 12 hours apart so something like 7 am and 7 pm or whatever suits. Guinea pigs apparently have a high metabolic rate so they can burn through it. On one occasion we tried increasing the dose even higher but I can tell you that didn't suit my sow and it suppressed her appetite. However, 2 x 0.22ml doses was fine - didn't affect appetite and they usually like the taste so it's popular. The vet that advised this had an elderly boar with a bladder stone which he couldn't pass and as he was too old for surgery she had been managing his final months with metacam. My sow also had stone trouble but since that time the dose prescribed has always been the 2 x 0.2ish ml for any of my 1 kilo-ish pigs (or '4 units' depending on which syringe is included in the packet).

Thank you so much; this is very useful. Bubble is 1180g so on 0.22ml once a day. I begged the vet to let me give him more. Thing is even though he’s has his dose an hour ago now, there’s no improvement with him in the way he is.
There’s no way he drank the epsom salt as I was holding him with this front paw in the little cup. Unless he licked his paw after... only way he could have had it.
I hope the vet can make sense of what is going on. Only thing he’s shown interest for is grass. The syringe I use is the 1ml one.

 

[Free Ranger]

Grass is a Godsend when they feel poorly but literally very thin on the ground at this time of year! If my hubs didn't do a 'grass forage' every morning he'd never see daylight so everyone is benefitting. I hope you can continue to find enough that hasn't been peed on by dogs!

It's interesting that your vet calculated 0.22ml as the dose of cat metacam (I think mine was actually 0.23something ml of dog but that will depend on the specific weight of the pig)... the fact that the volume is pretty much identical might be a coincidence...? I don't want to disagree with a vet as they may be taking other things into account with the animal's heath that we do not see on here - but FYI I'm putting a link on to the NOAH compendium:
Dosage and administration
scroll down till you get to the guinea-pig bit and you'll see there's a note about increasing the dose 'at the discretion of the veterinarian'. You could let him know that the (roughly) 0.1 mg dose doesn't seem to make any difference after an hour? Maybe they'll consult with colleagues...

 

[Guineasmama]

Grass is a Godsend when they feel poorly but literally very thin on the ground at this time of year! If my hubs didn't do a 'grass forage' every morning he'd never see daylight so everyone is benefitting. I hope you can continue to find enough that hasn't been peed on by dogs!

It's interesting that your vet calculated 0.22ml as the dose of cat metacam (I think mine was actually 0.23something ml of dog but that will depend on the specific weight of the pig)... the fact that the volume is pretty much identical might be a coincidence...? I don't want to disagree with a vet as they may be taking other things into account with the animal's heath that we do not see on here - but FYI I'm putting a link on to the NOAH compendium:
Dosage and administration
scroll down till you get to the guinea-pig bit and you'll see there's a note about increasing the dose 'at the discretion of the veterinarian'. You could let him know that the (roughly) 0.1 mg dose doesn't seem to make any difference after an hour? Maybe they'll consult with colleagues...

I’m going to question the vet. fingers crossed he gets better soon. We have lots of green grass in back garden and no dog wee xx

 

[Guineasmama]

Update: vet is keeping Bubble in for the day as he’s got Ileius. Despite my feeding efforts, seems the metacam has dehydrated him. He’s refusing critical care from me this morning and refusing water too. Seems as though he’s given up. They’ve given him a drug to help him get his gut moving. Although he’s passing poops, they are all stringy and I had to help him get them out as they were stuck around his bum. Wish my Bubble luck, he needs it. He’s only been with me 2 months. Poor boy.

 

[Bradshaw Piggies]

Update: vet is keeping Bubble in for the day as he’s got Ileius. Despite my feeding efforts, seems the metacam has dehydrated him. He’s refusing critical care from me this morning and refusing water too. Seems as though he’s given up. They’ve given him a drug to help him get his gut moving. Although he’s passing poops, they are all stringy and I had to help him get them out as they were stuck around his bum. Wish my Bubble luck, he needs it. He’s only been with me 2 months. Poor boy. ❤❤

Keep going with the syringe feeding. They do like to put up a fight! I remember my boy refusing for weeks and every feed time was a challenge, but we made it through. Sending love to you both

 

[Guineasmama]

Sadly, I just got a call from the vets (where he was admitted) to say he’s passed away. He crashed. They gave him some medicine to get his gut moving and fed him critical care but sadly, my little boy didn’t make it. Photo of him this morning having a cuddle/ I had a feeling he would pass as he was refusing water and critical care. I couldn’t get his mouth to open. He’d given up. Miss you Bubbles. I hope the 2 months you were with us outweighed the bad you had with previous owner and being abandoned by them. Love you Bubbles ❤

 

[Bradshaw Piggies]

Sadly, I just got a call from the vets where he was admitted to say he’s passed away. He crashed. They gave him some medicine to get his gut moving and fed him critical care but sadly, my little boy didn’t make it. Photo of him this morning having a cuddle/ I had a feeling he would pass as he was refusing water and critical care. I couldn’t get his mouth to open. He’d given up. Miss you Bubbles. I hope that 2 months you were with us outweighed the bad you had with previous owner and being abandoned by them. Love you Bubbles ❤

Oh no, I’m so so sorry for your loss. I know how hard it is. You did absolutely everything and I have no doubt that he loved and is thankful for the 2 months he had with you. You did a great job. Rest in peace little Bubbles, the rainbow bridge piggies will all be there to welcome you
Make sure you take care of yourself. Sending love to you all

 

[YvonneBlue]

What a very sad situation. I am truly sorry for your loss. You gave Bubble the happiest 2 months of his life and he will take that love with him over the rainbow bridge.

RIP little one.

 

[Free Ranger]

What sad news. He was lucky to have found you to make his last weeks as comfortable as they could be. I'm so sorry for your loss

 

[Wiebke]

Sadly, I just got a call from the vets (where he was admitted) to say he’s passed away. He crashed. They gave him some medicine to get his gut moving and fed him critical care but sadly, my little boy didn’t make it. Photo of him this morning having a cuddle/ I had a feeling he would pass as he was refusing water and critical care. I couldn’t get his mouth to open. He’d given up. Miss you Bubbles. I hope the 2 months you were with us outweighed the bad you had with previous owner and being abandoned by them. Love you Bubbles ❤

HUGS

I am ever so sorry that your rescue has come too late for him. Please try not feel guilty but to be proud that you have given him a safe place, love and care when his frail little body lost the fight and he felt safe to let go. Take consolation that you have made a big difference in his life; even if it is not to be.

Keep in mind that he most likely had underlying issues due to his neglect if his body was shutting down that quickly; before he was taken in by the vets. Once that process is underway, there can only ever be one outcome. Guinea pigs have a big personality so we often forget just how small and frail their body is. Your experience is sadly one of the more taxing side of any rescuer; not all piggies coming into rescue can be saved.

Perhaps the information in these two guides may help you make a bit more sense of what has happened?
Digestive Disorders: Diarrhea - Bloat - GI Stasis (No Gut Movement) And Not Eating
A Practical and Sensitive Guide to Dying, Terminal Illness and Euthanasia in Guinea Pigs

 

[Guineasmama]

HUGS

I am ever so sorry that your rescue has come too late for him. Please try not feel guilty but to be proud that you have given him a safe place, love and care when his frail little body lost the fight and he felt safe to let go. Take consolation that you have made a big difference in his life; even if it is not to be.

Keep in mind that he most likely had underlying issues due to his neglect if his body was shutting down that quickly; before he was taken in by the vets. Once that process is underway, there can only ever be one outcome. Guinea pigs have a big personality so we often forget just how small and frail their body is. Your experience is sadly one of the more taxing side of any rescuer; not all piggies coming into rescue can be saved.

Perhaps the information in these two guides may help you make a bit more sense of what has happened?
Digestive Disorders: Diarrhea - Bloat - GI Stasis (No Gut Movement) And Not Eating
A Practical and Sensitive Guide to Dying, Terminal Illness and Euthanasia in Guinea Pigs

I feel guilty that maybe I didn’t feed enough critical care on Saturday. It was the bleed from the bumblefoot scab coming off that started it. I showed the vet the amount of blood and she said he likely went into stress and shock and stopped eating plus pain. Also metacam can cause ileius. His X-ray showed no infection to leg of bumblefoot paw. All seems normal except gas in his upper and lower stomach.
My intervention was just too late. I’m glad he came to me, where he got fresh food twice daily, nuggets and best Timothy hay. Lots of toys and he met my other Guineas.
It’s just sad he didn’t live a long life and get to enjoy it for long. And that he was abandoned and had severe case of bumblefoot.
He’s the third guinea I’ve lost now and the 6th pet. It never gets easier. Especially when you feel they haven’t lived a fair and long life.

 

[Bill & Ted]

I’m so sorry to read your sad news, sending hugs. Please don’t feel guilty you did everything a caring owner could have done. You gave Bubbles love and care and he will have known just how much you loved him x
Sleep tight little Bubbles

 

[Guineasmama]

I really do hope he knew how much we cared. Hope he wasn’t scarred from previous owner. It took time for Bubble to trust us. He only started to get truly comfortable a few weeks ago. Thank you for yo kind words xx

 

[LucyP]

Really sad and gutted to read this- we were all hoping for a better outcome for you both but it sounds as though his poor start to life made him very vulnerable indeed and that’s something that was sadly completely out of your control. You did so well for him, you helped relieve his pain, you kept him fed and safe and comfy for as long as he could manage it. Heartbreaking ending for you and your family but what a kind act to take him on and give him so much care and love. At least he got to experience that with you, and you should be proud of what you did for him. Take care.

 

[Guineasmama]

Thank you. I held him for 3-4 hours through the night and just stroked his head. I tried to feed him at 5am and he just wasn’t interested. Only took 1ml of water and he struggled. So I knew it was the end really. I told my daughters to say goodbye. I had to go vets alone due to covid. Vet did say put to sleep if he doesn’t respond to them feeding but he didn’t take much from there and died soon as she put him down in cage. Just too stressful for him I think. At least he’s not in pain now. Very severe bumble foot. Also he’s been on antibiotics and metacam since beginning of November so I think he was susceptible to ileius.

 

[Wiebke]

I feel guilty that maybe I didn’t feed enough critical care on Saturday. It was the bleed from the bumblefoot scab coming off that started it. I showed the vet the amount of blood and she said he likely went into stress and shock and stopped eating plus pain. Also metacam can cause ileius. His X-ray showed no infection to leg of bumblefoot paw. All seems normal except gas in his upper and lower stomach.
My intervention was just too late. I’m glad he came to me, where he got fresh food twice daily, nuggets and best Timothy hay. Lots of toys and he met my other Guineas.
It’s just sad he didn’t live a long life and get to enjoy it for long. And that he was abandoned and had severe case of bumblefoot.
He’s the third guinea I’ve lost now and the 6th pet. It never gets easier. Especially when you feel they haven’t lived a fair and long life.

Please don't beat yourself up too badly; the scab is just one of these freak things that you can never foresee and therefore not prevent - it may have happened at another time when took the bandage off etc. If he was that fragile (metacam usually doesn't easily cause ileus in guinea pigs the way it does in dogs; in fact we haven't come across this much in 15 years of existence and tens of thousands of piggies passing through here), something else might have happened sooner rather later that would have caused his body to close down.

Soul searching and a guilt trip is a normal stage at the onset of the grieving process that is just a reflection of you being a very loving and caring owner and not that you have done anything wrong or could have changed events.
You may find our grieving guide helpful now and in the coming days while you run the whole gamut of strong and sometimes conflicting or confusing feelings; it will hopefully help you make more sense of your experiences and also give you resource links if you need to hear this from more trained people: Human Bereavement: Grieving, Coping and Support Links for Guinea Pig Owners and Their Children