Hi! I have 2 guinea pigs that are fighting a lot while I am trying to bond them. what should I do?

Layla313

Layla313

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I used to have 3 male guinea pigs that were bonded perfectly but as they came towards their tweens they started fighting a lot, I did some research and found out that having more than 2 males together will cause fights, so we sold the 2 males that got along. Now I have the 3rd one - Simba and I got him a friend - Mango. Simba is 6 months old and Mango is 2 months old, I did the quarantine for Mango and then I put them inside the same cage with bars separating them. It has been 2 weeks and still Simba keeps rumble strutting at Mango and Mango is making a lot of squeaking and chirping noises. I was wondering if you can help me figure this out? (I did not have enough space for the second cage on the opposite side of the room for the bonding)
 
Have you put the two piggies on neutral territory and bonded them properly so they are now living together without bars between them?
If they still have bars between them then they are not bonding properly yet, and you will need to go through the bonding process.

You need to put them somewhere neutral (outside of the cage -in a pen on your bathroom or kitchen floor for example) for several hours for them to see if they like each other and can form a bond.
If all goes well after those few hours, then you move them together into the same cage and leave them together from then on. It then takes two weeks of being in the same cage for them to fully form their bond.
Rumble strutting, chasing, mounting, the squeaking sound (which is called submission squeaking) is all perfectly normal and something they will do throughout their entire lives. You will notice it a lot more after they are first bonded and certainly throughout the next year to 18 months while they are teenagers.
Simba is at the height of his teen hormone output and Mango hasn’t even started his teens yet (doesn’t start until 4 months of age) so you are going to see a lot of dominance behaviours.

A key part is for them to have a lot of space. Their cage for the two of them needs to be 180x60cm or a 5x2 c&c cage.

(It’s done now but Mango should not have been quarantined as he is too young to ever be alone. You also didn’t need the second cage given mango’s age - they should have been bonded on neutral territory on the day you brought mango home.
- added this for future information and for anybody else who comes across this thread)

The guides below will help further

Bonding and Interaction: Illustrated social behaviours and bonding dynamics
A Comprehensive Guide to Guinea Pig Boars
Boars: Teenage, Bullying, Fighting, Fall-outs And What Next?
Dominance Behaviours In Guinea Pigs
 
Thank you so much for this info! I did put them inside of neutral territory for about 3 hours and it didn't go well so I put them inside the same cage with the bars. was that wrong? And yes their cage is that big!
 
What happened to make you think it didn’t go well?

Was there an actual fight? If there was an actual fight and they got injured then the bond will never work out as it means they don’t like each other. In that case they do need to remain separated by bars at all times. However the cage would need to be bigger for them to be separated permanently - each piggy would need a minimum of 120x60cm or a minimum Of a 3x2 c&c cage each. (So you’d need a minimum of a 6x2 c&c cage split in the middle).
They will still show dominance between the bars throughout their whole lives as they patrol and mark their territories. They will still have a relationship between the bars in that they will interact with each other but a fight means they can never share a cage

If there was not a fight and instead all there was was normal dominance (rumbling, chasing and mounting, along with the submission squealing) then this means the bond did in fact go well and they should not have been separated.
In this case, please put them back on neutral territory for a few hours and ride out any dominance behaviours . If all goes well after a few hours in neutral territory then they can go back into the main cage. Before you move them to the main cage make sure it haa been thoroughly cleaned out and with the dividing bars removed. They will then take two weeks to settle their bond. As I say though seeing dominance behaviour is normal and is a lifelong behaviour.
You will need two of everything in the cage and ensure all hides have two doors in them. Single exit hides cause a dead end and run the risk of one piggy feeling trapped and causing a fight inside one.
We also recommend scatter feeding veg and pellets particularly teen boars, as it removes the risk of food hogging. It also provides an excellent source of enrichment and mental stimulation as they search through for their veg and pellets
 
So should I put them both inside neutral territory and after a few hours put them inside the same cage? if they still don't settle a bond what should I do?
 
Layla313 said:
So should I put them both inside neutral territory and after a few hours put them inside the same cage? if they still don't settle a bond what should I do?
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Could you tell me what happened for you to think it didn’t work last time?
Was there an actual fight? This is vital to know as if there was a fight then you should never put them together again.
If there wasn’t a fight and actually you misread the situation, then you can go ahead and put them back on neutral territory.

If you put them back on neutral territory and they are fine together ie no fights, then yes after a few hours you then need to move them into the same cage and remain together from then on.

If there is an actual fight and blood is drawn then they won’t bond (remembering that dominance is not fighting). In that case they can never live together. You will need to keep them separated by bars permanently, and each piggy needs their own minimum 3x2 c&c
 
That’s great - go ahead and bond them, but don’t panic by the dominance behaviours
Hopefully all will go well!
 
Remember that young piggies can be very dramatic and that submission squealing is VERY loud and sounds like one of the piggies is being murdered! It's good news if you hear it as it means that one of your piggies is saying "it's OK I accept you as the dominant piggy"
As long as they don't end up in a jumping rolling mass of piggies they should be fine. Good luck. I really
Hope they decide they like other
 
Please keep us updated on the bonding, I really hope it works out. Reading the boar behaviour thread has been very good at reassuring me that things are good despite how it looks (and sounds) to us.
 
Omg lol you are right Mango is really squeaking his head off! thank you guys for helping me, I have put them both inside a big bathtub right now to bond them and Simba keeps rumble strutting and tryna like eat his butt?! but I think it is going well! in a few hours I will put them both inside thee cage and see how it goes!
 
I just have a question about the cage, my cage is 4x2 c&c cage and it has a bottom floor which is 2x3, is that big enough?
 
Layla313 said:
Omg lol you are right Mango is really squeaking his head off! thank you guys for helping me, I have put them both inside a big bathtub right now to bond them and Simba keeps rumble strutting and tryna like eat his butt?! but I think it is going well! in a few hours I will put them both inside thee cage and see how it goes!
Click to expand...

That’s normal dominance, don’t worry. Simba is establishing himself as boss

Layla313 said:
I just have a question about the cage, my cage is 4x2 c&c cage and it has a bottom floor which is 2x3, is that big enough?
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The cage needs to be single level and needs to be a 5x2.
A bottom level is the only part that counts (upper levels don’t count) so a 2x3 won’t be big enough for two boars. Any area connected by a ramp or tunnels doesn’t count
A 4x2 on a single level is considered minimum for two boars. Boars really do need a lot more room so the more space you can give them from the beginning is best. You may find a 4x2 is too tight for two teen boars.
Changing cage size later will cause them
To reestablish their bond all over again so best to avoid changing anything later where possible

I would not use any ramps in the cage with teen boars, particularly newly bonded ones. A ramp can become a source of a problem if one claims it as their own and refuses to let the other one use it.
Single level with no dead ends is best with boars.

Cage Size Guide
 
Layla313 said:
Omg lol you are right Mango is really squeaking his head off! thank you guys for helping me, I have put them both inside a big bathtub right now to bond them and Simba keeps rumble strutting and tryna like eat his butt?! but I think it is going well! in a few hours I will put them both inside thee cage and see how it goes!
Click to expand...
Good luck 🤞🏻
 
Some piggies (one of my boys 🙄) can be VERY loud and dramatic with the submission squeals. Mischievous Master Boris has been known to scream his head off when Dignified Sir George is nowhere near him!
To us it sounds awful 😞
 
lol - Is it normal that even though I moved them together Simba is still humping and doing a lot of rumble strutting when Mango follows him around - Like Mango will walk an inch and Simba will start rumbling at the top of his lungs!
 
Layla313 said:
lol - Is it normal that even though I moved them together Simba is still humping and doing a lot of rumble strutting when Mango follows him around - Like Mango will walk an inch and Simba will start rumbling at the top of his lungs!
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Absolutely normal - dominance behaviours continue lifelong
- it will take the next two weeks for them to fully form their hierarchy so you will see dominance during that time.
They are hormonal teenagers - so again lots of dominance for the next year to 18 months.
Then beyond that they will continue to reinforce their relationship for life
 
thank you so much! This has been so much help! lol I have only had rabbits before this and I feel like they were so much easier!
 
Layla313 said:
thank you so much! This has been so much help! lol I have only had rabbits before this and I feel like they were so much easier!
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I have rabbits also (currently have two rabbits and three piggies) I don’t find them easier as such, it’s just very different!
 
Even when they are older you will still get the occasional day of rumbling, chin offs and chasing...... with mine it's accompanied by a fragrant "eau de boar" smell 😷🤢
 
Hold your nerve, it usually takes a couple of weeks for the bond to settle but bare in mind you have a teenage boar and a soon to be teenager so things will be a bit hairy for a while. Hormone spikes often happen in this period which last for up to 24 hours then settle down again
 
Hi again! it has been more than 2 months and my 2 guinea pigs are still fighting, Simba still rumbles at Mango like every 10 seconds lol! Any tips?
 
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