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Guinea pig has sudden watery diarrhoea

Definitely call the vet for a check.
How much and how often are you syringe feeding?
I would increase the syringe feeding first to try to stabilise his weight. That is the important but - stopping losses, before getting gains.
 
We'll be calling the vets tomorrow morning.
He's been syringe fed roughly 10ml every 4 hours, but we're probably going to increase that to every 2 hours. I'm not too sure when it becomes "too much" syringe feeding? Would 10ml every 2 hours be too much? I'm just not sure honestly. I've seen him eat willingly so I know he's still eating/able to eat, and I don't want to put him off of that by completely filling him with syringe food.
We originally went every 2 hours post op to every 4 hours, to much more sparingly but now with the steady weight loss we've bumped that back up to every 3-4 hours and are probably going to make it more frequent, like I said.
And absolutely agreed - I figure food rich in calories would help stabilise his weight if he's not eating enough for himself (though I'm only keeping to small quantities infrequently because I know oats can have calcium/phosphorus risks).
 
If he's losing weight he's not eating enough for himself. The fluctuation is usually around the same weight - above/below maybe but around the same weight and this lad is losing bit by bit. It might be teeth stopping him eating hay - esp if there's a history. It might be pain or discomfort quelling his appetite. It might even be something metabolic but it'd have to be quite a coincidence for that to happen at the same time as everything else. You need the vet to sort it out though... the syringe feeding and oats is to help him 'mark time' until you can get there. Good luck 💕
 
That makes sense. I'm hoping it is his teeth and not something worse - luckily after his previous dentals he was always stuffing himself with hay in the car ride back lol! We'll be calling the vets when they open, I'll see if I can convince my parents for an appointment before they go out (since I'm not able to drive) today, since I'd rather not even wait until tomorrow for it, really. If anything like a dental needs to be done I'd rather it be done when he's still strong enough to be active, which he certainly is lol.
 
The original vet didn't have an appointment until too late for my parents, but we got another appointment this morning in about an half an hour. The original vet wants us to stop syringe feeding him, but that doesn't seem... correct? If he's actively trying to eat and eating but still losing weight surely syringe feeding him makes more sense? He's still begging for more food after the syringe food, and does eat/try to eat hay after. Just very bizarre advice.
 
They had checked his teeth during the op and just now and didn't see any signs of issues. They're thinking he might have something wrong with his kidneys. They said to put him back on cisapride at the same dose, add some probiotic to the water, and stop syringe feeding him. So I guess I just have to give him more high calorie food if I'm not supposed to syringe feed? (Obviously introduced gradually) Unfortunately the bladder stone sat in one of the bases of the kidney tubes so I can't be too surprised.
 
We went to the vets again and unfortunately it wasn't great news. He thankfully doesn't think its a kidney issue since his drinking and urination hasn't increased exponentially, however Mario still continues to lose weight. He's eating and metabolosing protein, but likely losing it somewhere in his GI tract. It unfortunately might be a late side effect of the surgery.
He's on a stronger critical care (Emeraid), 5 scoops of probiotics in his water (500ml) and basically just giving him whatever he wants to eat all the time (even alfalfa!). If he doesn't at least stabilise by this Friday, it might be best to let him go. I'm heartbroken at the possibility, but we won't give up on him. He has such a fight in him, despite being skin and bones he's still hopping out of the cage begging for food.
 
I'm not quite sure why they wanted you to stop syringing him. If he's keen and he's begging for food surely he might as well eat the Critical Care slurry as anything else? Did they just want you to stop syringing until this latter appointment so they could assess what's going on? If you offer a plate of the slurry does he gobble it down or does he only eat it if it is syringed? Are his poops back to normal now?

George finished his antibiotics last week and since then his appetite has recovered very well although weight gain is only very slow. George still has a syringe session every afternoon but rather than having to persuade him for 8 to 10ml he's reaching for it and gobbling down 25+ml. What strikes me is that your boy seems very hungry - and you have another one to compare him to so presumably they are both begging for food in the same way. When George was on AB and losing weight he was very clearly not eating when my other two pigs were eating all day - or he was eating but not as much, so slower chewing or getting excited for veg but then leaving some. But if Mario is still wanting food and eating it all I'd be doing what you're doing and just giving him what he wants. Although I'd mix the probiotic into the food and not put it into the water - I never put anything into the water. And I'd be offering syringe food if he wanted it. Poor Mario - at this point he doesn't have anything to lose so he might as well enjoy himself x
 
I suppose the vet was hoping less syringe food would cause him to eat more by himself, but as I said this was overturned yesterday. He doesn't like the critical care too much so he was always disinterested.
He's very much begging for food but hasn't been eating his normal hay much at all. But he can go through a bowl of grass lol.
I was wary about probiotics in the water too, but they both seem to be drinking from it.

I actually have a positive update - he gained 27g between today and yesterday! Fingers crossed that he continues to improve, it seems the EmerAid is helping a lot! He still mostly stays in his hidey (he's usually a very inquisitive pig and stays outside a lot) but honestly that's the warmest place for him so I don't really mind! An hour after his feeding session and he's begging me for more grass lol. Poor little lad has also been stumbling from time to time - I suspect due to losing muscle mass. But he's trooping on for now, hopefully he continues to gain more weight.
Here's a picture of him munching on grass!
 

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He's so lovely 💕 and they are always happy when they're eating - or eating when they're happy: it's probably both 🥰

If he's not eating enough hay that would explain his weight loss. And long term that's a problem but short term it might be something he can get over... if he's eating grass you'd think it wouldn't be teeth so perhaps it's just a matter of getting over the surgery. Has the UTI definitely been cleared? Is he on any other meds? Perhaps for pain or anything?

When George was off his food he'd eat grass but just one blade at a time. It looks like Mario is getting a good gobfull! This is how George is when he's feeling a bit better and his guts are stabilised. But George didn't start to regain weight until he started eating hay round the clock again. This was him and the girls this morning (the football was hub's idea in honour of the world cup!)
George with a face full.webp
 
The reason why we suspect his teeth is because he's having issues chewing harder things - his jaw movements become very exaggerated and it takes a while for him to eat. But the vet said it could be just due to the surgery too, since he doesn't seem to be absorbing protein. So potentially a mix of both.
He did an ultrasound and said his bladder looked very healthy! He doesn't really have any signs that would suggest a UTI but I can ask about it. I don't believe we were told to continue pain relief, but that is something I can ask about.
Your piggies are absolutely precious!
 
I have to say I've never heard of problems 'absorbing protein' after surgery. But then I'm not a vet. But we've all heard of teeth problems and I have to say that's what I would be thinking in your shoes. Pigs eat hay round the clock and much of it goes straight through the system! It's how they are designed. So if a piggy can be seen to struggle chewing harder things, takes longer to eat and has strange jaw movements that's the obvious candidate. Don't give up yet.

@furryfriends (TEAS) does this sound about right to you?

@GuineaDan would you be within travelling distance of the Cat and Rabbit Clinic in Northampton? They do conscious dentals and have been able to turn piggies around very quickly. I think these days they are so much in demand that you have to get a referral from your currant vet but it's worth looking into... especially if your currant lovely vet is suggesting nothing can be done for him. Mario's appetite and lust for life would seem to disagree with that.
 
It sounds like he’s made a good recovery from surgery, but this now seems much more like a dental issue. I would definitely suggest you get him seen at the Cat and Rabbit Clinic, in Northampton, if at all possible. I run a sanctuary, for guinea pigs with dental issues and Simon and Kim Maddock have saved and extended, the lives of so many guinea pigs.
 
Thanks @furryfriends (TEAS)
If he's not squeaking as he pees and he's not wet underneath it's probably not any UTI. I just had to double-check as that was being considered at some point either before or after the surgery. If he were mine I'd be feeding him up as much as he can manage with recovery slurry and looking at some sort of dental issue. Try and keep him on a bit of grass every day if he's not eating hay as they do love it and it will help the teeth not to get any worse at least. Well done Mario!
 
Syringe feeding doesn’t affect whether the guinea pig eats for themselves! I find by feeding around 10 mls of syringe feed and then offering normal food, seems to encourage them to eat! However, that’s if their teeth are good enough for them to eat. It only needs to be a very tiny spur, that can so easily be missed, that will make eating painful or difficult.
 
They were considering euthanasia if he continued to lose even more weight without stabilising since he wouldn't survive anaesthetics for a dental. Though honestly as long as he's actively trying to eat and moving around, I'm willing to still give him a chance. The vet said that the GI tract is struggling to absorb protein since he's clearly eating and metabolising protein, but he's still losing weight and muscle mass.
I'm not too sure how feasible that would be - it's a roughly 2 1/2 hour car journey. I don't drive, so it would be up to my parents. They both have work schedules that don't align too well and disabilities that can make driving difficult. So unfortunately I can't see it being an option.
However yes I will be giving him lots of grass and recovery food, he seems to go through so much grass lol. I have to be a bit careful with how much emeraid I give, simply as that caused some digestive issues when he had too much.
 
I'm very happy to report he put on another 17g today - that's roughly 44g gained within two days! He was losing about 20g per day before! I'm very proud of him. He will likely get a dental on Friday, but we'll ask if it's a better idea to try to get him to gain even more weight before we do it - simply because I want him to have the best chance of surviving anesthesia. The vet said on Monday that if he did the dental right there and then he almost definitely wouldn't survive the anesthesia. It's like, I don't want to wait to fix the overall likely problem, but I also want the best chance of surviving anesthetic.
 
That's very true - and if you can't make it to Cat and Rabbit (remember, they specialise in conscious dentals) it's his best chance. He's been a strong boy so far and it's wonderful that he's gaining weight ☺️
 
Small victories - he went down again back to 640g, however it does seem he's stabilising at that weight, which is the most important thing. Weight gain is bound to have ups and downs (especially since it was within the daily fluctuation), stabilisation is the most important. Since he seems to be more used to the EmerAid, we'll be increasing the frequency we give to him. Probably bumping it up to 30ml per day (it's a lot stronger than normal critical care, so it's slow adjustments).
However, today I haven't had to help him do a poop, which I have been having to do recently! He also started wheeking at me more, which is something he had stopped when he was feeling poorly!
He's going back to the vets tomorrow, I'll suggest waiting on the dental until next week so he can hopefully gain even more weight!
Here he is enjoying a nice bowl of grass - picked in the cold and dark lol!
 

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Aah poor boy. I would see what your vet says about his weight. If he lost so much in such a short time I'm concerned they might suggest it's so urgent that he won't make it to next week. Even if he doesn't lose any more you're going to be pushing hard to get something back on and keep it on. If it's a tooth problem they can deal with he'll be able to eat on his own with painkiller etc.

But please be prepared for if they say something along the lines of "We can put him under, but if we can't see anything wrong with his teeth, perhaps... pts?"
I've had different vets over the years and what one thinks is a treatable issue will make another baulk. It really does depend on the vet and whether they are reading you right. Just have a careful think about what you want and what Mario wants (as far as you can tell!) and they can guide you to the best way forward.
 
The vet agreed that he's doing much better today, he's stronger, less cold, and even put on another 10g! He even had the audacity to start eating hay in front of the vet lol.
We discussed it and he thinks it's best to wait another week (he's only been on emeraid and more probiotics for about 3 1/2 days) just to give him extra time to build up muscle mass and body mass - if he thinks he's strong enough next Friday it'll be done then, if not it'll just be more care until he is. He's not 100% out of the woods, but he's improved so much since Monday.
I appreciate the advice! If it isn't dental related then it might be kidney related, but we'll just have to see day by day. I genuinely believe the vet wouldn't suggest PTS unless there was really no other option - like he would have been happy to keep going if he had just stayed at 615g, let alone gain 30-40g. He did such a complicated surgery (the bladder stone had parked itself right at one of the kidney tubes!), and even did his Monday consultation for free! But trust me, as long as Mario has a will to live, I'm going to fight for him every step of the way. ...Even if that means picking grass at 5am lol.
 
At the vets yesterday he weighed 653g, and today he weighed 665g! He also feels like he's filling out a bit more - his bones are a bit less jarring. Nice to know me getting a cold from getting frosty grass was worth it lol (of course we let it heat up a bit before giving it to him). He's also decided that he absolutely loves the EmerAid now and chews on the syringe lol. Since it is stronger (compared to typical critical care) and has given him diarrhoea when he had too much, we're focusing on increasing it slowly, though I don't think he agrees! His appetite is certainly there lol.
 
Mario is up to 704g today! That's roughly 100g gained in a week, with 2 days of losses.
I did notice an entirely new problem though - he has a little sore on his foot! He's going back to the vets on Friday, would something like this be okay until then? He's still walking fine, and it doesn't feel hot to touch. I just don't want the poor thing to get bumblefoot on top of everything else.
Apologies for the blurry picture, but it should be fairly clear.
 

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I think that should be OK till Friday. Make sure he's not sitting on his own wee... if they are reluctant to move they can sometimes get little pressure sores but as Mario has been active it could just be that he's a bit run down. Is it just the one foot at the back?

He started out with medication for a UTI didn't he. One of the symptoms can be dripping urine so the fur under his tummy and on the back legs can get wet. This increases the risk of urine scald on the soles and this increases the risk of a bumble forming. If he's still got UTI symptoms that's something to watch out for - try to keep him dry at the back.

My vet told me to dab a little Sudocream (which is baby nappy cream - we had it in at home) on such things but only a thin smear and don't do it long term as it can apparently dry and thin the skin. But short term it protects the sore skin. An alternative is Flamazine cream which has been recommended by vets but which may be harder to get hold of in the UK at short notice.
Toni D said:
She suggested putting cotton wool soaked in cooled boiled water onto his feet to cool them down and then applying Flamazine (a colloidal silver cream) as a natural antibiotic and anti-inflammatory.
Click to expand...

What great news about his weight gain!
 
He's a bit less active than usual so that might be it? Wouldn't be surprised if he was sitting in his own wee at least a bit. Unfortunately due to health issues I cleaned out their cage slightly later than usual, so I'm wondering if that might be it as well.
Luckily he hasn't shown any signs of urine on his belly or legs, even before. I've kept his back end clean whenever I've lifted him up, so hopefully that helps.
Thank you for the suggestion! I'll see what the vet says on Friday.
I'm very proud of his weight gain, it's more than what I was expecting! His "regular" weight is about 950g, so he's already making leaps and bounds towards it! Going to be difficult weaning him off of multiple fresh bowls of grass though, don't think he'll be thrilled with me lol.
 
Just a small update: he's remained pretty stable the past two days (707g yesterday and 711g today). He's shown some signs of eating hay but unfortunately piggies don't make it easy to tell. His feeds have been reduced a little bit (only one feed in the middle of the night because my hands can't handle frosty grass lol), so it's good to see that hasn't impacted his weight. His feet still look the same - I noticed he has a similar sore mark on his other back foot too, but that was on darker skin so it was harder to notice. He's going back to the vets tomorrow and we'll discuss about the dental then.
 
Very happy update! He was strong enough for his dental today and pulled through absolutely fine. Unfortunately for the poor little thing, his teeth were in really bad shape. He needs regular dentals due to a twist in his jaw, unfortunately this time the dental happened to be timed so close to his bladder stone surgery. He also had a laceration on his mouth, the poor thing. However, even in the carrier case on the way home, he's immediately begun munching on hay! He's quite happily stuffing himself with hay in his hidey lol.
He's currently on Baytril (0.4ml twice daily) for the laceration/any potential infection for 7 days, Cisapride (1 tablet dissolved in 1ml of water, 0.2ml twice daily) as a gut stimulant and Loxicom (0.2ml once daily) for pain management, both for 12 days. All of which he's had before - though we were told to stop the Baytril if it caused diarrhea, which is how this thread started lol.
He'll still be watched carefully, especially as he gets over the anesthetic (though he seems completely bright and is eating already) and be weaned off of his "special" diet (syringe food, bowls of grass and muesli) as we get him back to his more normal food. Thank you to everyone for all of your help and support - I truly thought I was going to lose my boy at some points, but he has been a little fighter.
The vet believes that they are little sores on his feet, but isn't too concerned about them - but he's on Baytril for his mouth anyway, so maybe it'll help? He's also already more active too. I'll keep an eye to make sure they don't get bigger, more hot, etc.
I'll post a small update if he's essentially healthy again, and will give more updates if he has any further health issues. Fingers crossed!
And of course, an obligatory pigture! So much hay lol
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Mario's saga does not end it appears. His teeth look like they've been cut way too short. The vet told us he cut his teeth as short as he could but now Mario's struggling to pick up his veg! Very annoyed about this, it feels like a second problem just got created. I'm pretty sure I've seen him eating hay but now I'm wondering how much he was actually managing to swallow! I'm not sure if he's able to eat grass - he was very focused on his pepper and may just not have wanted to eat any due to wanting the veg more. I've currently grated up some pepper and put it in his cage (taking Luigi out of course). So now we're back to potential around the clock syringe feed since I have no idea whether he's able to eat anything. I'll be calling the vets about this in the morning for sure.
 
It definitely seems like he can't eat or drink on his own, the poor thing. He lost about 50g since yesterday - but hopefully that was just because we were assuming he was eating, and with regular syringe feeds he'll stabilise. He's been having roughly 10-15ml of syringe food every couple of hours, alongside 10ml of blended grass/greens, and 5-7ml of blended pepper, and 5-7ml of blended carrot, as well as however much water he wants to drink. Hopefully this will keep him going until his teeth grow back some more. We were told to not worry too much about stuff like sugar, since it's more important that he just gets something inside of him right now. Poor boy! Hopefully he'll be able to eat by himself soon, I'm hoping they'll grow back extra quick (especially since he isn't filing them down since he literally can't). Poor poor Mario.
 
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