Bumblefoot. Bone visible? Graphic photos!

[LadyC]

My 5 year old female piggy has gotten bumblefoot and she is now at day 5 on Bactrim (0.4 ml twice a day) and Metacam (0.5 ml once a day).
Before she got on antibiotics I gave her daily epsom salt foot soaks (the scab was falling off after soaks) cleaned with chlorexedine and an antiseptic gel spray. Daily bandages.
Yesterday I started with Manuka honey (Activon Tube) and betadine soaks.
I’m still giving her daily cleaning, soaks and bandages.
I have to revisit my vet after one week on antibiotics.

Overall she is very curious and have a very good appetite.

I want to give you a warning about some quite nasty photos futher down in this post.
The spot in the middle feels and looks like bone.

Has has anyone here had any experience with bumblefoot at this severity?

Is there any hope of fixing, or managing her condition?

Thanks in advance!

 

[LadyC]

Friday 23th - Day 2 on manuka honey

 

[CTWC]

Ouch I have no experience at all sorry other than to follow your vets advice what type of cage are your guinea pigs in and what bedding do you use?

 

[Viennese Furbabies]

No, sorry, Billie had a bad case of bumblefoot but hers wasn't a open wound. When was your last visit to the vet? Only a vet can tell you if that's bone or something else.

 

[Piggies&buns]

Oh dear, that looks so sore.

Is it cat or dog metacam?
Piggies ideally need their pain meds twice a day due to them metabolising pain meds in around 12 hours.

What type of bedding is she on?
I would suggest a soft vetbed (if you aren’t already using it) and then changing out the pieces a few times a day.

Ensure you carry out daily weight checks so you can be certain she is eating plenty of hay.

I hope she is ok

 

[Wheekallweek]

Ouch, poor baby! Hope she's feeling better soon

 

[Jelly/Jam]

I use noodle mats. They wash very well over and over again.

 

[munchmonster]

Sending healing vibes to your poor little piggie.

 

[LadyC]

Thanks so much for your replies!
The last visit to my vet was on 19th February. I’ll revisit on 27th February.
She is given the Metacam for cats,
I think it’s strange that the vet prescribed it only once daily. Also the vet wanted to do surgery or let her go if not better in one week. I’m worried because of the risks with anesthesia and I feel like one week is very short of time to heal.

As for the bedding, I recently started using vetbed.

I was able to take a better close up of the wound today.

 

[eileen]

Hello,That looks like nasty bumblefoot.
I've a piggie with bumble foot on both back feet.
I'm using flamazine from the vets,it's seems to be healing.Dakota still has scabs on her feet,but are reducing.
One foot was alittle sloughy, so I gently removed that.she is on vetbed.dog loxicom 0.5mls aday.
It's is tedious,but has worked.
Good luck with your piggie.

 

[CTWC]

Hello,That looks like nasty bumblefoot.
I've a piggie with bumble foot on both back feet.
I'm using flamazine from the vets,it's seems to be healing.Dakota still has scabs on her feet,but are reducing.
One foot was alittle sloughy, so I gently removed that.she is on vetbed.dog loxicom 0.5mls aday.
It's is tedious,but has worked.
Good luck with your piggie.

How long did it take to see a significant improvement?

 

[eileen]

3 weeks,it's persistence that counts.Vet bed is key.

 

[Wiebke]

Thanks so much for your replies!
The last visit to my vet was on 19th February. I’ll revisit on 27th February.
She is given the Metacam for cats,
I think it’s strange that the vet prescribed it only once daily. Also the vet wanted to do surgery or let her go if not better in one week. I’m worried because of the risks with anesthesia and I feel like one week is very short of time to heal.

As for the bedding, I recently started using vetbed.

I was able to take a better close up of the wound today.

Hi and welcome

I am very sorry - that looks like it is going to be a real battle.

With smaller dosages at low level strength (like cat metacam, 0.5 mg/ml concentration) once a day metacam has a bigger impact whereas it can be cosmetic when split; with high levels of pain or in acute pain spikes requiring maxed out dosages of dog metacam (1.5 mg/ml strength, sadly not licensed for guinea pigs although much needed) it should be given twice daily.

All the best. Bumblefoot usually takes several weeks or even months to heal. It is more in the way of a marathon than a sprint as long as the healing process is going in the right direction. You have only just started but it is already looking better, so please persist.


PS: If you have the choice between a potentially life-saving operation and euthanasia because the infection has sadly entered the bone and will spread into the body that way, then you are buying your piggy a chance at a good, pain-free life that she will otherwise not have. There is never a guarantee; you have to always make these decisions blind. Have an open discussion with your vet and their assessment and confidence before you make any decisions.
You also need to be aware that when you do your online research (including on here) that what you get is all the cases that are going wrong because the owners are reeling and a few miracle stories but what is mainly absent is the vast majority of perfectly uneventful successful recoveries because that is not considered worth posting about and it doesn't come with the need for a support thread on here. If it was really true that most operations ended badly, then guinea pigs would simply not be operated on and drugs would be banned for use on them.

Please also be aware that amputation is always only a last ditch measure but that 'tripod' piggies will adapt quickly and be able to get around and lead a perfectly normal life with all its joys and excitements.

 

[LadyC]

Hi and welcome

I am very sorry - that looks like it is going to be a real battle.

With smaller dosages at low level strength (like cat metacam, 0.5 mg/ml concentration) once a day metacam has a bigger impact whereas it can be cosmetic when split; with high levels of pain or in acute pain spikes requiring maxed out dosages of dog metacam (1.5 mg/ml strength, sadly not licensed for guinea pigs although much needed) it should be given twice daily.

All the best. Bumblefoot usually takes several weeks or even months to heal. It is more in the way of a marathon than a sprint as long as the healing process is going in the right direction. You have only just started but it is already looking better, so please persist.


PS: If you have the choice between a potentially life-saving operation and euthanasia because the infection has sadly entered the bone and will spread into the body that way, then you are buying your piggy a chance at a good, pain-free life that she will otherwise not have. There is never a guarantee; you have to always make these decisions blind. Have an open discussion with your vet and their assessment and confidence before you make any decisions.
You also need to be aware that when you do your online research (including on here) that what you get is all the cases that are going wrong because the owners are reeling and a few miracle stories but what is mainly absent is the vast majority of perfectly uneventful successful recoveries because that is not considered worth posting about and it doesn't come with the need for a support thread on here. If it was really true that most operations ended badly, then guinea pigs would simply not be operated on and drugs would be banned for use on them.

Please also be aware that amputation is always only a last ditch measure but that 'tripod' piggies will adapt quickly and be able to get around and lead a perfectly normal life with all its joys and excitements.

Thank you so much for your great post and for clarifying about Metacam. Then I do understand.

I heard it’s called “osteomyelitis” when the infection is spreading to the bone. The vet hasn’t taken x-ray so I don’t know yet. Hopefully it’s not this, but I feel a little better knowing that 'tripod' piggies will adapt quickly and be able to live a normal life.

By the way. Have you heard about laser therapy for bumblefoot?

Please see attached photo below, I’m starting to think that maybe the bone like in the middle could be a fracture (broken toe)? Just my own speculation.

 

[Teema]

Hi Lady C, I am so sorry to hear this, your poor wee piggie, looks really sore. Unfortunately I don’t have any advice for you regarding bumblefoot however, I saw your message about being worried about anesthesia, I just wanted to share with you a wee success story that my piggie, Pipsqueak, has been getting a bladder stome removed and had Ketamine and ‘gas’ to sedate her. It all went absolutely fine and she really was quite poorly with it. I am not 100% sure if there are different types of anesthetic, if what my girl Pipsqueak got was more similar to gas and air that just makes you a bit woozy/relaxed or if she was fully knocked out, but either way she was definitely full of drugs to complete the procedure painlessly and omitting distress. She has recovered really well from the whole ordeal, although a bit wobbly after the ketamine!
Wondering if that white ‘bone’ looking part could just be pus/poison from infection? Good luck with everything, I hope your vet can give you the answers you need and get her on the mend x

 

[LadyC]

Hi Lady C, I am so sorry to hear this, your poor wee piggie, looks really sore. Unfortunately I don’t have any advice for you regarding bumblefoot however, I saw your message about being worried about anesthesia, I just wanted to share with you a wee success story that my piggie, Pipsqueak, has been getting a bladder stome removed and had Ketamine and ‘gas’ to sedate her. It all went absolutely fine and she really was quite poorly with it. I am not 100% sure if there are different types of anesthetic, if what my girl Pipsqueak got was more similar to gas and air that just makes you a bit woozy/relaxed or if she was fully knocked out, but either way she was definitely full of drugs to complete the procedure painlessly and omitting distress. She has recovered really well from the whole ordeal, although a bit wobbly after the ketamine!
Wondering if that white ‘bone’ looking part could just be pus/poison from infection? Good luck with everything, I hope your vet can give you the answers you need and get her on the mend x

Many thanks for your reply and for sharing this, it’s calming to hear. How old were she when going through the surgery?

Yeah my first thought was pus too, but when touched gently with a compress between it felt hard and sharp.

 

[Princess Dustmop]

I haven't had a pig undergo surgery, but I did have one go under anaesthesia (for bloat treatment - she was put under so that gas could be extracted from her stomach.) Our options at the time were anaesthesia or PTS, as she was in pain (her bloat was severe and acupuncture injections weren't working quickly enough), so we opted to risk the anaesthesia (money aside, there was not much to lose given the alternative). They used an "anaesthesia box" to put her under, which in my understanding is a box in which they place the piggy and add sedative gas, and then there was a nasal mask listed on her paperwork, as well. She was around 6 years old at the time and came through the anaesthesia quite well. She was a little less energetic than usual but mostly back to herself when we picked her up (no idea if the drowsiness was the anaesthesia or just the whole ordeal); she had regained most of her spunk by her follow-up appointment the next day. She lived to be just over 7 years old.

I know it's not quite the same as your piggy's situation, but I figured I'd share in case it helps to read some successful anaesthesia stories, as I know there are plenty of horror stories out there if you look for them.

 

[CTWC]

Thanks so much for your replies!
The last visit to my vet was on 19th February. I’ll revisit on 27th February.
She is given the Metacam for cats,
I think it’s strange that the vet prescribed it only once daily. Also the vet wanted to do surgery or let her go if not better in one week. I’m worried because of the risks with anesthesia and I feel like one week is very short of time to heal.

As for the bedding, I recently started using vetbed.

I was able to take a better close up of the wound today.

Morning.
Not sure if you saw it but someone on here said it can take months to heal bumble foot so not sure why your vet said a week also my Cookie had an anaesthetic as he sadly had to have an eye removed and apart from being wobbly on his feet for a few hours afterwards was fine with the anaesthetic it's self

 

[Teema]

Many thanks for your reply and for sharing this, it’s calming to hear. How old were she when going through the surgery?

Yeah my first thought was pus too, but when touched gently with a compress between it felt hard and sharp.

Pipsqueak is a rescue so we’re not 100% certain of her age, if I had to guess i’d say she’s around 3/4, especially in comparison to our ‘baby’ rescue and my most senior girl at 7. Pip has also been very underweight because of the bladder issues, and her back end had pus coming from the urethra, she really was poorly but has pulled through successfully. No matter what I think one of the most important things is to keep them eating and drinking.
It may be worth while going onto Youtube and looking at Saskia’s page, she is a guinea pig rescue in LA and really knows her stuff and has taken on some very distressed/injured guinea pigs, perhaps there may be some information (or success stories?) on her Youtube about severe cases of bumblefoot, it really helped us dealing with Pip’s bladder.
Wish you and your piggie all the best x

 

[Wiebke]

Pipsqueak is a rescue so we’re not 100% certain of her age, if I had to guess i’d say she’s around 3/4, especially in comparison to our ‘baby’ rescue and my most senior girl at 7. Pip has also been very underweight because of the bladder issues, and her back end had pus coming from the urethra, she really was poorly but has pulled through successfully. No matter what I think one of the most important things is to keep them eating and drinking.
It may be worth while going onto Youtube and looking at Saskia’s page, she is a guinea pig rescue in LA and really knows her stuff and has taken on some very distressed/injured guinea pigs, perhaps there may be some information (or success stories?) on her Youtube about severe cases of bumblefoot, it really helped us dealing with Pip’s bladder.
Wish you and your piggie all the best x

We have a few members on here with bumblefoot piggies. @Viennese Furbabies may currently be poised with her personal experience.

Can I just add that I have had many successful operations in guinea pigs of all ages, including several full emergency spays in 5 year old sows, bladder stone ops and a successful large lump removal in a sow who went on to celebrate her 7th birthday the following month. A few rescues were very borderline make or break ones where a piggy was deteriorating very quickly.

I know of several very happy tripod piggies as permanent rescue residents; they are not any slower or less active than their four legged mates.

Right now, you have to see what your vet is finding and then take it from there.

 

[Viennese Furbabies]

The treatment of bumblefoot is a marathon, not a sprint. As long as the infection doesn't spread to the bone, your girl does have a good chance to live with this condition (and your TLC).
I also knew one tripod piggy who was quite happy in himself. It wouldn't have been an option for my late Billie though, because she had arthrosis in her hind legs and spine as well.

 

[LadyC]

Thanks again for your replies! It’s greatly appreciated.
It feels good to know everything turned out well with the anesthesia.
I totally agree that bumblefoot might take weeks to months to heal, so I’m a bit worried when my vet gave me one week.
The vet wants to do a debridement surgery .

My piggy also having a Corneal ulcer, which my vet also wanted to do debridement surgery (remove dead tissue).

She also have ovarian cysts and we will try with hormone therapy.

Some personal thoughts:
For the bunblefoot, If it would have been osteomyelitis, wouldn’t legs etc became swollen?

Maybe could a toe/metacarpals have been broken? one toe is slightly pointing upwards. Then the bone piece has been placed downward and are visible in the wound?

Attached photos of the progress.

 

[eileen]

The whole foot pads appears swollen,debridement maybe a good option.i agree with others this will take months to heal.
Dakotas have taken four months of twice daily Epsom salts soaks,and flamazine.along with loxi om twice daily at 0.5mls.i can see an improvement today.vets advise.
I really hope your piggies makes progress. You are obviously a very caring owner.

 

[LadyC]

I went to the vet yesterday and they did a x-ray and it showed no good prognosis. Also they believed she has osteomalacia.
From there my vet couldn’t do anything more. We got referred to a big exotic clinic and we’ll travel in the coming days.

 

[anyar.dris]

Awww..poor baby. That x-ray doesn't look good. Hopefully something can be done. If amputation is possible and can save her life. Like what others have said, tripod piggies exist. Fingers crossed.

 

[DavRz]

Sorry you and your piggy are going through such a tough time. Wishing you and your little girl the best at the vets.

 

[eileen]

I'm sorry you are going through this osteomyelitis is inflamed and infected bones.Maybe you could suggest zithromax antibiotic,its safe for guinea pigs,flucloxcillin is best for bone infections,but must Not be used on used on guinea pigs.Stronger pain relief eg gabepentin,tramadol.
A week of treatment is early days,but you need to be guided by your vet,i had discussed at length treatments with my guinea pig savvy vet,if Dakotas bumblefoot had progressed to the bone,this is the suggested treatment prior to any surgery.
hugs to you,i hope there is a positive way forward.

 

[eileen]

i meant to add that osteomalacia,is softening of the bones due to lack of vitamin d,or other factors like calcium,but please ask your vet for advise.
I'm about to soak dakotas feet today,ill try and get photos of her bumblefoot,its difficult as i live alone !so one band photos are difficult

 

[Wiebke]

HUGS

I am very sorry but not surprised at the bad news.

Wishing you and poorly girl all the best.

 

[Wheekallweek]

Oh no, sorry to hear it's bad news
So it does look like bone coming out of the bottom of her foot! I suppose if the bones have softened it could have easily broken?
Hopefully tripod piggy is an option for her if it comes to it.