Dental Any replacement for hay? (teeth issue)

[Kimmy]

Hello!

What can I do when a piggy cannot eat hay?

My piggy had overgrown molars that cut his tongue a bit, so we rushed him to the vet. They ground his molars, gave us pain meds and sent us on our way.

He is improving (as long as we keep up the pain meds) but his jaw is weird now, looks crooked and clicking. We brought him back to the vet who basically said « oh well, that’s the way it’s gonna be now ».

He is full of life and wants to eat lots, so we feed Critical Care everyday and cut up veggies in tiny pieces. He also eats pellets (slowly). But he doesn’t eat hay anymore and I am afraid of his teeth overgrowing again and such. I grind up hay with veggies and water but he’s not too interested...

Anything else I could do if he isn’t eating hay? I want to avoid risking diarrhea and overgrowing teeth... I read about wheatgrass on a thread - is this a good alternative? I live in a downtown area without much nice clean grass to pick.

Thank you so much

 

[Piggies&buns]

I’m tagging in somebody with a lot of knowledge on dental piggies. @furryfriends (TEAS)

Is your vet guinea pig savvy?

 

[PigglePuggle]

Sounds like you need a more experienced piggy dental specialist vet, no vet should ever say after leaving a piggy unable to eat after surgery that that's an acceptable outcome! If you add your location someone can better advise on finding a good vet.
Good that you are syringe feeding to support him, keep that up- but without hay to wear down his teeth they will soon overgrow again...

 

[Bill & Ted]

Do you live in the US? There is a list of recommended vets on the Guinea Pig Lynx website. the best thing you can do for your piggie would be to find a vet who has successful experience of undertaking dentals on guinea pigs. It is a vicious circle if the teeth have not been correctly filed. The piggie cannot eat hay so the teeth grow wonky again in no time. It doesn’t have to be this way, I think your vet probably hasn’t got that dental quite right by the sounds of it. I’m really sorry for you and your piggie, I know what an awful situation you are in, ring round and see if you can’t find a more experienced vet x

Guinea Lynx :: GL's Vet List

 

[Wiebke]

Hello!

What can I do when a piggy cannot eat hay?

My piggy had overgrown molars that cut his tongue a bit, so we rushed him to the vet. They ground his molars, gave us pain meds and sent us on our way.

He is improving (as long as we keep up the pain meds) but his jaw is weird now, looks crooked and clicking. We brought him back to the vet who basically said « oh well, that’s the way it’s gonna be now ».

He is full of life and wants to eat lots, so we feed Critical Care everyday and cut up veggies in tiny pieces. He also eats pellets (slowly). But he doesn’t eat hay anymore and I am afraid of his teeth overgrowing again and such. I grind up hay with veggies and water but he’s not too interested...

Anything else I could do if he isn’t eating hay? I want to avoid risking diarrhea and overgrowing teeth... I read about wheatgrass on a thread - is this a good alternative? I live in a downtown area without much nice clean grass to pick.

Thank you so much ❤❤❤

Hi!

Please follow the tips in our syringe feeding guide, which also has a chapter on looking after dental guinea pigs.
Complete Syringe Feeding Guide

Can you please add your country, county/province or UK county to location in account details (accessed by via clicking on your username). This makes it appear with every post you make and allows us to tailor any advice straight away to what is relevant and available where you are. We have members and enquiries from all the world. In your case, this is to help you find a more competent vet as this sounds like a very bad dental treatment. Thank you!

 

[Kimmy]

Oops I am sorry I did not add my location! I am in Vancouver, Canada. My current vet is a « small animal specialist » at Capitol hill (but she still operated my piggy for a stone when he had none last year - yep, we went through surgery and recovery for nothing (( very traumatizing for my baby ) - so I would like to know if there are other good vets around...

Yesterday, my boy accepted wet/ground up hay. Is this a good option for now? If he accepts wheatgrass, is this good?

Thank you so so much

 

[Wiebke]

Oops I am sorry I did not add my location! I am in Vancouver, Canada. My current vet is a « small animal specialist » at Capitol hill (but she still operated my piggy for a stone when he had none last year - yep, we went through surgery and recovery for nothing (( very traumatizing for my baby ) - so I would like to know if there are other good vets around...

Yesterday, my boy accepted wet/ground up hay. Is this a good option for now? If he accepts wheatgrass, is this good?

Thank you so so much ❤❤❤

Yes, any grass/hay fibre is ideal, in whichever form. It is the very abrasive silica in hay that is grinding down the teeth and keeping the gut microbiome balanced. The more he can chew by himself, the better; the less his teeth will overgrow again if not ground down or ground down evenly.

Guinea pig dentals are sadly not an area that figures much or at all in vet college or practice (including exotics vets) in any country.

@Freela Do you know of a good dental vet in Vancouver or another forum member who would know?

Here is a list of recommended Canadian vets: Veterinarians: Canada - Guinea Lynx Records

 

[Bill & Ted]

Aw, your poor piggie, how awful for you both x
There is a link for Canada on the Guinea Pig Lynx website but it does not seem to be working at this moment (you could try it later) if it still does not work then email the administrator, for them to sort it.
In the meantime you are in between a rock and a hard place. Any type of hay/grass is good for grinding down their teeth but if this dental has not been properly done then your piggie is going to find it difficult to eat. Porridge oats (soaked in warm water) are good for fattening up piggies as they do lose weight if not eating properly. I would definitely look for another vet. Are there any rescues near you? Can you find out who they use? I have two piggies with dental problems. My Ted had a dental from a local vet which was poorly done, it left him unable to eat and relying on critical care food for nearly two months until I found a marvellous vet 300 miles away who filed down his teeth out without any anaesthetic, we go every 2 months now and he has done very well for over 12 months now. I sincerely hope you can find a decent vet who can sort out your piggies teeth, in the meantime hang in there x

 

[Bill & Ted]

Veterinarians: Canada - Guinea Lynx Records

It seems to be working now, I don’t know if there are any on here near you, hope so x

 

[Bill & Ted]

WCVDS | West Coast Veterinary Dental Services
There is a vet at this practice that has mentored vets at this practice according to a thread on Guinea Pig Lynx website
DR. LOÏC LEGENDRE hope this might help you

 

[Kimmy]

Thank you so much for all your help, I am so grateful

I contacted the West Coast Veterinary Dental and am waiting to hear back.

My baby didn’t accept hay today, but he was able to chomp a but of carrot on his own! So I am starting to be hopeful. I am quite upset the first vet even suggested putting him down - he is so full of life and wants to eat. Seems unfair to put down a piggy for a teeth issue...

If I had a million bucks I would pay for a centre for piggy health and have then train vets around the globe everywhere for free! So hard to find a good vet in the Canadian west coast.

 

[PigglePuggle]

Best of luck with the new vet, a good dental operation can often work miracles for piggies, while a bad dental op can make things much worse! Hope your piggies teeth can get sorted x

 

[Bill & Ted]

Thank you so much for all your help, I am so grateful ❤❤❤❤

I contacted the West Coast Veterinary Dental and am waiting to hear back.

My baby didn’t accept hay today, but he was able to chomp a but of carrot on his own! So I am starting to be hopeful. I am quite upset the first vet even suggested putting him down - he is so full of life and wants to eat. Seems unfair to put down a piggy for a teeth issue...

If I had a million bucks I would pay for a centre for piggy health and have then train vets around the globe everywhere for free! So hard to find a good vet in the Canadian west coast.

❤❤❤

I hope you get a reply from them soon. yes my local vet wanted to put Ted down too, I think it’s easier for them to say that than face the reality that they are out of their depth. Unfortunately it’s the same here, there are not many experienced dental piggie vets, they don’t get taught this at Vet School! I would do the same, set up a piggie dental training school too There are so many piggies out there suffering with their despairing owners. It looks like you might need a referral from your vet if you read their website, but don’t let that put you off, demand from your vet if needed, good luck, let us know how you get on x
PS weigh him daily so you know if to up syringe feeding or not x

 

[Kimmy]

I just wanted to keep you updated: my grinding wet hay and coaxing Merlin to eat it has been successful: he started with wet hay (and fresh wheatgrass) and now is eating some dry hay! He drinks more than usual but it seems good otherwise. I am so happy!

Only thing is: his lower incisors are growing wonky and kinda diagonal now, so he has some issues with them. I “force” him to gnaw when I feed him an Oxbow Vitamin C tablet (I hold it so he has to gnaw at it) - I figured it might help him... so far so good, but I am keeping an eye on him and weighing daily.The West Coast Dental vet has finally replied to me and said we need a referral - which I will get hopefully soon. Otherwise he is happy, finally spends more time with his brother and is very lively.

My question is: do piggies get used to wonky incisors? Would it be better for me to let him be and help him out everyday when I see he is having some difficulties, instead of many vet visits involving anaesthesia and teeth grinding/clipping? He is on a low dose of Meloxocam in case he has some pain.

thank you again so much

 

[Lady Kelly]

I would get the referral to the new vets and seek their advice. Wonky incisors is usually an indicator of overgrown back teeth. When they get overgrown they can cut the inside of the mouth and trap the tongue which is very painful. So no I would say it's not best without an expert having a look just to let him continue as he is as it might be something harder to fix in the longer term. I hope you can get him seen really soon and the new vets has more experience with guinea pigs

 

[Bill & Ted]

Best to have that check by in my view. But so glad he’s chomping again x

 

[Freela]

I'm glad he is eating again. I would likely still try to consult with the more experienced vet because, unfortunately, it's quite possible he will need more dental attention at some point in the future (generally the front teeth being uneven is a sign that things are still not quite right with the molars, even if they are better than before.) I'm in Canada too (Ontario, though) and I know how hard it is to find a vet who is good with guinea pig teeth. I had a pig with dental problems and dental abscess problems and was lucky enough to find a vet who was great with her and helped her live to the ripe old age of 7... and now he's retired, so I dread having any future pig with teeth problems because he was the only experienced vet I could find. I sure hope he trained someone else at the practice before he left. Best wishes to you and your piggie!

 

[Kimmy]

Hello again!

We finally got an appointment at West Coast veterinary dental with dr Loic Legendre this week, as recommended on the forum. They were very kind but also told us they are not guinea pig specialists... but I think that’s the best we could find, and thanks again for recommending.

They operated him again, poor bebe, and found an overgrown molar that did damage to his jaw they were’t able to repair. He may not be able to bite hard ever again but we will see. His tongue was trapped. They filed things and realigned teeth. Our boy has been back for about a day and on “soft food” (veggies, pellet mush) until tonight. He wants to eat so much...

However, the vet told us: no more veggies and pellets, only hay/grass. Is this reasonable? He doesn’t want hay at the moment, even when I grind it up to a squishy consistency, and was never a huge hay fan (even though he still ate a lot of it before his teeth issues).

This brings me back to my initial question: anything I can give to “replace” hay if he’s not a big “dry hay“ eater? He loves wheatgrass, so I give him some daily now. Is there a kind of (soft) grass he could eat all day without issues, like timothy hay? If so, I will buy any grass seeds and grow it for him! Also: he used to be a stone piggy, in case this changes anything.

Thank you again so much for listening to my troubles Everyone’s piggies are so precious

 

[Wiebke]

Hello again!

We finally got an appointment at West Coast veterinary dental with dr Loic Legendre this week, as recommended on the forum. They were very kind but also told us they are not guinea pig specialists... but I think that’s the best we could find, and thanks again for recommending.

They operated him again, poor bebe, and found an overgrown molar that did damage to his jaw they were’t able to repair. He may not be able to bite hard ever again but we will see. His tongue was trapped. They filed things and realigned teeth. Our boy has been back for about a day and on “soft food” (veggies, pellet mush) until tonight. He wants to eat so much...

However, the vet told us: no more veggies and pellets, only hay/grass. Is this reasonable? He doesn’t want hay at the moment, even when I grind it up to a squishy consistency, and was never a huge hay fan (even though he still ate a lot of it before his teeth issues).

This brings me back to my initial question: anything I can give to “replace” hay if he’s not a big “dry hay“ eater? He loves wheatgrass, so I give him some daily now. Is there a kind of (soft) grass he could eat all day without issues, like timothy hay? If so, I will buy any grass seeds and grow it for him! Also: he used to be a stone piggy, in case this changes anything.

Thank you again so much for listening to my troubles ❤ Everyone’s piggies are so precious ❤

Hi!

Sadly there are very few vets with guinea pig experience in Canada.

I am linking in @furryfriends (TEAS) for you. She runs a sanctuary for guinea pigs with chronic dental problems and is best poised to give you diet tips.
We have a chapter on looking after dental guinea pigs that are not able to eat fully on their own in our syringe feeding guide: Complete Syringe Feeding Guide

It is the abrasive silica in hay and grass that is actually responsible for grinding down the crucial molars and that are preventing overgrowth; hence your vet's diet advice.

 

[furryfriends (TEAS)]

If he can eat grass that will be just as good as eating hay. However, the advice about not feeding any veg or pellets isn't correct. The veg will help wear the teeth too, and the pellets will help keep some weight on him. I also feed dry porridge oats to the dental piggies, as these are great for weight gain too. The Oxbow Orchard Grass Hay is usually managed very well by the piggies with dental issues, as it's quite soft.

 

[Kimmy]

Hello again!

We finally got an appointment at West Coast veterinary dental with dr Loic Legendre this week, as recommended on the forum. They were very kind but also told us they are not guinea pig specialists... but I think that’s the best we could find, and thanks again for recommending.

They operated him again, poor bebe, and found an overgrown molar that did damage to his jaw they were’t able to repair. He may not be able to bite hard ever again but we will see. His tongue was trapped. They filed things and realigned teeth. Our boy has been back for about a day and on “soft food” (veggies, pellet mush) until tonight. He wants to eat so much...

However, the vet told us: no more veggies and pellets, only hay/grass. Is this reasonable? He doesn’t want hay at the moment, even when I grind it up to a squishy consistency, and was never a huge hay fan (even though he still ate a lot of it before his teeth issues).

This brings me back to my initial question: anything I can give to “replace” hay if he’s not a big “dry hay“ eater? He loves wheatgrass, so I give him some daily now. Is there a kind of (soft) grass he could eat all day without issues, like timothy hay? If so, I will buy any grass seeds and grow it for him! Also: he used to be a stone piggy, in case this changes anything.

Thank you again so much for listening to my troubles Everyone’s piggies are so precious

If he can eat grass that will be just as good as eating hay. However, the advice about not feeding any veg or pellets isn't correct. The veg will help wear the teeth too, and the pellets will help keep some weight on him. I also feed dry porridge oats to the dental piggies, as these are great for weight gain too. The Oxbow Orchard Grass Hay is usually managed very well by the piggies with dental issues, as it's quite soft.

Thank you so much! If I grow regular grass for him, since he is able to eat wheatgrass currently, is it OK to give him unlimited access to it? Or could it result in diarrhea?

He has access to orchard hay, and I even soak some in water to see if he’ll have it, but so far he is uninterested and chokes if he tries to eat it. I am trying to grind some with veggies - worked in the past, but not right now... sigh.