Winter barn advice

[RubyRuby]

Hello, I’m unfortunately not able to give my 2 long-haired girls the space they need inside next winter, so am looking at alternatives. Please could I have your honest opinions about whether this is likely to be warm, dry, and bright enough for them? I’m in the UK and would bring them in on the coldest days (probably when freezing outside but would be interested in your thresholds for bringing inside as well).

What I have available to me:
* A barn that is around the size of 5 stables (12ft x 60ft approx) - lots of changes in floor height and a leaky roof, so there’s an area around 12x12ft that is flat and mostly dry. It has windows, but is not very bright inside.
* An eglu go
* a few different sized Ferplast cages

My idea: Fence off a 12x12ft area and put shavings on the ground (extra where the roof might drip). Put the eglu go in there, stuffed with plenty of hay and perhaps covered with a duvet. Use the base of one of the cages upturned as a second hidey place, cover this with straw for insulation. I would be relying on the Guineas to avoid any wet patches after heavy rain but most of the floor space would be dry.

What do you think?

An alternative option is to somehow stack the ferplast cages and make a ramp so that they take up less floor space inside but have multiple floors. I would prefer this as I miss them when they’re outside, but I thought that more floor space in a barn might be better than multiple small floors, even if it’s a bit colder and darker…

 

[Piggies&buns]

Outdoor piggies need to be kept somewhere warm, dry and draught free. They aren't hardy and anything below 15 degrees risks them getting chilled, and they definitely need to be kept above 10 degrees.
You cannot rely on them to avoid the wet areas, unfortunately. Being cold is one thing but being damp and cold is a major risk factor in making them ill.

An Eglu is not ideal - a well insulated and large wooden hutch would be much better. Might it be an option for you to put a wooden hutch within that 12x12 area. Lock them into the hutch at night so you can be sure they are warm, dry and safe from predators. Then, provided its warm and safe enough, let them roam the 12x12 area as a playpen during the day.
While its lovely they can have a big space in the barn, keeping such a large area warm is not going to be easy and free roaming in a space of that size particularly during winter nights, might be problematic.

I know you say you dont have the space indoors for them, but how much space is available? Two sows need a minimum of 120x60cm (4ft x 2ft) as a cage on a single level but 150x60cm (5ft x 2ft) on a single level is recommended.
Stacking ferplast cages also isnt ideal if the bottom level isnt big enough - upper levels do not count towards the cage size, and piggies need a large single level area to meet size requirements, not multiple levels.

My two boys live in a 8x6ft shed. They have a 6ft hutch in there which they are locked into during winter nights but have access out of the hutch to play in the shed during the day in winter (free roam 24/7 from late spring to early autumn). I keep the hutch warm enough in winter by stuffing it full with hay, including ensuring extra hay is in hideys. They have four heat pads spread throughout the hutch (two of which are under two of the hides). The hutch is then covered with a thermal hutch cover, then two blankets, then another hutch cover (a waterproof one but being in the shed it isnt used for its waterproof properties, its purely another layer and being plastic fronted means there isnt any cold air exchanging), then a duvet over all of it to further help hold the warmth in.

The fact the shed is always slightly warmer than the outside temperature combined with the measures for the hutch which means the hutch is warmer still than inside the shed itself, I can keep the hutch warm enough - it usually sits around 12 degrees in winter. However, this only works if the outside temperature is no colder than -1 . If outside gets colder than -1, then my piggies move into the house for the remainder of the winter as it becomes unmanageable.
Once outdoor piggies have to be brought indoors due to not being able to keep them warm enough, they will then need to stay indoors for the remainder of the winter and not put back out until nights are warm enough again (usually around April time) - piggies shouldn't be exposed to changes in temperature as that can also make them ill.

Cold Weather Care For Guinea Pigs

 

[RubyRuby]

thank you, I think you just confirmed all of my concerns so I will have to have them inside. I prefer them inside anyway, I just thought the huge floor space in the barn might be nice for them. You’re right it would be hard to keep the barns warm enough if they need to be above 15 degrees.

The biggest cage I have is 4x2ft (Ferplast 120). Usually they have this plus free access to a run around 3x4ft. I don’t feel the 4x2 alone is big enough for them (especially once the beds and hay rack are put in there), but I can’t give them the extra run this winter. I have space for the cage though, which was why I considered adding one of the smaller cages on top of it (I think my other two cages are a 100cm one and an 80cm one that is my emergency “hospital” or “quarantine” cage (a rescue gave it to me when I needed to keep a neutered boar that I regimes separate for a while). My piggies could have a run around outside their cage for a few hours each day. But I tend to find that when I do that they just stick to their usual area anyway and don’t use the space.

I have seen a double-storey cage for sale second hand but the floor space per layer is only around 3x2ft I think, and the ramps look so steep with no sides! If I make my own somehow, I could make sure the ramps are safe and not steep. And the floor space would be bigger.

 

[RubyRuby]

To be honest I’m wondering if they’d be better off with someone else as I hate that I can’t give them loads of space at the moment, but I’d be so picky about who they went to that I’d find it so difficult to find anyone

 

[Siikibam]

I wouldn’t get the two storey cage. It’s unfortunately short of their space requirements on the one floor. Do you have the space to set up a play pen around the cage that they have access to 24/7?

 

[Piggies&buns]

Yes, the big space in the barn is nice for them but only if they are warm and safe in it.
Keeping the open area of the barn warm would be very difficult, but keeping a 5 or 6ft hutch in the barn warm is easier with Snugglesafe heat pads, loads of hay and hutch covers. I dont tend to find any issues or worries in keeping my boys warm enough in their shed until January/February time and of course If it is a mild winter, then its easier anyway. My warming measures in my shed/hutch have been successful for all except one winter - (late winter last year got to -9 so there was no way I could keep them outside in that and they only had to come inside for a couple of weeks).

A Ferplast 120 does meet the minimum size requirements for a pair of sows but you are right, it is tight by the time hides are are in. However, it is acceptable. Second levels doesnt make the cage any bigger so adding them isnt going to be of benefit really (its a bonus space only). Perhaps if you could tell us what size of space you have available, we may be able to think of something to help.
You say you dont have space for them inside and specifically mention this winter - have they been outside for the summer? and you're planning ahead or are they indoors already? I only ask as if they are indoors now and have been all this time, then it wouldn't be advisable to start to move them outside now anyway as it is getting a bit too late in the year for them to acclimatise to outdoor conditions.

When my boys come indoors they have much less space than they do outside but its only temporary and my indoor cages still meet size requirements and their needs so they dont tend to mind.

If you were to choose to rehome them, then surrendering them to a rescue centre is best.

 

[RubyRuby]

I wouldn’t get the two storey cage. It’s unfortunately short of their space requirements on the one floor. Do you have the space to set up a play pen around the cage that they have access to 24/7?

Thanks, I won’t get it.

Usually I would set up a play pen around the cage (that’s what I called the run) but I can’t this year. It will be back to normal following year hopefully.

 

[RubyRuby]

Yes, the big space in the barn is nice for them but only if they are warm and safe in it.
Keeping the open area of the barn warm would be very difficult, but keeping a 5 or 6ft hutch in the barn warm is easier with Snugglesafe heat pads, loads of hay and hutch covers. I dont tend to find any issues or worries in keeping my boys warm enough in their shed until January/February time and of course If it is a mild winter, then its easier anyway. My warming measures in my shed/hutch have been successful for all except one winter - (late winter last year got to -9 so there was no way I could keep them outside in that and they only had to come inside for a couple of weeks).

A Ferplast 120 does meet the minimum size requirements for a pair of sows but you are right, it is tight by the time hides are are in. However, it is acceptable. Second levels doesnt make the cage any bigger so adding them isnt going to be of benefit really (its a bonus space only). Perhaps if you could tell us what size of space you have available, we may be able to think of something to help.
You say you dont have space for them inside and specifically mention this winter - have they been outside for the summer? and you're planning ahead or are they indoors already? I only ask as if they are indoors now and have been all this time, then it wouldn't be advisable to start to move them outside now anyway as it is getting a bit too late in the year for them to acclimatise to outdoor conditions.

When my boys come indoors they have much less space than they do outside but its only temporary and my indoor cages still meet size requirements and their needs so they dont tend to mind.

If you were to choose to rehome them, then surrendering them to a rescue centre is best.

They’ve been outside since late May. The space I have in the kitchen this winter is going to be barely big enough for the big cage (we’d be tripping over it, but I don’t mind that). Other rooms aren’t suitable due to underfloor heating. The cage *may* fit in the bathroom where they could have more floor time, but not a run 24/7.
Thanks for the advice. I guess I’ll have to go with the big cage, remove their additional fluffy hideys etc to maximise space in there for running around, and just give them as much floor time as possible.

 

[Siikibam]

Could you put the cage on a stand or table in one of the rooms with underfloor heating?

 

[RubyRuby]

Could you put the cage on a stand or table in one of the rooms with underfloor heating?

I could but then I still wouldn’t be able to attach a run/play pen, so then it’s the same as having them in a cage on the floor in the kitchen or bathroom Thanks for helping me brainstorm though!

 

[Piggies&buns]

It is so lovely that you are trying to give them as much space as you possibly can but the 120cm while it isnt large, it does meet welfare needs for two sows so isnt doing them a big disservice (particularly as they are sows - I'd never suggest using it if they were boars) when the alternative is risking being too cold. Giving them floor time when you can is good.

Presumably if they are outside, then they are already in a hutch? If so, what size is it? When were you thinking you would bring them indoors?
Can you move that hutch (assuming that is what they are already in) into the barn to offer them further protection, and use warming measures (heat pads, hutch covers etc) for as long as you can to give them extra room - use a thermometer so you know exactly what is going on in the hutch - and then move them indoors when necessary.
As I said, my boars indoor cage doesnt give them the space their shed does (36 sq ft in the shed vs 12 sq ft in the house) , so when they come in, they are always in a smaller space (and they dont get floor time when in the house).

 

[RubyRuby]

It is so lovely that you are trying to give them as much space as you possibly can but the 120cm while it isnt large, it does meet welfare needs for two sows so isnt doing them a big disservice (particularly as they are sows - I'd never suggest using it if they were boars) when the alternative is risking being too cold. Giving them floor time when you can is good.

Presumably if they are outside, then they are already in a hutch? If so, what size is it? When were you thinking you would bring them indoors?
Can you move that hutch (assuming that is what they are already in) into the barn to offer them further protection, and use warming measures (heat pads, hutch covers etc) for as long as you can to give them extra room - use a thermometer so you know exactly what is going on in the hutch - and then move them indoors when necessary.
As I said, my boars indoor cage doesnt give them the space their shed does (36 sq ft in the shed vs 12 sq ft in the house) , so when they come in, they are always in a smaller space (and they dont get floor time when in the house).

Thanks for the reassurance.
No they’re not in a hutch, they’re in an eglu stuffed full of hay (never closed) with 3m run, lots of shelters in the run, a rain cover and mud mats so that it can be used in all weather. I know the eglu isn’t thought to be a good GP home but it was the only environment I found I could manage my previous GPs breathing as she reacted to everything, I don’t shut them in the house area (just make sure it’s warm) and I’ve used it ever since as I’ve never lost a GP to foxes while using it.

 

[RubyRuby]

It is so lovely that you are trying to give them as much space as you possibly can but the 120cm while it isnt large, it does meet welfare needs for two sows so isnt doing them a big disservice (particularly as they are sows - I'd never suggest using it if they were boars) when the alternative is risking being too cold. Giving them floor time when you can is good.

Presumably if they are outside, then they are already in a hutch? If so, what size is it? When were you thinking you would bring them indoors?
Can you move that hutch (assuming that is what they are already in) into the barn to offer them further protection, and use warming measures (heat pads, hutch covers etc) for as long as you can to give them extra room - use a thermometer so you know exactly what is going on in the hutch - and then move them indoors when necessary.
As I said, my boars indoor cage doesnt give them the space their shed does (36 sq ft in the shed vs 12 sq ft in the house) , so when they come in, they are always in a smaller space (and they dont get floor time when in the house).

Sorry forgot to answer you fully. I usually bring them in once nighttime temperatures drop below 8 but based on advice above that’s probably too cold for them so I guess I’ll be bringing them inside quite soon.

 

[RubyRuby]

Thanks everyone by the way for being so supportive. I was expecting some criticism (and don’t mind criticism if it helps me to improve my GPs environment) but you’ve all been so nice.