UTI & possible bladder sludge

[Grasspigs]

Hi, I recently took my 5 year old piggy Scribble to the vets as she had a symptoms of a UTI, but I was also worried about her having bladder stones because there were a lot of calcium deposits in the cage too and on her bum.

Anyway, she had an ultrasound which showed no bladder stones (a big relief!), but possibly some sludge. He prescribed Septrin for the UTI, but to go back if it didn't work, or comes back soon after and said to speak to the exotic nurse about the diet changes I was making for the calcium. She suggested Oxbow urinary support treats to give extra support for the UTI and said the diet changes sounded good.

She's been having her meds for nearly 10 days, with it almost finished and the UTI cleared up really fast, she stopped squeaking when peeing and her pee doesn't smell bad anymore.

However, I need some advice about the calcium. She still has a lot of calcium pees and on her bum, could this be bladder sludge?

I noticed the calcium for a while before I went to the vets and made diet changes recommended on this forum. They have filtered water for a few weeks now, but they are not drinking much. 1 tablespoon each of SS grain free pellets. They have low calcium veggies everyday of gem lettuce, cucumber, pepper, celery, (and coriander, which only scribble will eat), but they also get a lot of fresh grass, I normally put them in the run on good weather days for about 1 hour, sometimes longer. I know its a cup of veggies per pig, but I thought grass counted, so they get 1 cup of veggies in the morning + grass on nice days.

Is what I'm doing okay diet wise? Scribble still has a lot of calcium pees, so I am worried it could be sludge, is this something that can be treated or just managed? However, she doesn't appear to be in pain anymore, so is the calcium something I should be worried about, or just something to manage and keep an eye on in the long term?

Sorry this post is so long, but idk what to do, any advice would be appreciated.

 

[Piggies&buns]

The diet sounds fine. It’s the only part you can adjust. Diet changes takes several weeks to have any effect on the system.

Grass and hay needs to make the most of their diet. Nothing wrong with them having lots of grass if their digestion is used to it. Spring grass is more veg like whereas drier summer grass is more hay like.

Sludge can form when the bladder isn’t being flushed through. Not being big drinkers won’t help that. Feeding a fairly wet diet (I mean veg and grass, not necessarily physically wet veg) can help introduce fluid into their diet but piggies will only drink the amount they need.
Mine are not big drinkers but they get a bit more than a cup of veg each per day and they can be on the lawn 12 or so hours a day.

Any current sludge needs to be removed either through increased urination or, if there is a lot of sludge, a bladder may sometimes be needed.

Some calcium pees are normal though - it is the way excess calcium is excreted. It is if they are gritty, rather than powdery, that it is concerning.

 

[eileen]

Piggies&buns has given great advice.ive had two piggies with sludge,i found it helped to syringe feed filtered water 15 mls in the morning and 15mls in the evening,using a 1mls syringe.my exotic vet calls it a fluid challenge,i did this for 4 weeks.then reduced to 15mls a day.It seems to have got rid of the sludge.But its not a quick fix and as above treatment it takes roughly 4 weeks to see some progress.

 

[Grasspigs]

Ok, thank you, so much for the advice! Would it be necessary to syringe all 15mls, seems like a lot? I have a spare 1ml syringe from her meds but i would find it difficult to do that much as she doesnt like syringe feeding really and I think I would struggle with enough time to in the mornings. I can get to the vet again on Wednesday, so I will talk to them about what the best option is and if a bladder flush would be necessary. Can a flush only be done by experienced guinea pig vets? I go to a recommended (by a rescue and this forum) exotic vet clinic, but the veterinarian i saw last time was different than the one i saw the first time.

 

[eileen]

If its too much please do not worry.its just one way to flush,get piggie to have more water.
A bladder flush where a vet uses a catheter,or cystoscope to flush the inside of the bladder needs to be done by an experienced guinea pig vet.
I would be guided by your vet.

 

[Grasspigs]

Hi, Ive been back to the vet with Scribble but the vet said as Scribble's not showing clinical signs of pain or discomfort from bladder sludge, and Scribble did not react when the vet was feeling her bladder, then they don't want to operate, unless there is a lot of it. She recommended sticking to the diet, and she prescribed potassium citrate, to reduce the chances of any sludge forming into stones. So ive got the potassium citrate to dilute with water and syringe feed, which Ive found that Scribble is taking the water from the syringe more easily than the previous meds. I managed to give her a few syringes of water while she ate her oxbow dry treat. I think when the bottle is finished i will discuss with the vet whether its a good idea to keep her on it long term.

 

[Grasspigs]

Turns out scribble just didn't like her UTI meds, but she's taking the diluted potassium citrate, and a few syringes of water with her dry oxbow urinary treat. Both piggies dont drink much but they seem to like taking water from a syringe more than their bottle! so it gets some water into them but only as much as they want.
Do you think I should continue this if it encourages them to drink more?

 

[Grasspigs]

Also, I think they might be getting bored of the same veggies, and I'd like to give them some more variety, so would it be ok to give them some different low calcium veggies occasionally? if I made a separate post in the diet section?

 

[Piggies&buns]

Encourage them to lots of grass first and foremost.
You can add in other low calcium veg in rotation.

 

[Grasspigs]

Ok, they eat plenty of grass when they go out in their run, and I try to give them a big handful on bad weather days. But what about in late summer when there is not much grass and winter, should I give 2 cups of veg a day, instead of 1? (between both piggies)

 

[Piggies&buns]

Ok, they eat plenty of grass when they go out in their run, and I try to give them a big handful on bad weather days. But what about in late summer when there is not much grass and winter, should I give 2 cups of veg a day, instead of 1? (between both piggies)

The recommended diet is one cup per pig per day - so with two piggies you should be giving two cups a day.

Mine are on the lawn 12-14 hours a day when the weather allows, and they get their one cup of veg each

 

[Grasspigs]

Ok, so a cup each and grass, thank you!

 

[Free Ranger]

I increased drinking by adding more bottles and putting them right next to dried food and especially the bedroom areas. This meant a piggy hiding away to sleep at night didn't have to come right out to drink. One little sow turned out to be a night-time guzzler, waking me with her rattling spout!

Piggies absorb pretty much all the calcium they eat and pee out the excess. I think they're designed this way because of the constantly growing teeth. This means some milky pees which dry to a white powder are pretty typical. If a pig always pees in the same corner the build-up can look horrendous. Flora has her favourite corner and after a week you need a chisel! But she doesn't have bladder trouble because she keeps it all flushing through. Touch wood!

It's great the UTI cleared up fast - that's what you hope to see when you start ABs. It's the ones that drag on that make you doubt yourself or worry more about a secondary issue like stones and sludge. Piggies on here with problem sludge strain and cry when they pee, which comes in dribs and drabs. Here's hoping that's the last you see of her bladder worries x

 

[Grasspigs]

Ok, it just worried me that she seemed to do a lot of the calcium pees, mostly they are powdery, sometimes they do dry quite thick, she pees all over the cage too, But she is not squeeking when peeing anymore so shes not in pain which is good.