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Uti Guidance For My Boy Errol

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CDRVN

CDRVN

Junior Guinea Pig
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Hello! This is my first post!

I am an RVN in the UK and recently one of my vets at work took a look at my piggie. He's lost 105g in 1 month, he has been 1.000kg for 2 years (give or take 20g!) and now he is 0.895kg. He has also been drinking a lot!

My vet prescribed Septrin (trimethoprim and sulfamethoxazole) and I have put him on Protexin Fibreplex probiotic to avoid good gut flora deterioration. He is about 4 years old, and doesn't appear to be in pain, so we have avoided Metacam (meloxicam) for now, as if the infection has spread to his kidneys, we don't want any negative effects. His appetite is fantastic and he is very happy. And he loves the taste of both Septrin and Fibreplex!

His urine pH was 8.5, so I am looking for a way to acidify his urine. Any ideas? His bladder also had a fair amount of sludge, but no visible stones or tumours on X-Ray.

Would increasing his ascorbic acid (Vitamin C) and lowering calcium aid him? Its very difficult to find a veg that does both! Yellow peppers are a firm favourite of his anyway, and seem to be the way to go.

He has always been on Burgess Excel Mint nuggets, but I'm swapping him (and his fat friend Flynn) onto the Supreme Multi-Modal sticks.

Any other pointers would be fantastic!

Thanks in advance,
Charlotte
CDRVN
 
pH levels of guinea pig urine are typically high, 8.5 is perfectly normal. You need to look for things like blood and protein levels really.

If he has lots of bladder sludge then it's best to reduce his calcium intake and try to increase his output. Maybe give him mire floor time and try to get him to drink more.

I used a cystitis supplement called Cystease with my bladder stone boar. You can get it online but have a word with your vet about it first.

Vitamin C is important so it's best not to reduce that. But I have heard that Vitamin C supplements can do more harm than good to a healthy pig so stop them if you're using them.
 
Jaycey said:
pH levels of guinea pig urine are typically high, 8.5 is perfectly normal. You need to look for things like blood and protein levels really.
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Thankyou Jaycey! I did not know that about urine pH! I haven't got him on any additional Vit C supplements as his diet has a sufficient amount. Is that cystease the one by Ceva? I have some of that from a representative that I was going to try on my cat... but maybe I could try some Cystophan if it produces a similar desired result. Ofcourse I'll phone Protexin first for some advice beforehand. I'll try with reduced calcium veg and not worry too much about ascorbic acid content. Thanks again!
 
CDRVN said:
Thankyou Jaycey! I did not know that about urine pH! I haven't got him on any additional Vit C supplements as his diet has a sufficient amount. Is that cystease the one by Ceva? I have some of that from a representative that I was going to try on my cat... but maybe I could try some Cystophan if it produces a similar desired result. Ofcourse I'll phone Protexin first for some advice beforehand. I'll try with reduced calcium veg and not worry too much about ascorbic acid content. Thanks again!
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Yep, that's the one. It's the glucosamine that's the important ingredient so you can try other ones, or even get a vegan version from a health food shop.

My boy was also on an experimental diuretic (that was after 2 bladder stones) and a Potassium Citrate supplement. My vet wasn't sure of the Pot Cit but many people have used it with their pigs. She believed that it would have to be a massive dose to have a positive effect but that would cause other major issues from too much Pot Cit. My boy had 20mg a day.
 
Bladder sludge is a nuisance; as you probably know any bladder infections will create gaps inbetween the cells which in turn make them more likely to get infections. With my bladder piggy we would syringe her extra water every day, preferably that has been filtered in a jug. We also used Potassium Citrate successfully, the Care one from Lloyds that is used for ladies with cystitis. In addition my piggy was on monthly Cartrophen injections instead of Cystease, which is something you could try The Potassium Citrate gathers the calcium together so it is excreted but should not be used if the piggy already has a stone. We also used Cerenia short term when she had flare ups. With regards to pain relief, it is essential because piggies hide pain very well, I have used Metacam in fairly high doses prescribed by my Exotics vet & not had any piggies with kidney issues. However you could use alternative pain relief like a low dose of Tramodol. Any pain will impact on eating & that will lead to other issues such as overgrown teeth :)
 
I completely forgot about Metacam. Thanks for mentioning it @Poppy'sMum !

My boy had a fairly high dose but he had arthritis too. I also used Tramadol, but that was after his bladder stone surgeries as we refused Buprenorphine because of the negative effects on piggies.
 
I think the OP mentioned her vet didn't want to use Metacam, but as you say it's great for piggies with arthritis too :) x
 
Thankyou both for your replies, I've got lots to think about. Buprenorphine seems to be our go-to opioid. What would you recommend instead?
 
I actually don't request anything else and rely on Metacam in the first instance.

Buprenorphine can be great in certain circumstances but I've read about and had personal experience of it turning a pig into a zombie, their digestive system slowing to a stop and having no will or want to eat. My pig died because of it so I refuse it now.
 
CDRVN said:
Thankyou both for your replies, I've got lots to think about. Buprenorphine seems to be our go-to opioid. What would you recommend instead?
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Unfortunately quite a few of us have had piggies having bad side effects from it :( I can understand it's use post op, but my personal experience was not good at all. It can leave a guinea pig in a very dazed state & possibly slow the guts down as well. My pig had a bad reaction so I try to avoid it where possible.
 
I wonder whether it's the lack of knowledge about the differences between pigs and other small animals like dogs.

The buprenorphine will help them through the pain as it makes them more relaxed and less aware of what is going on, and I know if I had an operation then I would really appreciate a big dose of it.

But pigs need to be more awake, as they need to be back on their feet and eating or else their digestive system shuts down and they die. As they're a prey animal they hide pain and can cope with a lot more than I could (one of my pigs had stitches on his side abut 4 inches long and didn't care, I'd be crying in bed if I had equivalent size stitches). So pigs don't need to be knocked out, they need to eat or at least be able to swallow if we're helping them eat.
 
Poppy'sMum said:
Unfortunately quite a few of us have had piggies having bad side effects from it :( I can understand it's use post op, but my personal experience was not good at all. It can leave a guinea pig in a very dazed state & possibly slow the guts down as well. My pig had a bad reaction so I try to avoid it where possible.
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I must admit, this buprenorphine use seems to be an issue in small furries. I think it is something that my practice will have to look into. I had a boy about a year ago that had his eye removed. I think we need to be a bit more proactive with our gut-motility drugs for ill and anaesthetised piggies. One of our vets uses metoclopramide in all cases, and they all seem to do very well.
 
I love Metoclopramide! It saved my bloating pig a few times and I had it at home too to use on him if I saw any bloat issues starting up. I would highly recommend it.

I know other people have had their vets use Xantac after operations, and bloat issues, sometimes along with Metoclopramide. I've never used that one thiugh6.
 
I am starting to recommend it more to our surgeons! Zantac (ranitidine) is a favourite to be used, but metoclopramide seems to be the winner! :D
 
Shows you how much I use Zantac, I didn't spell it right, doh!

It's really cool that we have an RVN on the forum. I hope we learn lots from each other.

We also need to see Errol, it's the (unofficial) law! We need photos!
 
Jaycey said:
Shows you how much I use Zantac, I didn't spell it right, doh!

It's really cool that we have an RVN on the forum. I hope we learn lots from each other.

We also need to see Errol, it's the (unofficial) law! We need photos!
Click to expand...

Flynn is the tortie, and the black and cream is Errol. This was them the other day when I took them into work. They're such chill pigs!

Errol and Flynn.webp
 
Generally, the stance on metacam with guinea pigs seems to be shifting at the moment; it is much less damaging for their kidneys than traditionally assumed and is now routinely given by vets that see guinea pigs regularly.

There is sadly very little research on guinea pigs, and a lot of the medical treatment is extrapolated from other species. Guinea pigs have a much faster metabolism than cats or dogs, for instance.
 
@Wiebke I have considered having a blood test for him to test all organ parameters, just incase anything else is underlying. In which I could assess kidney function and make an NSAID plan. However, even at cost price, it is expensive. Meloxicam (metacam, loxicom etc) is the go to NSAID for all pigs (plus, they LOVE the honey flavour!) We use this at a much higher dose rate, similar to rabbits and other small furries, due to the metabolism issue, but as you say, not much research has been done on the actual efficacy of the drugs on the species as a whole. A lot of the exotic and veterinary textbooks that we have at work condone the use of other NSAIDs such as carprofen (rimadyl, carprieve etc) but I can't see my boy eating a chicken flavoured tablet! I'll speak to my colleague tomorrow and see about giving him some.
 
Errol1.webp
I would like to thank you all for your support with Errol. My vet and I decided to flush his bladder under sedation as upon xray examination we found it to be very sludgy. As we then had a good sample, we sent it to an external lab to have it cultured. The sample came back as sterile! So either the anitbiotics have worked, or he never actually had a uti in the first place. He still has haematuria (blood in his urine) but this is of unknown origin. He is now 0.945kg, so has gained 50g, and is closer to his standard 1kg! We will be testing his urine again soon to check if the haematuria has resolved, but things are looking up! He is looked sleepy in the attached picture as he has just been sedated and is going to sleep - although, he fought hard against the drugs!
Errol4.webp
When he was back in his kennel he was treated to a small pile of apple pieces, although his fat brother Flynn decided to eat most of them!
 
Gorgeous boys. Get better soon Errol.
And Flynn says he's not fat he's fluffy! :agr: Lol.
 
CDRVN said:
View attachment 62750
I would like to thank you all for your support with Errol. My vet and I decided to flush his bladder under sedation as upon xray examination we found it to be very sludgy. As we then had a good sample, we sent it to an external lab to have it cultured. The sample came back as sterile! So either the anitbiotics have worked, or he never actually had a uti in the first place. He still has haematuria (blood in his urine) but this is of unknown origin. He is now 0.945kg, so has gained 50g, and is closer to his standard 1kg! We will be testing his urine again soon to check if the haematuria has resolved, but things are looking up! He is looked sleepy in the attached picture as he has just been sedated and is going to sleep - although, he fought hard against the drugs!
View attachment 62751
When he was back in his kennel he was treated to a small pile of apple pieces, although his fat brother Flynn decided to eat most of them!
Click to expand...

Glad that Errol is rid of his bladder flush. What he is has been having is not UTI, but most likely a cystitis (inflammation of the bladder walls). That is caused by the constant irritation from the sludge and is also the cause for the continuing bleeding.

I would strongly recommend to give Errol either vegetarian glucosamine or a glucosamine-based cat bladder food supplement like cystease or cystophan to help replenish and strengthen the natural glucosamine coat of the irritated bladder.
Has your vet given you metacam, which is not just a painkiller, but also an anti-inflammatory that can help with the bladder trauma/irritation?

I would also recommend to adjust your diet to prevent or at least slow down the build-up of sludge again.
- filter your water irrespective of whether you live in a hard or soft water area. Minerals in the water also contribute to sludge and stones in the bladder. This is one of the most important and effective measures you can take. It can really make a big difference!
- switch to no added calcium, grain-free pellets if possible and feed pellets only in a very small amount, about a tablespoon per day.
- adjust your veg and leave out most high calcium foods (a small amount is needed to provide magnesium, which only occurs in calcium rich veg), any root and other rich veg.
The sample diet picture, minus the lettuce, is actually an example for a long term balanced bladder piggy diet, which most of our experienced long term members feed with the odd personal variation in some form or other.
Recommendations For A Balanced General Guinea Pig Diet
 
Totally agree with Wiebke, my sow had IC & would have times of blood in her urine & sometimes not, but not caused by infection. Does he go out on grass at all? I had one pig that always wee'd pink afterwards. If a stone has been ruled out In either bladder or urethra/ureter then you would be best to consider a liquid supplement like Wiebke suggests. My sow was helped greatly by monthly Cartrophen injections.
 
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