UTI/bladder problems

[Max_piggie]

Hi everyone,

I recently adopted a Guinea pig in June and since then we have had him at the vets 4 times. We brought him originally because I noticed white gritty urine marks on his bedding, we were given antibiotics that had to be put in his water but he wasn’t drinking enough so they didn’t work. We then brought him to a different vet that was better equipped to deal with small pets they checked him over felt for any stones in his bladder and told us they couldn’t feel any at the time we were sent home with antibiotics that were to be given orally through a syringe which he actually loved as they were banana flavoured. The squeaking got worse and I just knew he was in pain so we brought him back to the vets and he was x rayed. There was no sign of any stones or sludge and we were sent home with an anti inflammatory medication and told to be extra careful with his diet.

He is now on SS grain free pellets which he gets a super small amount of and he doesn’t get any veg that is super high in calcium we rotate his veg he gets romaine lettuce, peppers cucumbers ect daily. He was great for a couple of days and we really thought things were looking up. He had finally started to come out of his shell and we witnessed him “popcorn” for the very first time and he would get ecstatic when we came in the room or when he heard us rustling a bag.

But the squeaking has started again when he’s going to the toilet and he seems to be in pain. I don’t know what to do for him now. I am just so concerned. Any advice or suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

Jess&Max

 

[Piggies&buns]

I’m glad you went to the second vet. Being told to put anything in drinking water is not good advice. It means you cannot control the medication dosages at all, it changes the taste of the water and can stop them from drinking thereby risking dehydration.

Was his urine tested and bacteria found?

How long was the course the oral antibiotics from the second vet? And what were the antibiotics?
A bacterial urine infection can require a longer course or different type of antibiotic to get on top of. Not all bacteria will respond to one type.

Were the white deposits actually gritty to touch when dried or was is powdery?
Powdery is the body’s normal way of excreting excess calcium. If it happens a lot then a change in the diet can be needed.
If it is gritty then that is a problem. Those pieces of grit are crystals which when the amounts get large it forms sludge and stones. They can be painful as the sharp edges jab into the bladder and urethra during urination.
Sometimes the bladder can be cleared of grit through encouraging increased hydration and therefore increased urination - feeding a wet diet (ie through feeding plenty of veg and fresh grass, encouraging lots of drinking by having multiple water bottles and bowls around the cage). Sometimes if there is a lot of grit and sludge a bladder flush can be needed to clear it out (this must be done by a knowledgeable and experienced vet).

Changes to the diet are important but don’t make an immediate difference and won’t change anything currently going wrong (changing the diet will only stop future excess calcium and it takes weeks to do so but it won’t get rid of any current grit/sludge in the bladder).
It does sound like you have made the right changes to the diet. Do you filter his drinking water?

The alternative option is something called sterile cystitis. It is a non bacterial issue, so owners find the issue returns even after repeated courses of antibiotics, which affects the lining of the bladder and causes pain.
It can only be considered after all infection, stones and sludge is fully ruled out. It is only diagnosed by eliminating those other potential problems - there is no specific test for it.
It is a condition which cannot be cured but can be managed. It is thought to be caused by stress and is similar to the sterile cystitis seen in cats. The diet does need to be a low calcium one but flare ups of IC are thought to be caused more by changes to the diet rather than the diet itself although some piggies can be susceptible to some items ie for some piggies eating coriander for example can cause a flare.
It is managed through daily glucosamine and painkillers. You find the maintenance level of both for daily use. If there is a flare then you can temporarily increase the dosages of both to bring it back under control and then drop back to the maintenance dose.

So, I would return to the vet, discuss whether bacteria was found, whether he needs a longer/different course of antibiotics first. See whether a check for stones/sludge is needed again. If the vet can rule all of those things out then a discussion about IC.

 

[Max_piggie]

I’m glad you went to the second vet. Being told to put anything in drinking water is not good advice. It means you cannot control the medication dosages at all, it changes the taste of the water and can stop them from drinking thereby risking dehydration.

Was his urine tested and bacteria found?

How long was the course the oral antibiotics from the second vet? And what were the antibiotics?
A bacterial urine infection can require a longer course or different type of antibiotic to get on top of. Not all bacteria will respond to one type.

Were the white deposits actually gritty to touch when dried or was is powdery?
Powdery is the body’s normal way of excreting excess calcium. If it happens a lot then a change in the diet can be needed.
If it is gritty then that is a problem. Those pieces of grit are crystals which when the amounts get large it forms sludge and stones. They can be painful as the sharp edges jab into the bladder and urethra during urination.
Sometimes the bladder can be cleared of grit through encouraging increased hydration and therefore increased urination - feeding a wet diet (ie through feeding plenty of veg and fresh grass, encouraging lots of drinking by having multiple water bottles and bowls around the cage). Sometimes if there is a lot of grit and sludge a bladder flush can be needed to clear it out (this must be done by a knowledgeable and experienced vet).

Changes to the diet are important but don’t make an immediate difference and won’t change anything currently going wrong (changing the diet will only stop future excess calcium and it takes weeks to do so but it won’t get rid of any current grit/sludge in the bladder).
It does sound like you have made the right changes to the diet. Do you filter his drinking water?

The alternative option is something called sterile cystitis. It is a non bacterial issue, so owners find the issue returns even after repeated courses of antibiotics, which affects the lining of the bladder and causes pain.
It can only be considered after all infection, stones and sludge is fully ruled out. It is only diagnosed by eliminating those other potential problems - there is no specific test for it.
It is a condition which cannot be cured but can be managed. It is thought to be caused by stress and is similar to the sterile cystitis seen in cats. The diet does need to be a low calcium one but flare ups of IC are thought to be caused more by changes to the diet rather than the diet itself although some piggies can be susceptible to some items ie for some piggies eating coriander for example can cause a flare.
It is managed through daily glucosamine and painkillers. You find the maintenance level of both for daily use. If there is a flare then you can temporarily increase the dosages of both to bring it back under control and then drop back to the maintenance dose.

So, I would return to the vet, discuss whether bacteria was found, whether he needs a longer/different course of antibiotics first. See whether a check for stones/sludge is needed again. If the vet can rule all of those things out then a discussion about IC.

Thank you so much for all of this information, you have given us more info than we’ve got in 4 trips to the vet.

There was no bacteria in his urine that were aware of it wasn’t mentioned at any appointment. The marks on his bedding were gritty when dried, and the oral antibiotics from the second vet were 7 days. The anti inflammatory he is now on is called rhuenocam (don’t mind the spelling) he seemed to be doing a lot better for a couple of days no squeaking and very happy and even the inflammation on his feet pads were going down (they were inflamed from stepping in the pee). He doesn’t get any tap water whatsoever only good filtered or bottled water.

I had explained to the vet that he squeaks when passing fecal pellets also it’s not just passing urine that seems to have him in pain.
At our last visit when he was xrayed and sent home with the anti inflammatory she did say that the next step if the medication doesn’t work would more than likely be a bladder flush. Is this something to be concerned about, recovery wise?

I have been doing some research around the best small animal vet in Northern Ireland as that’s where we are, although the care from the second vet was a hell of a lot better than the first I am still not happy with the vague information we get and being handed medication that just doesn’t work. I have emailed 2 places that are specifically for small animal care I am hoping to hear back from them on Monday.

 

[Piggies&buns]

Thank you so much for all of this information, you have given us more info than we’ve got in 4 trips to the vet.

There was no bacteria in his urine that were aware of it wasn’t mentioned at any appointment. The marks on his bedding were gritty when dried, and the oral antibiotics from the second vet were 7 days. The anti inflammatory he is now on is called rhuenocam (don’t mind the spelling) he seemed to be doing a lot better for a couple of days no squeaking and very happy and even the inflammation on his feet pads were going down (they were inflamed from stepping in the pee). He doesn’t get any tap water whatsoever only good filtered or bottled water.

I had explained to the vet that he squeaks when passing fecal pellets also it’s not just passing urine that seems to have him in pain.
At our last visit when he was xrayed and sent home with the anti inflammatory she did say that the next step if the medication doesn’t work would more than likely be a bladder flush. Is this something to be concerned about, recovery wise?

I have been doing some research around the best small animal vet in Northern Ireland as that’s where we are, although the care from the second vet was a hell of a lot better than the first I am still not happy with the vague information we get and being handed medication that just doesn’t work. I have emailed 2 places that are specifically for small animal care I am hoping to hear back from them on Monday.

Giving antibiotics for a bacterial urine infection is always the first step with these, whether the urine is tested or not.
7 days of antibiotics for a urine infection may not be enough, we see some piggies needing to be on them for several weeks. There are different types which can be tried if one doesn’t work.
If he doesn’t have bacteria and the issue is grit, then that requires different steps.

A bladder flush isn’t surgery as such so there isn’t much in the way of recovery.
If it is only that he has grit (not any infection), then flushing it out should solve the immediate issue - without sharp pieces of grit in there then his pain should reduce (although he may still be sore). It’s then just going forward - making sure he has good hydration and good frequent urination to keep the bladder emptying properly. And checking the diet to ensure a good balance. Too little calcium can cause problems as well as too much calcium - it’s about finding the right level for your own area.

Is he getting the rheumocam twice a day?

Be careful with bottled water, do your research on it, not all is suitable and can in fact be higher in calcium
All About Drinking And Bottles

 

[Max_piggie]

Giving antibiotics for a bacterial urine infection is always the first step with these, whether the urine is tested or not.
7 days of antibiotics for a urine infection may not be enough, we see some piggies needing to be on them for several weeks. There are different types which can be tried if one doesn’t work.
If he doesn’t have bacteria and the issue is grit, then that requires different steps.

A bladder flush isn’t surgery as such so there isn’t much in the way of recovery.
If it is only that he has grit (not any infection), then flushing it out should solve the immediate issue - without sharp pieces of grit in there then his pain should reduce (although he may still be sore). It’s then just going forward - making sure he has good hydration and good frequent urination to keep the bladder emptying properly. And checking the diet to ensure a good balance. Too little calcium can cause problems as well as too much calcium - it’s about finding the right level for your own area.

Is he getting the rheumocam twice a day?

Be careful with bottled water, do your research on it, not all is suitable and can in fact be higher in calcium
All About Drinking And Bottles

He is on 2ML once daily

 

[Piggies&buns]

Ok. Piggies metabolise pain meds in around 12 hours so vets usually prescribe a dosage to be split and given twice a day. We can’t advise you to actually do that though - you should discuss it with your vet.

 

[Max_piggie]

Ok. Piggies metabolise pain meds in around 12 hours so vets usually prescribe a dosage to be split and given twice a day. We can’t advise you to actually do that though - you should discuss it with your vet.

We are waiting to hear back from a specialist vet better equipped for Guinea pig care, we just want to know what’s going on with him and how we can help him. It’s horrible hearing him in pain