Unusual illness?

[The Fluffy Tribe]

Hello everyone. I have a question that I'm hoping someone here may be able to help me with as i've been to the vets 4 times and even the cavy expert is stumped as to what is wrong.
My little bumble has been a bit stuffy from the beginning of the year-he suddenly got a very bad nosebleed on the 13th of january which lasted an hour, i was scared i was gonna lose him that night. Thankfully the nosebleed stopped and i took him to the vet the next day. They gave me baytril and metacam and he was fine for a few days, he sounded stuffy but no discharge. A few days later when I was running low on the meds he started getting a snooty nose again so i took him down and they checked him up and gave me the same perscription. We thought he may have hayfever so i removed hay from his diet but he still gets pellets and lots of fruit and veg and water.

Its the 7th of febuary now and he still has a whistle when he breathes. We are stumped because hes been acting normal-he eats and drinks and wheeks and runs around but i am very concerned because his poops are tiny which i have read means hes not getting enough calories despite us making sure he eats (we have these grass dogbeds i made which i have been putting him on to replace not giving him hay) not to be dramatic but could this be something very serious like cancer? I lost 5 of my piggies last year in the space of 2 months for unbeknown reasons, this little guy is really holding out i want to do the best for him.

Heres a picture of him

 

[Merab]

What a gorgeous piggy.
Sorry that I cannot advise but want to offer support.
Mystery illness is the worst to deal with

 

[Piggies&buns]

Did the vet tell you to remove hay from his diet? Doing so is a major thing because hay and grass is the most important part of the diet, it’s 80% of the daily food intake. If he has small poops then it’s because he isn’t getting enough. Veg and pellets are jointly only 20% of the diet.
Are you weighing him regularly?
If you are concerned his wheezing is because of the hay, then try a different type of hay and ensure it is dust extracted.
Does he live inside or outside?
Have you checked for environmental factors ie indoors it can be dry air from radiators, other irritants such as candles, perfumes, hay dust or dust from bedding
Has the vet checked if there is something stuck up his nose?

 

[The Fluffy Tribe]

Did the vet tell you to remove hay from his diet? Doing so is a major thing because hay and grass is the most important part of the diet, it’s 80% of the daily food intake. If he has small poops then it’s because he isn’t getting enough. Veg and pellets are jointly only 20% of the diet.
Are you weighing him regularly?
If you are concerned his wheezing is because of the hay, then try a different type of hay and ensure it is dust extracted.
Does he live inside or outside?
Have you checked for environmental factors ie indoors it can be dry air from radiators, other irritants such as candles, perfumes, hay dust or dust from bedding
Has the vet checked if there is something stuck up his nose?

We removed the hay because he started sneezing and getting runny nose and it died down. When we reintroduced the hay he got very bad and very wheezy and snotty. We use timothy hay and because my other 3 piggies were fine we assumed he may have hayfever.
We do weight him regulary, he gained a few grams but then lost them, so hes back to his starting weight (.82)
Been keeping him inside since january (the others have their own shed outside) seperated him from his cagemate because we dont know if what he has is contageous. didnt want to seperate them as i dont like either of them being sad but as his cagemate is elderly i dont want to risk if its an infection.
yeah we thought maybe indorr radiators so we were going to try and put him back outside for the night to see how he does.
we did think the nosebleed was caused by something stuck up his nose but the vet didnt check yet as she said he will need an x-ray and she couldnt schedule one for then.

 

[Wiebke]

Hi and welcome

How piggy savvy is your vet and which country are you in?
How long have you had your piggies and what age are they?
How long did your piggy have baytril for and has your vet considered other antibiotics?

Has your vet checked for:
a) something like a piece of hay stuck in the nose or a tooth growing the wrong way round into the nose (the latter is rare but not unkown)
b) considered polyps
c) worst case scenario - a potential brain tumor? (The only warning I had with my Carwyn was a one-off nose bleed/big bloody sneeze two months before he started hemorrhaging and had to be euthanized after showing some vague symptoms of not being well that my vet could not pin down in the 2-3 weeks leading up to the end).

Please reinstate hay into the diet asap. It should make around 75-80% of the daily food intake and is the one part of the diet that is non-negotiable because the digestive system is entirely laid out for a mainly fresh and dry grass (i.e.hay) based diet; as is the growth rate of the crucial grinding back teeth which have evolved in a perfect balance against the very abrasive silica in grass. There is not enough silica and fibre in pellets and fruit to grind down the molars enough. The small poos are a very fat clue that your piggy is not getting enough fibrous food and is losing weight quickly.
Allergies do not usually come on suddenly in guinea pigs; and certainly not with a nosebleed. The symptoms (starting with a nose bleed) do not support this diagnosis.
I would also recommend looking at different dust-extracted hay brands and varieties.
If necessary, wash the hay and dry it again to remove any dust.

When you look up pellets, they are actually very low in fibre and - in combination with a preferably green and leafy veg and fresh herb (but minimal fruit, root veg and grains) - basically fills the supplementary role that wild forage used to have for those trace elements that the nutritious grass-fibre based diet does not supply. Fresh grass is actually high in vitamin C and the reason why guinea pigs never had the need to make their own.
Too much sugary fruit, veg and pellet fillers can derail the gut microbiome and promote the overgrowth of the wrong kind of bacteria, which can add bloating and diarrhea to your woes in the medium to longer term
Baytril can additionally dampen/kill the appetite in addition to the need to breathe coming before the need to drink and only thirdly the neet to eat.

Please take the time to read the very practical and detailed information in these links here, which you will find very helpful:
Long Term Balanced General And Special Needs Guinea Pig Diets
A Comprehensive Hay Guide for Guinea Pigs (incl. providers in several countries)

Weight - Monitoring and Management (one of your most important life-long health monitoring tools)
How To Pick Up And Weigh Your Guinea Pigs Safely
Not Eating, Weight Loss And The Importance Of Syringe Feeding Fibre
Emergency, Crisis and Bridging Care until a Vet Appointment
Probiotics, Recovery Foods And Vitamin C: Overview With Product Links (timothy hay based recovery formula is the best replacement for a guinea pig off their appetite and not eating enough hay)

Please see your vet again and ask for a scan or x-ray of the nose/head.

 

[The Fluffy Tribe]

Hi everyone, came back to give an update, and apologies for not replying sooner.
I did reintroduce hay into his diet, and his poops went back to normal
I took bumble to the vet several times, they did checks and could not determine what was wrong as despite breathing loudly his behaviour, eating, weight were all fine. They were puzzled. The baytril didnt seem to be doing anything so the vet switched over to sulfatrim, the next day he was on his side and died 3 hours later. This happened last sunday and I was devastated.
I looked up sulfatrim to see if there were stories about it being fatal with guinea pigs and didnt find any. I was sent home from work last week because I couldnt stop crying. My mum says it was just his time and my step dad said I did all I could, he had been like this since January and was over 4 years old (4 years and 1 month when he passed).
I Just wanted to say thank you to all the support I have gotten though here and would like to contribute more in future. Heres a video of bumble with my other piggies 4 days before he passes, you can probably hear his breathing on the video if its high enough.

 

[Merab]

I am so very sorry that you lost Bumble.
You gave him a wonderful life and the best possible care.
Be gentle with yourself as you grieve
Hugs

 

[weepweeps]

I’m so sorry you lost gorgeous Bumble. You definitely did all you could for him. Popcorn free over the bridge. Take care.