Trio Of Boars Not Working Out - Post Separation Advice Needed

[LordCrimble]

Hi all!

First time posting so hopefully this is the right place. I stumbled upon the separation guide and found it quite useful!

I have 3 boars that were a few weeks old when I purchased them (bad advice from the shop otherwise would have gotten 2) and they are now 6 months old. I have had to separate one of them tonight leaving the other two together. Basically my largest is bullying the middle one and then the smallest who is pretty chill just stays out of the way. Seems like the larger two can't agree who is the alpha. It has gotten to the point that the middle one has received some scratches to the face and a torn ear (he's ok now)

Tonight (with some advice from an experienced friend) we removed the middle one as the bond between the largest and smallest seems to be great and I think they'll get on fine together. I just need some advice on what to do with the middle one. I have read the separation guide and I don't want to give him away, I don't think there's any hope of them ever getting on and I don't want to risk it/stress them out. We currently have them in a garage with a 4ft two-storey hutch, I was about to get them an attachable run as well to double their space but I don't see the point now (they spend lots of time outdoors in a separate run and indoors when the weather isn't great)

I was thinking of getting a new 6ft double hutch (one without the ramp so they can live on top of each other) and then getting the separated boar neutered and finding him a sow. What do you guys think? The other option is letting them live side by side but space is a bit limited so I don't know if I could do this. I also like the idea of them both being in a pair.

Thanks in advance

 

[Piggies&buns]

Welcome and I’m sorry to hear you’ve been another victim of bad pet shop advice.

You definitely need to get a 6ft hutch. A 4ft hutch is not big enough for two boars to live in and it certainly wasn’t big enough for three (three boars would need a 10ft hutch to have anywhere near enough territory each, which does not exist commercially). A boar pair need to live in a 6ft hutch as recommended but no smaller than a 5ft hutch.

While he is single he does need to live alongside the other two for constant interaction through the bars (living separated in a two storey hutch just won’t work as it removes all ability to interact). The six week post neuter wait to become infertile would simply be too long to live without interaction.

Also, you would need to be very careful in introducing a sow into the same room where a bonded boar pair live. It can produce quite a reaction in boars who are not used to sow pheromones with the potential to cause problems in the bond of the bonded boar pair.
If you must have a sow in the garage near the pair then the boar/sow pair would need to live at the bottom of a two storey hutch so stray poops etc cant fall to the boar pair. You would also need to ensure you deal with the boar pair first so as to not risk transferring sow smells into them.

If you did choose to keep him single and have them live side by side, the pair still need a 6ft hutch but the single could live in the 4ft hutch (4ft being the minimum for a single piggy). The issue you would face is that side by side living with hutches is pretty difficult to achieve constant through the bar interaction. As they are in a garage you could remove side panels and staple wire on but that obviously won’t help if Physical space for the hutches isn’t there.

A Comprehensive Guide to Guinea Pig Boars
Boars: Teenage, Bullying, Fighting, Fall-outs And What Next?

 

[Bill & Ted]

Hello and welcome to the forum
Sadly trio’s rare work as three boars find it difficult to sort out who’s boss. Your boys have also hit the teenage stage between. 4 - 14 months, 6 months is the peak time for testosterone spikes too.

Please make arrangements for your single piggie to live side by side to the other two so he still has company. This will give you time to consider what to do. A double hutch is not great for side by side living. Your best bet might be to find a rescue who would boar date your piggie for you and find him a companion who he likes

You could get him neutered and then find a female companion too after his 6 weeks safety wait, that pair will need to be below your other boars as female hormones can upset boar pairs and make them fall out

 

[LordCrimble]

Welcome and I’m sorry to hear you’ve been another victim of bad pet shop advice.

You definitely need to get a 6ft hutch. A 4ft hutch is not big enough for two boars to live in and it certainly wasn’t big enough for three (three boars would need a 10ft hutch to have anywhere near enough territory each, which does not exist commercially). A boar pair need to live in a 6ft hutch as recommended but no smaller than a 5ft hutch.

While he is single he does need to live alongside the other two for constant interaction through the bars (living separated in a two storey hutch just won’t work as it removes all ability to interact). The six week post neuter wait to become infertile would simply be too long to live without interaction.

Also, you would need to be very careful in introducing a sow into the same room where a bonded boar pair live. It can produce quite a reaction in boars who are not used to sow pheromones with the potential to cause problems in the bond of the bonded boar pair.
If you must have a sow in the garage near the pair then the boar/sow pair would need to live at the bottom of a two storey hutch so stray poops etc cant fall to the boar pair. You would also need to ensure you deal with the boar pair first so as to not risk transferring sow smells into them.

If you did choose to keep him single and have them live side by side, the pair still need a 6ft hutch but the single could live in the 4ft hutch (4ft being the minimum for a single piggy). The issue you would face is that side by side living with hutches is pretty difficult to achieve constant through the bar interaction. As they are in a garage you could remove side panels and staple wire on but that obviously won’t help if Physical space for the hutches isn’t there.

A Comprehensive Guide to Guinea Pig Boars
Boars: Teenage, Bullying, Fighting, Fall-outs And What Next?

Thanks for the advice, when you say they need a 6ft and not 4ft are you not counting the extra storey? Mine is 4ft but has two levels with a ramp. They spend all day going back and forth between the levels.

 

[Piggies&buns]

Thanks for the advice, when you say they need a 6ft and not 4ft are you not counting the extra storey? Mine is 4ft but has two levels with a ramp. They spend all day going back and forth between the levels.

The upper storey doesn’t count towards or double the cage size.
It is only the one (bottom) level which counts as piggies are ground roaming, don’t naturally like to climb and need their space to meet requirements on the single level. Therefore a 4ft hutch covers 8 sq ft on the bottom level but doesn’t become 16 sq ft by being a double hutch, it’s still only 8 and consequently doesn’t give a boar pair enough space and well below what is required for a boar trio.
It is fine to have a two storey hutch with a ramp though but it needs to be a 6ft hutch to be the right size, with the upper level being considered as just a bonus space.

(For two boars -
a 5ft hutch (10sq ft) is the minimum size they should be in but may still be too small for some pairs.
A 6ft hutch (12 sq ft) is the recommended size and gives them the best chance of not having lack of space induced fall outs.)

When attempting a boar trio, normal cage sizing rules don’t apply and the space needed is greatly beyond due to the fact boar trios find it very hard to get on and need a huge amount more territory (mainly so they can get away from each other).
A boar trio need at least 33 sq ft on a single level and there is no commercial hutch that covers that. (To be clear even with a minimum of 33 sq ft, it still doesn’t mean a boar trio will work because their characters most often clash in a trio with two trying to be dominant)

Cage Size Guide

 

[LordCrimble]

The upper storey doesn’t count towards or double the cage size.
It is only the one (bottom) level which counts as piggies are ground roaming, don’t naturally like to climb and need their space to meet requirements on the single level. Therefore a 4ft hutch covers 8 sq ft on the bottom level but doesn’t become 16 sq ft by being a double hutch, it’s still only 8 and consequently doesn’t give a boar pair enough space and well below what is required for a boar trio.
It is fine to have a two storey hutch with a ramp though but it needs to be a 6ft hutch to be the right size, with the upper level being considered as just a bonus space.

(For two boars -
a 5ft hutch (10sq ft) is the minimum size they should be in but may still be too small for some pairs.
A 6ft hutch (12 sq ft) is the recommended size and gives them the best chance of not having lack of space induced fall outs.)

When attempting a boar trio, normal cage sizing rules don’t apply and the space needed is greatly beyond due to the fact boar trios find it very hard to get on and need a huge amount more territory (mainly so they can get away from each other).
A boar trio need at least 33 sq ft on a single level and there is no commercial hutch that covers that. (To be clear even with a minimum of 33 sq ft, it still doesn’t mean a boar trio will work because their characters most often clash in a trio with two trying to be dominant)

Cage Size Guide

Great! So another thing the pet shop lied about. They told me it was the perfect size...

 

[Piggies&buns]

Great! So another thing the pet shop lied about. They told me it was the perfect size...

I suspected that is what you would say.
Sadly we find it happens often and it is not fair on owners who made purchases of hutches and bring home boar trios in good faith. My guess is that staff aren’t aware of the actual requirements of piggies, not necessarily that it was a deliberate lie.

A 4ft hutch covers basic welfare minimum but only really for two sows, and even for two sows we would advise to go to a 5ft hutch.

Sometimes a boar trio does work out but only if the boars are laid back and properly character matched. That rarely happens in young pet shop piggies who are just put together for sale. A 4ft hutch would always be a problem even if they did get on though.
They are perhaps ok as babies (it’s about companionship) but once the teens and hormones hit things usually change.
You need one dominant and everybody else to be prepared to fall into second and third position but that doesn’t usually happen with boars and instead you end up with two dominant who fall out.

If you did decide to get your single piggy a boar friend then it is definitely safest to do so with the help of a rescue centre. If he is dominant, he needs to be paired with a piggy who is known to be submissive. The other reason to use a rescue for help is bonding teenage boars is a bit harder due to the hormones. It would ensure you don’t end up with another dominant and therefore another single piggy.

 

[LordCrimble]

After your great advice I don't think getting a 6ft double (a separate level each) will work as like you said they will need to see each other after neutering. So what do you think of this plan;

I keep the 4ft 2-storey hutch for my single boar so that i don't have to mess about selling it (i'll scrub it well to remove any smell)
I'll then buy a new 6 ft 2-storey hutch and join them together with bars in between (bars on one level or both you reckon?) I'll use some existing bedding so the new cage smells like their old one as to not upset them too much.
They'll have a run in the garden and also in the house during winter.

I'll give it some time before perhaps introducing a 2nd to the single boar (and i can pop the side panel back on, sell it and then upgrade that to a 6ft one as well)

Would this be sensible?

 

[Piggies&buns]

After your great advice I don't think getting a 6ft double (a separate level each) will work as like you said they will need to see each other after neutering. So what do you think of this plan;

I keep the 4ft 2-storey hutch for my single boar so that i don't have to mess about selling it (i'll scrub it well to remove any smell)
I'll then buy a new 6 ft 2-storey hutch and join them together with bars in between (bars on one level or both you reckon?) I'll use some existing bedding so the new cage smells like their old one as to not upset them too much.
They'll have a run in the garden and also in the house during winter.

I'll give it some time before perhaps introducing a 2nd to the single boar (and i can pop the side panel back on, sell it and then upgrade that to a 6ft one as well)

Would this be sensible?

Yes that would work for the hutches. A 4ft hutch is ok space wise for the single piggy to live in.
I would put wire panels on both the top and bottom levels of both hutches. You don’t need to join the hutches together as such, just as long as both have wire sides and the hutches are next to each other to enable interaction .
I would put their hay at the opposite side to the wire partition so that they are not forced to eat along the divider. You will most likely see territorial behaviours at the divider while they mark their territories - things like laying each side of the divider and rumbling along the divider. They are not signs that they want to be together.

(If you intend to buy a 6ft double hutch for the pair now, then for the future once the single piggy has a new friend you wouldn’t actually need to buy a second 6ft hutch. Once the single has a friend, all you would need to do is block the ramp off to make two separate ‘flats’ and keep one pair of boars at the top of the 6ft hutch, and the other pair in the bottom. It would save space if things are tight and obviously money as you wouldn’t need to buy yet another hutch).

Make sure the garden run/winter run indoors is still big enough on each side when split/buy another garden run and put it alongside the existing one.

It’s a bit of a pain to manage a separation but it can be done. I’ve had to do it myself - I took on a pair of young boars when they were 9 weeks old but their bond sadly broke down when they hit 18 weeks of age. They are now 9 months old and have lived separated but side by side ever since. I also have a pair of bonded 5 year old boars.
The pair live in the top of a double hutch. One single boar lives in the bottom and the other single lives in a cage which butts up against the wire door of the bottom hutch in an L shape to enable both singles interaction. My boys live in my shed.

 

[LordCrimble]

Hey, I forgot to update you but I took your advice and got them a second hutch and then I joined them together with a divider. They are like arguing neighbors but I think they are happy with the new arrangement. They spend most of the time chatting through the bars and every now and again ill see them all sitting together pretty chilled out. Thanks again for your help!

 

[Piggies&buns]

That looks like it works brilliantly!