Thickened bladder wall and bladder tumour ... treatments?

[Littlepaws1999]

Hello everyone!
I’m seeking advice on my 6 year old guinea pig who has been recently diagnosed with a thickened bladder wall and a bladder tumour.

I have read through some previous posts on using cystease and piroxicam as a treatment for this. Would it be possible to get more information on how it worked, and dosages which I can suggest to my vet?

At this point she’s had 3 ultrasounds a couple months apart and only given metacam to control any pain. With her recent ultrasound the vet said that she also has distension for her right ureter and mild ascites. Other than this she is acting normal, no blood in the urine, etc.. With her age I’m hesitant to put her through an operation as I worry she won’t make it through. My vet agrees it can be iffy on recovery. A surgery would also be partly spraying her as she also has an ovarian cyst.

She was just given an estimated 2 months to live. But I hope to be able to buy her some time with trying the above medications.
I’m going to call the vet to see what they say but they have not offered any drugs like this thus far. My view is I’d rather try it then later regret not trying.

I’d love to hear anyone’s opinion/suggestions.

 

[Wiebke]

Hello everyone!
I’m seeking advice on my 6 year old guinea pig who has been recently diagnosed with a thickened bladder wall and a bladder tumour.

I have read through some previous posts on using cystease and piroxicam as a treatment for this. Would it be possible to get more information on how it worked, and dosages which I can suggest to my vet?

At this point she’s had 3 ultrasounds a couple months apart and only given metacam to control any pain. With her recent ultrasound the vet said that she also has distension for her right ureter and mild ascites. Other than this she is acting normal, no blood in the urine, etc.. With her age I’m hesitant to put her through an operation as I worry she won’t make it through. My vet agrees it can be iffy on recovery. A surgery would also be partly spraying her as she also has an ovarian cyst.

She was just given an estimated 2 months to live. But I hope to be able to buy her some time with trying the above medications.
I’m going to call the vet to see what they say but they have not offered any drugs like this thus far. My view is I’d rather try it then later regret not trying.

I’d love to hear anyone’s opinion/suggestions.

Hi and welcome

I am very sorry for the bad news.

It sounds rather like she has had a stone passing from the kidneys into the bladder and staying there for a while to cause some damage at some time before being passed out; especially if the stone happened to be very uneven or a scratchy conglomerate of small crystals, like my Minx had 15 years ago. She developed a cancerous polyp in her bladder in the wake of bladder stone operation. Sadly while she made it through a second bladder stone op a year later (including polyp removal), the trauma in her bladder was just too great.

Metacam (active ingredient: meloxicam) is both a painkiller and an anti-inflammatory designed to reduce any swelling, so it is the right medication in the absence of a stone and an acute cystitis (bladder infection).
Piroxicam is another anti-inflammatory medication from the oxicam family.

We recommend glucosamine (which is classed as food supplement and not as medication) to help with the comfort in the bladder to help support the natural glucosamine coating in the urinary tract that prevents corrosive urine from coming into direct and painful contact with raw tissue. A thickened bladder wall is generally the result of a long term irritation in the bladder, either a stone or an infection so while you can gradually relax it to some extent, it is not something that happens in a matter of days.
The easiest way of dosing it is by googling for glucosamine based cat bladder supplement capsules; just empty the powdery contents of 1 capsule into 2 ml of water, mix until it is absorbed and dissolved. You can either give 1 ml of the solution twice daily or 2 ml every 24 hours. Always shake well before use. A small vet medicine bottle is ideal for the mixing.
The most common UK brand is called cystease; you may need to google for your corresponding Canadian brand names but they are usually quite easy to find to buy online.
It is not a life-prolonging measure but one that additionally helps to heal the bladder damage; it needs a bit of time to build up, though.


I would strongly recommend that you turn the clock back to zero and cherish every day longer in 'overtime' with your girl as a special gift; it is helping me make the best of the time left with my own piggies that have an incurable problem.
Concentrate on filling every day with joy, love and enrichment so you create plenty of precious memories that are going to help you through the grieving process, which starts the moment you get the bad news; in fact, what you are experiencing now is the second worst part of it - the shock moment. Unlike a sudden death where you have the shock and the pain of the loss to cope with at the same time, the hidden gift with being aware that the time with your girl is limited is that it is entirely within your control what you make of this period - it is as bitter or as sweet as you choose once you get over the immediate shock. Unfortunately, we can never choose when and what from our beloved ones will die; we can only make every day count we have with them and give them what guinea pigs measure their lives by - happy todays.
You may find the information and tips in these guides here helpful:
Enrichment Ideas for Guinea Pigs
A Practical and Sensitive Guide to Dying, Terminal Illness and Euthanasia in Guinea Pigs

 

[Littlepaws1999]

Thank -you so much for the response.
Would pure glucosamine capsules for humans be safe/ act in the same way? Or what about liquid glucosamine for cats/dogs? I assume the liquid might be to potent...?

And yes I do cherish every moment with her. Her name is Caramel. I of course dont ever want to see her suffer, but if theres anyway to slightly increase her time here, I am willing to try. I unexpectedly lost her cage mate about a year ago. And she is now my second piggy under palliative care. My other girl Zora (approaching 7 years old) has arthritis and what we assume to be thyroid issues or other organ issues from her sudden weight loss (we are unable to pull blood on her since she is so tiny for a clear diagnosis). It’s hard when there isn’t much to do for them.

 

[Wiebke]

Thank -you so much for the response.
Would pure glucosamine capsules for humans be safe/ act in the same way? Or what about liquid glucosamine for cats/dogs? I assume the liquid might be to potent...?

And yes I do cherish every moment with her. Her name is Caramel. I of course dont ever want to see her suffer, but if theres anyway to slightly increase her time here, I am willing to try. I unexpectedly lost her cage mate about a year ago. And she is now my second piggy under palliative care. My other girl Zora (approaching 7 years old) has arthritis and what we assume to be thyroid issues or other organ issues from her sudden weight loss (we are unable to pull blood on her since she is so tiny for a clear diagnosis). It’s hard when there isn’t much to do for them.

You can give tablets but you need to work out the correct dosage, cut the tablets with tablet cutter from pharmacy into the required size and grind them down into a powder before you mix with water. Or you grind down a whole tablet with a pestle and then mix with the same amount of ml as you get dosages out of a tablet. Please also take into considerations that tablets are supposed to be swallowed whole so they do not taste as nice as the capsule powder, which generally goes down much better in my own experience. I have no experience with liquid glucosamine but again, you need to calculate the dosage yourself.
Some people prefer vegetarian glucosamine tablets because most products are made with a ground seashell base as the ideal carrier.
The capsules contain 125mg of glucosamine per capsule; the UK brand has also got added L-trytophan and halyuric acid for the urinary tract (cats are the other species prone to urinary tract problems).

Wishing you plenty of happy days with Caramel. I currently have got three 7 years olds, one of which is sadly in kidney failure and won't likely be with me for very much longer, so I feel for you.
Old age doesn't come on its own, unfortunately. The more you exclude the easily preventable illnesses, the more complex health issues you tend to come up against. Guinea pigs have a much faster metabolism so old age is very much in fast forward. It doesn't get any easier and apart from issues down to lack of good care, you don't get a choice.

Be proud to have piggies that have reached and surpassed the average healthy life expectancy (i.e. have beaten over 50% of all piggies) and cherish your remaining time for as long as you have got. You grieve as much as you love, so there is never a good time or a perfect age to say goodbye; it all depends on the quality of the bond you have with every individual piggy. But it does help if you can let a piggy go knowing that you have done your utmost to give them a good and happy piggy life while they were with you, however long or short that is because that can help to ease the inevitable soul-searching at the onset of your grieving process.

 

[Littlepaws1999]

So my vet shut down both trying Piroxicam and cystease/ glucosamine.

She stated that the piroxicam has a narrow safety margin and that cystease is a mixture of amino acids that relieves stress from urinary problems in cats caused by stress (stating that Caramels issues are not from stress)... Also that it would acidify her urine when piggy’s have alkaline urine.

I’m at a loss.

 

[Wiebke]

So my vet shut down both trying Piroxicam and cystease/ glucosamine.

She stated that the piroxicam has a narrow safety margin and that cystease is a mixture of amino acids that relieves stress from urinary problems in cats caused by stress (stating that Caramels issues are not from stress)... Also that it would acidify her urine when piggy’s have alkaline urine.

I’m at a loss.

Did they also rule out plain glucosamine? Your case is different because you do not have an acute stone or infection issue.

And what level of metacam have they prescribed?

 

[Littlepaws1999]

Metacam is 0.15 ml twice a day.

She didnt really comment on plain glucosamine. I know the importance of consulting the vet with these things, but I almost feel like going ahead and trying plain capsules if there would be no negative effects. I personally do not see any issues with using glucosamine as my vet previous recommended it for my dog. I only say this because of how shut down I feel. Dont get me wrong, I am hoping to enter the veterinary field in a few years so I would not normally go against what the vet says ( I have just applied for vet schooling).

 

[Wiebke]

Metacam is 0.15 ml twice a day.

She didnt really comment on plain glucosamine. I know the importance of consulting the vet with these things, but I almost feel like going ahead and trying plain capsules if there would be no negative effects. I personally do not see any issues with using glucosamine as my vet previous recommended it for my dog. I only say this because of how shut down I feel. Dont get me wrong, I am hoping to enter the veterinary field in a few years so I would not normally go against what the vet says ( I have just applied for vet schooling).

Hi!

Is that dog strength or cat strength metacam? In either case, it is on the lower side so you have got some leeway there if she is showing signs of not being well.

 

[Littlepaws1999]

It’s the dog strength.

 

[Wiebke]

It’s the dog strength.

For a 1 kg piggy in serious pain you can go up to 0.4 ml twice daily with dog metacam if absolutely needed. After that, there are stronger pain meds like tramadol which can be also prescribed for guinea pigs, so you have still got quite some margin to play with in that respect. I hope that this helps to ease your mind a bit?

 

[Littlepaws1999]

Okay that’s great to know! Thanks. She’s about 1.2 kg.

 

[Wiebke]

Guinea pigs tolerate metacam a lot better than other pet species. I would leave her on the current level but keep a regular eye on her weight (i.e. hay intake). Once there is a steady downward trend, it means that the pain is getting stronger and you and your vet will have to adjust upwards.
Please take the time to read this guide here so you can avoid unnecessary panic and know exactly what to look out for: Weight - Monitoring and Management

 

[Littlepaws1999]

I will read through the page you suggested, thanks again!
I do monitor her weight quite closely. She has stayed quite stable through this thus far.

I may attempt asking the vet again about glucosamine. In your opinion does this product look safe? https://www.petvalu.com/ca/product/regular-strength-joint-health-mobility/SCM02618CA
The analysis is: Per 1 gram: Glucosamine Hydrochloride 250 mg, Glucosamine Sulphate 250 mg, Chondroitin Sulphate 125mg, MSM 375mg
or should I be looking for products with the only ingredient being glucosamine such as this ? Purica Vegan Glucosamine HCL
I’d like to have a product I can directly reference when I speak with her again.

 

[Wiebke]

I will read through the page you suggested, thanks again!
I do monitor her weight quite closely. She has stayed quite stable through this thus far.

I may attempt asking the vet again about glucosamine. In your opinion does this product look safe? https://www.petvalu.com/ca/product/regular-strength-joint-health-mobility/SCM02618CA
The analysis is: Per 1 gram: Glucosamine Hydrochloride 250 mg, Glucosamine Sulphate 250 mg, Chondroitin Sulphate 125mg, MSM 375mg
or should I be looking for products with the only ingredient being glucosamine such as this ? Purica Vegan Glucosamine HCL
I’d like to have a product I can directly reference when I speak with her again.

The first one you may want to run past your vet. The vegan one seems to the pure glucosamine and safe. It won't interact with the acidity of the urine.