Smallpetselect pellets

[jess496]

What's everyone's opinion of smallpetselect Guinea pig pellets?. I've been feeding my boys these pellets but I've just noticed the ingredients in them and the soya is what worries me.
I've tried the pellets from haybox that is all natural but my boys would not touch it but when they tried some that I noticed their poos weren't good so I had to stop them and they are fine now. I'm aware that changing their diet is risky but I'm worried that smallpetselect pellets are not healthy especially they seem to love them alot which makes me suspicious.
Does anyone know why they put soya in all Guinea pig food as they do not need this?.
I emailed smallpetselect about the soya in their ingredients & I asked them why they put that in the pellets which they replied saying that exotic vet chose these Ingredients so I'm confused to why a exotic vet would choose bad ingredients that Guinea pigs do not need which is strange. They did not answer me why Guinea pigs need soya though.
Is it true that soya can cause gas in Guinea pigs?.
I cannot find Guinea pig pellets without soya in UK but there is one product that I found but the bag is so small and expensive.

 

[Piggies&buns]

All pellets contain fillers of one sort or another, it’s just the way it is. I see you’ve already tried Haybox pellets - thar would have been my suggestion given their content is so much better. I feed them to my piggies
Your alternative is to go pellet free or at least not feed pellets every day. My boys only get pellets about three times and instead they have a variety of dried forages daily as well as fresh grass. I also provide fresh forage for them when I can.

 

[jess496]

All pellets contain fillers of one sort or another, it’s just the way it is. I see you’ve already tried Haybox pellets - thar would have been my suggestion given their content is so much better. I feed them to my piggies
Your alternative is to go pellet free or at least not feed pellets every day. My boys only get pellets about three times and instead they have a variety of dried forages daily as well as fresh grass. I also provide fresh forage for them when I can.

I don't know why most of them contain fillers, is it a money making thing so when they get ill and the vets make money from animals being sick? It wouldn't surprise me. Maybe I'll have to try them again but I'm worried it will make them ill as two of them had soft poos from it and I did mix them in their usual pellets but they picked out their usual pellets and just left the new ones.
For about couple days I did leave new pellets in bowls so they have no choice but they would not touch it and it worried me that they are hungry.
I wish I could go pellet free but they seem so desperate for the pellets, I don't put too much in but when they finish it they want more and plus I don't want them losing weight if I stop the pellets altogether.

 

[Siikibam]

Not eating pellets won’t make them lose weight. They only make up 5-10% of their diet so it’s a minor contribution compared to hay which makes up at least 80%. So the latter (decrease in amount eaten) is what would cause weight loss.

Too many pellets can also lead to a reduction in hay eating. They’re the chocolate of the piggy world. If you have someone (a child) the choice of chocolate or apples, which do you think they would go for most times? It’s the same with them.

I’ve reduced the amount of pellets mine get. They now get maybe a tablespoon between them. I also tried them on the haybox ones but they wouldn’t eat them. I still put them in but don’t know if they’re eaten or not.

You can cut back to a tablespoon between two and maybe start skipping out days. I had pellet free Sunday which fell by the wayside. But I may bring it back again.

 

[Piggies&buns]

I don't know why most of them contain fillers, is it a money making thing so when they get ill and the vets make money from animals being sick? It wouldn't surprise me. Maybe I'll have to try them again but I'm worried it will make them ill as two of them had soft poos from it and I did mix them in their usual pellets but they picked out their usual pellets and just left the new ones.
For about couple days I did leave new pellets in bowls so they have no choice but they would not touch it and it worried me that they are hungry.
I wish I could go pellet free but they seem so desperate for the pellets, I don't put too much in but when they finish it they want more and plus I don't want them losing weight if I stop the pellets altogether.

It’s just how they are bulked out.
They won’t be hungry because pellets are the smallest part of their diet (5%, just one tablespoon per day) and they should be filling up on hay, not pellets. They will beg for pellets the way a child wants chocolate because it’s a nice tasting treat.
They should not lose weight if you were to go pellet free or even reduce them to a few days a week because they should fill up on hay or, as I do, pellets are replaced by a healthier food alternative so they eat that instead.
Mine still get their pellets and they enjoy them when they get them, but they aren’t their focus because they get a variety of forage instead.

 

[jess496]

Not eating pellets won’t make them lose weight. They only make up 5-10% of their diet so it’s a minor contribution compared to hay which makes up at least 80%. So the latter (decrease in amount eaten) is what would cause weight loss.

Too many pellets can also lead to a reduction in hay eating. They’re the chocolate of the piggy world. If you have someone (a child) the choice of chocolate or apples, which do you think they would go for most times? It’s the same with them.

I’ve reduced the amount of pellets mine get. They now get maybe a tablespoon between them. I also tried them on the haybox ones but they wouldn’t eat them. I still put them in but don’t know if they’re eaten or not.

You can cut back to a tablespoon between two and maybe start skipping out days. I had pellet free Sunday which fell by the wayside. But I may bring it back again.

It's so difficult because my Guinea pigs are fussy as they don't eat enough hay like they should yet I've tried different types but it could be because of the pellets but even then if I stopped the pellets I don't think they'd eat more hay anyway because they are awkward like that so that's why I worry about them losing weight.
I think I may try haybox pellets again because I really want them to be healthy, I hate the thought of them eating fillers.

 

[Piggies&buns]

Do you keep to the recommended amounts of veg and pellets?
One cup per pig for veg and one tablespoon of pellets?

Do you weigh them weekly as routine?

 

[jess496]

Do you keep to the recommended amounts of veg and pellets?
One cup per pig for veg and one tablespoon of pellets?

Do you weigh them weekly as routine?

I give them a jug each full of herbs/veg a day at different times to spread it out which I won't change that amount because I have already reduced the amount that I used to feed them when I realised it was too much. I don't put a full bowl of pellets like most people do only about a less handful which isn't alot.
I do weigh them weekly.

 

[Piggies&buns]

I give them a jug each full of herbs/veg a day at different times to spread it out which I won't change that amount because I have already reduced the amount that I used to feed them when I realised it was too much. I don't put a full bowl of pellets like most people do only about a less handful which isn't alot.
I do weigh them weekly.

If you actually use a tablespoon measure so you can be accurate and ensure you don’t overfeed pellets. Its too easy to give too much if you just use your hand.
You would be surprised how few pellets a tablespoon actually is.

 

[Swissgreys]

Just to add that most pellets will contain some sort of fillers, and it certainly isn't designed to make guinea pigs sick or see the vet more often.

They should make up such a small part of their diet that I really won't worry about feeding a small amount.
Guinea pig health is about so much more than the pellets that they eat, so rather than worry about something that is less than 10% of their overall diet (with the fillers being a very small percentage of that) maybe try to focus on space, enrichment and companionship, which are at leat as important as pellets in keeping piggies healthy.

I found that over the years the things which really made my piggies happy, kept them active and hopefully improved their overall mood and health were things like forage (self collected and bought from a reliable source), enrichment, a variety of hays fed in large quantities to encourage foraging as well as nesting and play, companionship, filtered water, the occasional treat (fruit, a pea flake) etc.

 

[jess496]

Just to add that most pellets will contain some sort of fillers, and it certainly isn't designed to make guinea pigs sick or see the vet more often.

They should make up such a small part of their diet that I really won't worry about feeding a small amount.
Guinea pig health is about so much more than the pellets that they eat, so rather than worry about something that is less than 10% of their overall diet (with the fillers being a very small percentage of that) maybe try to focus on space, enrichment and companionship, which are at leat as important as pellets in keeping piggies healthy.

I found that over the years the things which really made my piggies happy, kept them active and hopefully improved their overall mood and health were things like forage (self collected and bought from a reliable source), enrichment, a variety of hays fed in large quantities to encourage foraging as well as nesting and play, companionship, filtered water, the occasional treat (fruit, a pea flake) etc.

Why do pellets contain fillers? I just don't understand why because surely it would save the effort of adding so much ingredients? What's the reason for adding fillers? Is it to make it tasty so it's like sweets to them I wonder. I'm trying natural pellets from haybox again today to see if they'll eat it I hope.
My boys have a very big spaces to themselves as they all don't get on but they still have each other for company in the room and I sometimes let them run on the floor together.
My first two Guinea pigs have passed away at the ages of 3 & 4 which I don't understand why they didn't live longer because they had the best care and a very huge cage etc. I try my best and it feels like it's not good enough when they die at a young age. I see alot of people having Guinea pigs up to 8-10 years and I want to know how they make them live longer.
I also filter their water for years now and buy natural forage treats plus pea flakes too. I buy good Timothy hay.

 

[Eriathwen]

A lot of ingredients aren't technically fillers, but sources of nutrition. Soya is an extremely good source of protein needed to keep the animal healthy, as far as I'm aware there is no scientific evidence it is unhealthy for small herbivores other than myths from a handful of youtubers looking to promote different foods.
There are other protein sources that can be used, but they aren't necessarily safe or good for guinea pigs. Some treats use egg, most pellets will use alfalfa, which veterinary texts say has far too much calcium oxalate for adult guinea pigs and can lead to stone formation. Personally I'd rather feed pellets containing soya vs ones with alfalfa

I use pellets as treats personally rather than part of the diet, the pellet part is replaced with dried and fresh forages.

 

[jess496]

A lot of ingredients aren't technically fillers, but sources of nutrition. Soya is an extremely good source of protein needed to keep the animal healthy, as far as I'm aware there is no scientific evidence it is unhealthy for small herbivores other than myths from a handful of youtubers looking to promote different foods.
There are other protein sources that can be used, but they aren't necessarily safe or good for guinea pigs. Some treats use egg, most pellets will use alfalfa, which veterinary texts say has far too much calcium oxalate for adult guinea pigs and can lead to stone formation. Personally I'd rather feed pellets containing soya vs ones with alfalfa

I use pellets as treats personally rather than part of the diet, the pellet part is replaced with dried and fresh forages.

When you search online "Is soya bad for Guinea pigs" there's alot that say it's bad for them and it says online that "It is often used as the primary source of protein. However, rabbits, guinea pigs, and chinchillas are not adapted to the amino acid profile found in soy protein" so I don't understand why they add soya to their food, it's odd.
I've also read that soya can cause gas but not sure if this is true.
Yeah I agree about alfalfa.

 

[Piggies&buns]

Unfortunately they can pass away at any age and their deaths have nothing to do with their care or cage size. Passing away at a younger than average age is not a reflection on how you look after them.
The average lifespan is around 5-8 years. 8-10 would be rather an exception.

if you are very concerned, then as suggested, cut the amount of pellets they have down, replace it with forage. As I said my boys only get pellets about three times a week and when they do get them they only get about 5 pellets each (I use haybox). They are usually scattered in a pile of hay so they really have to forage for such a small amount of them or occasionally I give them by hand but I much prefer to see them foraging for their treats.

 

[Eriathwen]

When you search online "Is soya bad for Guinea pigs" there's alot that say it's bad for them and it says online that "It is often used as the primary source of protein. However, rabbits, guinea pigs, and chinchillas are not adapted to the amino acid profile found in soy protein" so I don't understand why they add soya to their food, it's odd.
I've also read that soya can cause gas but not sure if this is true.
Yeah I agree about alfalfa.

It's important to look at the source of this information, that quote is from the Sherwood site, who marketed their food as being 'filler free' without any scientific evidence of soya being bad for them. They make many claims that aren't backed by current veterinary science such as their urinary tabs breaking down bladder stones. Currently there is no evidence anything other than surgery is curative for bladder stones.
They claimed their original, alfalfa based feed was suitable for all ages and was promoted by a very big guinea pig youtuber, who then went on to suffer several, large bladder stones in her guinea pigs. Due to the communities avoidance of alfalfa based food in spite of their attempts to discredit other popular brands containing 'fillers' and in spite of claiming their original formulation was perfectly safe, they brought out a second, timothy hay based formula which while better is a little fatty.
They then, without much explanation that I've seen, withdrew the alfalfa formula and ceased selling it, sticking with the Timothy formula.

Whenever this company has been asked to provide evidence of their claims, they send anecdotal research of their own, nothing peer reviewed or unbiased. Their claims appear to be nothing more than an advertising campaign to place their feeds above other popular brands

Given how many guinea pigs have been raised on feeds containing soya, and compared to issues from alfalfa based feed such as stones, there hasn't been any occurance that I know of, of guinea pigs needing veterinary treatment due to soya. Honestly I wouldn't worry about it any more than I would worry about the molasses binders often used. It's such a tiny part of the diet that safely serves its purpose

 

[jess496]

Unfortunately they can pass away at any age and their deaths have nothing to do with their care or cage size. Passing away at a younger than average age is not a reflection on how you look after them.
The average lifespan is around 5-8 years. 8-10 would be rather an exception.

if you are very concerned, then as suggested, cut the amount of pellets they have down, replace it with forage. As I said my boys only get pellets about three times a week and when they do get them they only get about 5 pellets each (I use haybox). They are usually scattered in a pile of hay so they really have to forage for such a small amount of them or occasionally I give them by hand but I much prefer to see them foraging for their treats.

Thankyou for your reply. I will try but it is going to be difficult as they are going to hate me for it haha.

 

[jess496]

It's important to look at the source of this information, that quote is from the Sherwood site, who marketed their food as being 'filler free' without any scientific evidence of soya being bad for them. They make many claims that aren't backed by current veterinary science such as their urinary tabs breaking down bladder stones. Currently there is no evidence anything other than surgery is curative for bladder stones.
They claimed their original, alfalfa based feed was suitable for all ages and was promoted by a very big guinea pig youtuber, who then went on to suffer several, large bladder stones in her guinea pigs. Due to the communities avoidance of alfalfa based food in spite of their attempts to discredit other popular brands containing 'fillers' and in spite of claiming their original formulation was perfectly safe, they brought out a second, timothy hay based formula which while better is a little fatty.
They then, without much explanation that I've seen, withdrew the alfalfa formula and ceased selling it, sticking with the Timothy formula.

Whenever this company has been asked to provide evidence of their claims, they send anecdotal research of their own, nothing peer reviewed or unbiased. Their claims appear to be nothing more than an advertising campaign to place their feeds above other popular brands

Given how many guinea pigs have been raised on feeds containing soya, and compared to issues from alfalfa based feed such as stones, there hasn't been any occurance that I know of, of guinea pigs needing veterinary treatment due to soya. Honestly I wouldn't worry about it any more than I would worry about the molasses binders often used. It's such a tiny part of the diet that safely serves its purpose

Thankyou for replying and it makes me feel better to know that their pellets are ok to feed. I will try and reduce the amount but it will be difficult as they will be mad with me haha.

 

[Pound Shilling & Pig]

Soya is a cheap and plentiful protein found in many animal feeds both for pets and livestock such as cattle. For animals being bred for the meat industry they grow faster when fed high protein diets (containing soya) so can go to slaughter sooner than slow grown grass fed cattle for example, keeping priduction costs down and the price lower for the consumer. By the same token pet foods containing soya are also cheaper to manufacture and keep costs down. The thing is piggies don't really need pellets, they have evolved to get all the protein they need from hay and grass. Yes, they like them, a lot of money is spent by the pet food industry developing foods which are highly palatable, ideally more palatable than the foods being produced by their rivals. Reducing the amount you feed or stopping altogether won't harm your piggies. If they do lose a little weight in the beginning it may be because they are carrying a little excess weight due to eating too many pellets.
I only feed my piggies pellets in the winter and then just once a week and think of them as a treat rather than a staple

 

[Siikibam]

It may be difficult at first but they’ll get over it soon enough.

 

[Eriathwen]

Thankyou for replying and it makes me feel better to know that their pellets are ok to feed. I will try and reduce the amount but it will be difficult as they will be mad with me haha.

You're welcome! There are 100% grass pellets on the market that you could replace them with to keep them happy, mine love them, although a lot of people have found theirs turn their nose up at them. It's a bit like raising a child on macdonalds then expecting them to eat an apple
If you're in the UK, Galens Garden has a nice selection of different herb and grass pellets you could try, it gives them the illusion of still getting pellets but technically it would be considered forage and hay as they're just dried herbs and grass!

 

[piggieminder]

My vet believes soya is one of the contributing factors of bladder stones. I've certainly had a lot less trouble with piggie bladders since I cut out soya containing pellets. Versel Laga Cavia Complete don't contain soya or wheat, Burgess Indoor does not contain soya, although this one does contain wheat.

 

[jess496]

You're welcome! There are 100% grass pellets on the market that you could replace them with to keep them happy, mine love them, although a lot of people have found theirs turn their nose up at them. It's a bit like raising a child on macdonalds then expecting them to eat an apple
If you're in the UK, Galens Garden has a nice selection of different herb and grass pellets you could try, it gives them the illusion of still getting pellets but technically it would be considered forage and hay as they're just dried herbs and grass!

Thankyou that helps alot and I will have a look at that now

 

[Eriathwen]

My vet believes soya is one of the contributing factors of bladder stones. I've certainly had a lot less trouble with piggie bladders since I cut out soya containing pellets. Versel Laga Cavia Complete don't contain soya or wheat, Burgess Indoor does not contain soya, although this one does contain wheat.

Interesting! Too much protein in a lot of animals does contribute to kidney/bladder stones so I can definitely see the logic, especially if fed too many.

 

[jess496]

My vet believes soya is one of the contributing factors of bladder stones. I've certainly had a lot less trouble with piggie bladders since I cut out soya containing pellets. Versel Laga Cavia Complete don't contain soya or wheat, Burgess Indoor does not contain soya, although this one does contain wheat.

I haven't had any problems with my Guinea pigs getting bladder stones and they've been on these pellets for over a year now I think. I'm more concerned about soya causing gas as I read that somewhere.
I've seen versel laga as I wanted to get that but it's alot of money for a small bag for 3 Guinea pigs. Thankyou

 

[jess496]

Soya is a cheap and plentiful protein found in many animal feeds both for pets and livestock such as cattle. For animals being bred for the meat industry they grow faster when fed high protein diets (containing soya) so can go to slaughter sooner than slow grown grass fed cattle for example, keeping priduction costs down and the price lower for the consumer. By the same token pet foods containing soya are also cheaper to manufacture and keep costs down. The thing is piggies don't really need pellets, they have evolved to get all the protein they need from hay and grass. Yes, they like them, a lot of money is spent by the pet food industry developing foods which are highly palatable, ideally more palatable than the foods being produced by their rivals. Reducing the amount you feed or stopping altogether won't harm your piggies. If they do lose a little weight in the beginning it may be because they are carrying a little excess weight due to eating too many pellets.
I only feed my piggies pellets in the winter and then just once a week and think of them as a treat rather than a staple

Thankyou for telling me this

 

[Piggies&buns]

I haven't had any problems with my Guinea pigs getting bladder stones and they've been on these pellets for over a year now I think. I'm more concerned about soya causing gas as I read that somewhere.
I've seen versel laga as I wanted to get that but it's alot of money for a small bag for 3 Guinea pigs. Thankyou

if they’ve been on them for over a year and have not had any issues with gas, then I’m not sure I’d be concerned about it now
i would personally be more aware (not necessarily concerned but certainly aware of the connection to bladder issues) about bladder stone risks than the risk of gas.

 

[Swissgreys]

I haven't had any problems with my Guinea pigs getting bladder stones and they've been on these pellets for over a year now I think. I'm more concerned about soya causing gas as I read that somewhere.
I've seen versel laga as I wanted to get that but it's alot of money for a small bag for 3 Guinea pigs. Thankyou

And this is exactly the reason that big companies add cheap fillers like soya.
It makes the bag of food seem bigger and cost less so consumers feel like it is better value for money!
There's a high demand for cheap pet food, but you really do get what you pay for.
It is important to look at the weight of the bag and not just the size too.

Mine were always fed Versele Lage pellets (and our rabbits too) and we have found them to be reasonably priced for a good quality food.
Zooplus often do multi bag deals which makes them even more reasonable if you get through a lot, but even when we had 5 guinea pigs we didin't use that many.

 

[jess496]

if they’ve been on them for over a year and have not had any issues with gas, then I’m not sure I’d be concerned about it now
i would personally be more aware (not necessarily concerned but certainly aware of the connection to bladder issues) about bladder stone risks than the risk of gas.

I should have mentioned that my Guinea pig who passed away that I remember he was gassy when I first bought them so I was concerned at the time that maybe it was the soya but at the time I found it hard to find any pellets that didn't have soya in them so I carried on feeding them as I was told they were fine to give which this was about 2-3 years ago when he first started eating them and he died of acute bloat in April this year so I'm not sure if pellets caused his death. I can't say for definite that pellets caused this but it might not have been because he lasted all this time on them and the medication he was on might of been the cause to his bloat but he was on such low doses once a day so I'm unsure.
I do wonder if pellets over time made him poorly which I hope not.

 

[jess496]

And this is exactly the reason that big companies add cheap fillers like soya.
It makes the bag of food seem bigger and cost less so consumers feel like it is better value for money!
There's a high demand for cheap pet food, but you really do get what you pay for.
It is important to look at the weight of the bag and not just the size too.

Mine were always fed Versele Lage pellets (and our rabbits too) and we have found them to be reasonably priced for a good quality food.
Zooplus often do multi bag deals which makes them even more reasonable if you get through a lot, but even when we had 5 guinea pigs we didin't use that many.

I didn't know zooplus did versele lage so I will have a look, thankyou.
Probably sounds stupid but how long have your Guinea pigs lived to? I'm just curious if the pellets that I've been feeding have shortened my Guinea pigs lives.

 

[piggieminder]

Time for Paws and Zoo Plus often have Versele Laga on offer, although they don't have any at the moment. I don't find them to be any more expensive than other good quality pellets. I buy them when they are on offer and when I want other things so I can spend enough to get the free postage. I only feed about 10 - 12 pellets (split in 2 lots) each a day to my 6 piggies so a bag lasts ages. I treat pellets more as a daily treat than a food.