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Should i give critcal care?

Ninarodders

Ninarodders

Junior Guinea Pig
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So ill try and get all the back story in. My guinea pig had lost weight and was puffy. He was eating a little. I took him vets they gave him emeprid and loxixom. He is eating he eats his veg (they don't eat dry food due to my other pigs bladder stones) and I do see him munching hay. It's been over a week now and he isn't improving. He has more vet appointments but not for another week. When I weighed him last night he has lost more weight. So all in all now he's gone from 1200g to 1006g!

I've had some critical care delivered today. My question is should I give him some untill Monday when I can call the vets again. He is eating. He does eat his veggies twice a day and I do see him eating hay. But when he's sleeping he's all hunched and puffy still.
 
Yes please urgently step in with syringe feeding. He has lost a huge amount of weight - 50g of loss is when you step in but he has lost 200g so it is essential you stop that weight loss.
(Mushed pellets should be used in the absence of critical care).
He is losing weight because his hay intake has significantly reduced - he may be nibbling but it is nowhere near enough. Veg is only 10-15% of the daily food intake so eating it doesn’t account for much and isn’t what is needed to maintain weight.

Please aim for at least 60ml of syringe feed per day. 40ml is the absolute minimum for a critically ill piggy but may not be enough for weight maintenance, it is just enough to keep gut functioning.
Make sure you weigh him every morning so that you know he is being fed enough to stabilize his weight.
You need to feed him until he is better, not just until Monday.

He is puffy due to being in pain.
Is he still on the medications daily?

What is his dosage of loxicom?
Is it cat or dog version?
Is the loxicom twice a day?


Does he feel bloated? Touch his tummy and see is it feels hard?
If he does, then please remove all veg from the diet and try to get hold of the vet today as an emergency appointment.

Wiebke

Thread 'Weight and Weight Loss Explained: BMI, Weighing, Poos and Feeding Support'

1 Weight and Weight Loss
- Why regular weight monitoring matters
- How weight changes over a lifetime
- How to weigh on your kitchen scales (with video)
- The weight loss rules
- How critical is the weight loss for my piggy?
- Possible causes for weight loss
2 Body Mass Index (BMI) or 'Heft'
- Why is understanding your piggy's weight so important?
- 'Average' weight vs. individual weight - the big trip up
- How to check for the BMI...
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Wiebke

Thread 'All About Syringe Feeding and Medicating Guinea Pigs with Videos and Pictures'

Introduction
1 Choosing the right place to medicate/feed your piggy
2 Guinea pig whispering and asserting your authority
3 Recovery products and emergency improvisation
4 Syringe recommendations
5 Weight monitoring: your biggest ally
6 Weight loss guidelines and when to step in with feeding
7 Syringe feeding amounts/frequency advice
8 Practical medication and syringing tips
9 Medicating and feeding cooperative guinea pigs (videos)
10 Medicating and feeding uncooperative guinea pigs (hold pictures and tips)
11 The line between life and...
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  • Love
Wiebke

Thread 'Digestive Disorders: Not Eating - Diarrhea - Bloat - GI Stasis (No Gut Movement)'

1 Not eating (anorexia) and the importance of syringe feeding fibre
2 Soft poos and runny diarrhea
3 Acute bloat (severe dysbiosis) - blockage - twisted gut - persistent milder bloating
4 GI stasis (no gut movement)


Severe runny diarrhea, bloat, blockage or a twisted gut, GI stasis and excessive salivating in guinea pigs that are not eating are absolute life and death emergencies that need to be seen ASAP by an out-of-hours vet at any time of the day or night or that should be seen by a vet as soon as you can get an appointment outside the UK...
 
The vet was very good looked him completely over and the only thing wrong that she could find was mild amount of gas. He's on the dog one 0.35 2x day. Untill Monday I meant untill I can get advise from the vets on Monday. I'd just say he's only lost 50g since going to vets but his weight is very up and down between 1050 and 1095 but last night's weigh in he had gone from 1050 to 1006. Literally one day he could weigh 1050 and the next 1090 then the next day 1050. I weigh in evening before meds and dinner, approx same time of day
 
Same time of day is important but It’s best to weigh first thing in the morning as that is when his weight is naturally its lowest so it gives a more accurate baseline and reflection of the past days events.
You said in the first post he has gone from
1200-1006g - did you mean 1100g as a start weight?

A daily fluctuation is around 30-40g is perfectly normal for full bladder/tummy.
50g or more loss below the baseline is of concern and when you step in.

It’s good he has dog version.
is he still on the emeprid?

It’s possible the gas has got worse.
As I say, touch his tummy (the bloat guide explains) and see if it is hard.
If it is hard, if he is in a lot of pain, if he stops pooping etc - then he can’t wait until Monday to see a vet.

Please remove veg from his diet until he is better. Veg on a bloated tummy will make things worse. It can only be reintroduced, very slowly, once he is over any gas issues.

 
I never knew about the veg thing and bloat. I dont have guinea pig dry food anymore. Is the critical care and hay enough till veg cam be reintroduced? The vet has never said to cut veg out.

He had some critical care and then I watched him eat hay for maybe 10 mins (I can't sit all day watching him sadly) he's off the emeprid now. He was approx 1200g and then one day nearly 2 weeks ago I picked him up and he was skinny. He weighed 1094. So I took him vets next day. She gave me the meds etc and said make an appointment for 4 weeks to check he's back up on his weight and book a hospital appointment incase he needs more tests etc. On Thursday I was concerned as he weight was fluctuating between 1050 and 1090 they said keep doing what I'm doing wean him off the emperid and go from there. I'd say he is eating the same from what I can tell. But obs he's weight says different. Last night he went down to 1006g. So my plan is to do critical care and weights etc till Monday when I can get him in the vets again. His tummy doesn't feel hard. He's just skinny. I have noticed when he does eat he's slower than his normal self. His next appointment is in 2 weeks. But like I say unless he has gained weight and more like himself I will phone vets on Monday morning
 
It’s not so much the fluctuation between 1050-1090 that is the concerning part (fluctuations like that are normal), it’s the fact he was 1200 before two weeks ago and then dropped down to 1094. Then drop then down to 1006 is a further 50g (from 1050) is further evidence that he isn’t eating properly.
The thing with watching him eat hay is even if you can do it, you still don’t know he is actually getting enough - hay intake cannot be gauged by eye hence the importance of weight checks.

Yes critical care and hay absolutely is enough for him. It is essential you stop him from losing any more weight.

If he is gassy then he shouldn’t have the veg.
His symptoms of weight loss, puffing and hunching suggest he is in pain somewhere.

Weigh him once a day, keep a log of each day and then compare it to the next.
Post the log on here if you would like our opinions on the situation

Let us know how he goes. I hope he is ok
 
When it comes to critical care how do I know he's gained weight becuase he's doing better and not because of the critical care? As in when would I or how would I go about no longer giving it?

He is definitely in pain somewhere just wish he could talk and tell me 🙁

I'm gona weigh him tonight as usual then again in the morning so I can go forwards with morning weighs.
 
Syringe feeding during an illness phase is about stopping further weight loss and stabilisation, not about making him gain weight. A poorly piggy is not likely to gain any significant amounts of weight during this time.
I would fully be expecting that you will need to call the vet on Monday.

When the illness is over and he is feeling better, he will start to eat more hay independently. When that happens, he will start to refuse syringe feeds. You can then cut out a feed a day, keep up with the weight checks and if he remains stable for a few days then cut out another feed etc etc until he doesn’t need any feeds.
If his weight starts to go down again when you cut out feeds, then he still isn’t eating quite enough independently for you to fully stop support feeding.
It’s a process and some need less feeds quicker than others. It just depends what is wrong and how soon he recovers from it.

Regaining the lost weight to go back to pre-illness weight will take many weeks after he is recovered and after you’ve stopped needing to syringe feed. He will do it himself by eating lots of hay.

Much better idea to weigh in the mornings.
 
Thank you for the help. Yes I think he will need vets on Monday. Hopefully they would be able to take him for day.

I'll update again tomorrow or Monday depending on how we go. Thank you

Ps he seems to be enjoying the critical care more now than earlier
 
So an update. I took him vets yesterday. They rang me at 11am to say he was eating fine etc and double checking why I had brought him. I explained everything and he said he'd do his proper check (as he had only watched him at this point) between appointments. Everything came back OK, no obvious reason why there's weight loss. The only thing is his gut is louder than normal. So gave some more emperid to last 2 weeks when he has another appointment to either say he's done fine or do scans and bloods tests.

He said I could continue normal diet and do critical care 2x a day.

He only got it twice yesterday as was at vets all day and his weight this morning was 988g! So ill do more critical care today. But I'm confused how I measure the amount he's getting. Do I literally just count how many 1ml syringes he has during each time? So if he had 5 then that's 5ml or if he had 10 then that's 10ml? Sorry that's such a dumb question.

Side note he takes ages to eat it. I'm giving like meds as he won't willingly take it and I wait till he's finished chewing before I give the rest of the syringe etc. Is this the best way of doing it?
 
Can you post the daily log of his weight checks?

As previously advised, he needs as much critical care as is needed to keep his weight stable each day - twice a day may not be anywhere near enough.

No such thing as a dumb question.
Yes, in terms of amount - you’ve got it - 10x 1ml syringes is 10ml.
He needs 60ml per day.

Yes give him time to swallow before giving the next mouthful - they can only take around 0.3ml in their mouth at one time
 
His weight. When I weigh him previously I know he was OK if around 1230g so I never logged normal weights. So these are when I weighed him and he was obviously down I started to log it. I swapped pm to am weigh ins also.
 

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That’s quite some drop from his 1230g normal.
And then he has lost a further 100g in the past two weeks.
Whether the vet can find something wrong or not, he really does seem to have something going on.

I note you are in Northamptonshire - if you’re not already seeing them, is there any way you can get to cat and rabbit clinic?
 
Yes they go there, Kim saw him on 12th and Simon yesterday. Deffo something going on. Really wish they could talk, be such much easier
 
I've just dropped him back off at the vets. I woke at 6am to give him his critical care and he just looked so poorly. He had started dribbling from not swallowing.

They are gona give him some fluids and injectable emeprid and monitor him this morning. Possibly do xrays but they don't really show much in terms of bowels and problems. He is too poorly for explorative surgery.

If he perks up at bit then going forward hes gona try antibiotics. I can't remember which he said off hand now. He said about antibiotics can cause bloating and gut issues so it's a tricky decision but he's just getting worse and he really isn't well enough to get worse. Also said about give more or different gut meds.

But need to see how he gets on this morning. I wasnt even sure if we'd make to the vets in time.
 
I’m so sorry to hear that.

Antibiotics can knock their appetite - they can wipe out the gut bacteria. So that is why they may be hesitant to do it without knowing if there is actually a need for them - antibiotics will only help if there is actually a bacterial infection.

I’ve got my fingers crossed for him.
 
I’m so so sorry to hear this.
I know it is so hard but if he is getting worse then letting him go is a kindness and act of love.

We will all support you
 
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