Rebonding. How many times ?

[Mon59]

HELP..

Trying to rebond 2 sows that were together as babies . Not related. About a year old .

They were together for 4 months with two others and got on well. One passed away and another went back to the breeder for Very bad behaviour..

They have been separated by a c&c divider for about 6 months and interact quite nicely through the bars.

i need to board them for a few weeks in a few months and a bonded pair would be better than two separate piggies.

so took the divider down for a few hours. Seemed to be neutral as they are used to smells etc. left food in the middle.

Maria is larger and quite boisterous . She wasn’t being particularly aggressive but was very curious..

Olivia, who is very docile ended up very traumatised after 30 mins. Wouldn’t move. Started crying. Wouldn’t eat.
After a slight trussle which might have turned into a more serious fight. . Olivia got into a worse state and was crying . Maria just went back to eating and was very chilled .

tried twice now and same result. divider back up and Olivia still very subdued. Looks depressed.

is there any hope ?

 

[Piggies&buns]

Bonding needs to be done on neutral territory ie somewhere other than the cage. You can’t just remove a divider between two cages and allow them to wander into each other’s half as it’s not neutral and can be seen a territory invasion.
You need to put them both in a completely different space - a bathtub if needs be - but it needs to be outside of the cage, with no hides and see how things go.

Can you explain more about what you mean by a tussle - what actually happened?
How was she being boisterous? What behaviours did you see?
The ‘Crying’ - is there a chance it could have been submission squealing (a high pitched squeal).

If she was genuinely being bullied, and the bonding was clearly failing then you do not try again. However it is difficult when interpreting any human emotion which may have been put into the situation without knowing the actual behaviours you were seeing.

 

[Mon59]

Maria was circling and a bit of rumble strutting . Then she faced and sought a confrontation Nose to nose. I didn’t think it showed any real intent until they went on hind legs and went for each other . Teeth and claws. I separated them with a clap and Maria withdrew. She then went to the far corner before repeating again twice . It looked to me like gauging strength rather than a fight to seriously injure but how do I know ? There were no injuries.

i dont think a bathtub would be any good . It does say in the guides that as long as sufficiently neutral . The whole cage smells of both and always has done . I tried for several hours . Food placed in the middle and not their bowls . I removed their hides.

Olivia just looks completely terrified each time I try . Stays rooted in one place. There is a distinct difference between the two. I thought she might be dominant as she is normally more inquisitive ?

I was after some similar stories from forum members. Whether they gave up or persevered ?

very grateful. Anybody ?

 

[Piggies&buns]

A bathtub is a perfectly acceptable place to carry out a bonding, a recommended place where there is no other space/option for neutral territory.

Neutral territory is somewhere which is not part of either piggy’s regular territory. You can do it in the same room as their normal cages but it needs to be done in a totally different pen.
Simply removing a divider which is between long established territories and allowing the other piggy to enter into the other piggy’s half of the cage means it is not neutral at all. consequently it can be seen as a territory invasion, thus causing tensions and the bonding to fail.
You can only remove the divider in a divided cage to carry out a bonding where each piggy has only been in each half for a very short time - over night, a couple of days at most - you cant do it when they’ve been living separated in each half for months.

The way you know is by carrying out the introduction on fully neutral territory and reading their behaviours. If they are circling and going on hind legs at each other (twice) then it sounds like it could well be a failure. You are less likely to see a full fight in sows (although it does happen) so you may have to recognise other signs as a failure rather than ‘relying’ on a fight/injuries as a way to determine. As you did not try on neutral territory, we can’t know for sure whether the reaction is due to feeling invaded or whether it’s because they aren’t compatible.

 

[Princess Dustmop]

i dont think a bathtub would be any good .

I've used a bathtub for bonding before. It worked quite well. I put something over the drain to protect little toes and threw a towel over the whole bottom.

Olivia just looks completely terrified each time I try . Stays rooted in one place. There is a distinct difference between the two. I thought she might be dominant as she is normally more inquisitive ?

I was after some similar stories from forum members. Whether they gave up or persevered ?

very grateful. Anybody ?

It can be difficult to determine which pig will be dominant sometimes ... or even which one is dominant. I had dominance backwards on one of my pairs for a while. (Other times it's much more obvious.)

I have always done bonding on the floor or in the tub. I would really suggest using a floor time setting if you don't want to use a bathtub. I've had good results that way.
I haven't really had any difficult bondings, so I don't really have any stories to guide you. (We did have one bond fail between boars, but it involved a fight, so it was definitively over.)