Please help! Dominance!

Barnyard Boars

Junior Guinea Pig
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To give a quick summary, Milton and Harvey lived together in their hut, there’d be rumple strutting here and there, nothing unusual. Milton got sick, so I quarantined him to get him back to health. Today he got to go back in the cage, I cleaned the cage out fresh, and put Milton back in. They’ve lived together close to a year, I didn’t think this would be a big issue, beside Harvey seemed really depressed without his buddy, I thought they’d be happy again. Milton’s back in and there’s very bad dominance behaviour going on now. Rumple strutting, chasing, some teeth chatter... I’m watching them very close but I don’t know what to do... I don’t want to have to separate them forever, will they figure out the pack again and be okay?
 
Hopefully they will work it out. They are re establishing heirarchy. As long as no blood is drawn they should be fine!
 
When piggies have been separated, you really need to go through a neutral area bonding again, as they need to sort out hierarchy again as @Livia Rabideau says. I hope it works out.
 
Hopefully they’ll be fine. Did you make sure to rid the cage completely of Harvey’s smells? Same goes for any hides etc?
 
I would take them out and bond on neutral ground before putting them Harvey's cage
 
So I did put them back into the cage immediately, that’s when the dominance started and I noticed Milton had been bit a few times on his face! so I figured I needed to bond them in a neutral area again, that being the bathtub. I left them in there over night, they seemed to be doing better. I thought I cleaned their cage well, washed the water bottle, new bedding entirely, wiped down, new bowls, even put new things in to change it up as much as I could. I was watching the bite marks and they looked to be scarring over. They were doing fine from what I could tell. It was my moms birthday so I had to leave the house for a while today going out for dinner and having fun, I get home and they’re better again, but to my dismay more bite marks... I’m so stressed... these are my babies. I can’t house another cage for them to live separately, and unfortunately, the bath is only a temporary solution. I don’t know if this is a fight it out problem, but I’m extremely stressed out, why are they doing this!? My Harvey is so shy, but he’s being a little jerk right now.
 
Also his eye just got goop in it, I’m wondering if Harvey didn’t scratch it, please help 😭 I need advice. I don’t want to get rid of a pig because they are my responsibility and that isn’t fair, but if I absolutely had to I’d have to get rid of Harv for the simple fact he’s always been skittish and has never been able to bond with me, I’ve tried everything. Milton on the other hand is a sweetheart but I love them both...
 
You really need to separate these piggies. Once blood has been drawn it is clear the bond has failed and is not going to work
 
You really need to separate these piggies. Once blood has been drawn it is clear the bond has failed and is not going to work

Do you think they’ll be okay for the night until I can get something set up for them tomorrow? I put a saline solution on Milton’s wounds. They used to be such good friends, I hope they don’t get depressed without each other. Harvey wasn’t eating when Milton was gone, but he is now... I hope he doesn’t starve himself.
 
Do you think they’ll be okay for the night until I can get something set up for them tomorrow? I put a saline solution on Milton’s wounds. They used to be such good friends, I hope they don’t get depressed without each other. Harvey wasn’t eating when Milton was gone, but he is now... I hope he doesn’t starve himself.

I can't say but clearly your skinny pig is being injured. I don't know if this will escalate overnight and whether more serious injuries will occur, if I knew that kind of information I would play the lottery :))
 
It’s a shame that your piggies’ bond won’t work, but it’s ok their best interests
 
So there’s absolutely zero way of them ever re-bonding? They’re currently both in their house section and laying together, within the last few hours of watching them there’s been nothing but a bit of rumple strutting. I literally cannot separate them tonight as there’s absolutely no where another pig can go, however I don’t sleep as is so I’ll just be monitoring all night. They’re eating together as well. the only time I notice an issue is when they both go for the hay, which is only in 1 location, so I’m going to need to get 2 so I can try and prevent that for the moment, as well as pellet dishes. I’ve read about buddy baths, would this do anything at all? They did fine in the dry tub, but when they got back in “Harvey’s new territory” which I thought I washed well enough, that’s when the bites happened. I hate this situation. I of course want what’s best for my pigs but just before Christmas and all of this, really sucks.
 
No I’m afraid it’s not going to work, if you left them in together with a bond that isn’t working there’s a chance one of them might get injured
 
I didn’t think buddy baths are recommended any more?
IThe risk of them fighting again will be always present if you leave them together. Once they decide they no longer like each other, then separation is the only course of action.
 
I didn’t think buddy baths are recommended any more?
IThe risk of them fighting again will be always present if you leave them together. Once they decide they no longer like each other, then separation is the only course of action.

Yes this is correct that buddy baths don't do anything to assist with bonding and aren't recommended. It's unlikely the pair will go back together. Once a piggy decides another is not part of their group that is generally that. This is another reason I tend not to separate for sickness.

How old are your boys? Is there a way you can place something in the cage so they have a half each and can still see and talk to each other?
 
I left them in last night as I had no other choice and monitored them all night, no fights at all. I doubled their hay and food and they’ve been normal, even sleeping together. I wish I never separated them, I thought it’d be best for them, now I know... they haven’t chattered at each other since yesterday, only a small bit of rumple strutting last night.
 
Yes this is correct that buddy baths don't do anything to assist with bonding and aren't recommended. It's unlikely the pair will go back together. Once a piggy decides another is not part of their group that is generally that. This is another reason I tend not to separate for sickness.

How old are your boys? Is there a way you can place something in the cage so they have a half each and can still see and talk to each other?

(Absolutely guesstimating) I want to say Harvey is around 2 years and Milton 1 roughly. Unfortunately no piggie mansions here, if I were to put a separator in the boys would have too little of room for themselves. I’m thinking of maybe extending their cage out and seeing if more room helps, or if it’s not happening and fights are still present I can just close the one side off
 
Keep a close eye on them just in case, and be prepared to separate if things turn, as it is unusual for them to fight and then get on again.
How big is their cage? Boys need more room than girls.
 
Keep a close eye on them just in case, and be prepared to separate if things turn, as it is unusual for them to fight and then get on again.
How big is their cage? Boys need more room than girls.

No longer know the exact dimensions, it is a homemade cage but I can measure. I wouldn’t say it’s too small but I’d say it could be bigger, I just don’t have the space for it, though if It’s mandatory then I’m just going to have to take up half of the room. I care more about them than space.
 
Ok. Obviously, without knowing the measurements, we could not advise further on whether space is going to be an issue. However, with boys, lack of space is a good way to cause problems, and particularly now they have already had a few issues more space would never hurt! As you’ve said, if it does get extended, then it opens up the option for you to separate them should they need arise again.
If you search for ‘cage size guide’ on this site you will find the recommended dimensions.
 
Ok. Obviously, without knowing the measurements, we could not advise further on whether space is going to be an issue. However, with boys, lack of space is a good way to cause problems, and particularly now they have already had a few issues more space would never hurt! As you’ve said, if it does get extended, then it opens up the option for you to separate them should they need arise again.
If you search for ‘cage size guide’ on this site you will find the recommended dimensions.

Perfect, I’ll check it out, thank you! I just went to go clean Milton’s cuts and I’m happy to say there’s no new ones and they were talking all morning. So I’ll extend the cage today and keep watching closely.

Thanks everyone for all the advice!
 
(Absolutely guesstimating) I want to say Harvey is around 2 years and Milton 1 roughly. Unfortunately no piggie mansions here, if I were to put a separator in the boys would have too little of room for themselves. I’m thinking of maybe extending their cage out and seeing if more room helps, or if it’s not happening and fights are still present I can just close the one side off

I was wondering if maybe teenage hormones were at play which if Milton could be around 1 he could still be in. The idea of splitting the cage, although not giving them enough space each is perhaps a solution to tide them over in the meantime while you sort out a more suitable solution
 
I was wondering if maybe teenage hormones were at play which if Milton could be around 1 he could still be in. The idea of splitting the cage, although not giving them enough space each is perhaps a solution to tide them over in the meantime while you sort out a more suitable solution

I did a bit of looking back and am thinking he’s more around 8 months. Milton’s scratches are healing very nicely and quickly, I am keeping them very clean, and there’s been no fighting since! Bit of rumple strutting here and there, that’s it. They’ve even been sharing hay, and a carrot. There’s been no chattering since either. I’m working on getting the cage bigger, but I’m crossing everything they’ll be able to over come this. I know it’s rare, but I have so much hope. My biggest concern is that I don’t let them fight for a hierarchy and I remove them and then it’s a done deal forever. Seeing them together now is giving me hope.
 
If he is 8 months then that is right in the middle of teenage hormones. Somewhere between 8 and 10 months of age there is another hormone spike and things don’t begin to settle until around 14 months of age. So you aren’t out of the woods yet.
I have a pair of teenage boars - one is almost 9 months and the other almost 10 months and while my two are well bonded, I am always mindful that they are both at a difficult age so I keep an eye on them and always have separation options!
 
If he is 8 months then that is right in the middle of teenage hormones. Somewhere between 8 and 10 months of age there is another hormone spike and things don’t begin to settle until around 14 months of age. So you aren’t out of the woods yet.
I have a pair of teenage boars - one is almost 9 months and the other almost 10 months and while my two are well bonded, I am always mindful that they are both at a difficult age so I keep an eye on them and always have separation options!

I took a leap of faith and decided to let them fight it out, and I am happy I did. They’re getting alone just fine now, and Milton’s cuts are healing nicely, he gets a treat while I clean his cuts with a saline solution, he doesn’t mind one bit. I’m not saying they’re best friends, there’s still a little bit of dominance but all normal behaviours now, no fights! I was so worried I’d have to separate them. I am still watching them closely but they’ve been doing great.
 
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