New piggy behavior

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AlleyCat

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Sadly, two weeks ago we lost one of our girls. It has been very traumatic. However, yesterday, we brought home a new one month old girl from a shelter. As per the advice of the shelter, we put her in her own habitat in the same room as our girl. Even though the vet thinks Lightening is healthy she said we should keep her separated from Panda for a week just to make sure.

Our girl is 4 months old and has always been sweet, gentle and loving. However, now that there is a new piggy in the room she is going crazy trying to get close to her. She’s squeaking nonstop, nipping me and trying to get into the baby’s cage. Is this normal behavior? I’m worried about introducing them next weekend. Panda is much bigger than Lightening.
 
I’m sorry for your loss.

Please don’t keep them separated. You don’t quarantine baby piggies, you forego it all and just accept that you may need to treat both piggies for any illness The new One brings in. The social needs of piggies under four months old are so great that they must never be kept separate and need to be bonded with another piggy straight away.
Plus the fact is, you’ve put her in the same room as Panda anyway so she has already been exposed to any potential illnesses the baby may have , thus having them in separate cages pointless. If you quarantine a piggy, which as I said cannot be done for babies under four months of age, then quarantine needs to be done in a completely separate Room in any event.

please follow the bonding guide below and introduce them on neutral territory immediately (don’t just put them into each other’s cages, you need to put them in an area that doesn’t form part of the normal territory first) and if successful after several hours, move them to the cage together and let them live together from now on

Dont worry about their size difference, it doesn’t make any difference, she won’t hurt her

Bonding and Interaction: Illustrated social behaviours and bonding dynamics
Dominance Behaviours In Guinea Pigs
 
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:agr:

A 2-3 weeks quarantine has to be conducted in another room in order to prevent fungal spores or airborne respiratory bacteria etc. from coming into contact with your other piggies.

However, the need for company and in guinea pigs under 4 months (sub-teenage) is so overwhelming that it has to come before a quarantine. While exotics are gradually starting to realise the importance of companionship in guinea pigs, this has not necessarily yet penetrated as far as general vets that don't deal with guinea pigs on a frequent basis.

This means that if you have several piggies, at least one of them (ideally a single, a pair or a lower ranked member of a larger group) should be introduced immediately and spend the quarantining period in another room with the youngster. From 4 piggies onwards, you can either split or take the risk of having to treat all of them but try to avoid having a single piggy in either room and rather quarantine together unless one of an existing pair is very frail and you have to weigh up the competing risks against each other.
Importance Of Quarantine
Arrival in a home from the perspective of pet shop guinea pigs

Here is our grieving guide to help you cope with your own loss and trauma. Dying and a loss are sadly often quite traumatic, especially if you have never experienced it before: Death, Dying, Terminal Illness, Grieving and Bereaved Companions: Information and Support for Owners and Their Children
 
Thank you both! I will properly introduce the girls today then. The baby seems healthy. So we’ll just put them together and keep a close eye on both of them. Crossing my fingers it goes well.
 
AlleyCat said:
Thank you both! I will properly introduce the girls today then. The baby seems healthy. So we’ll just put them together and keep a close eye on both of them. Crossing my fingers it goes well.
Click to expand...

Please do the intro on neutral ground and carefully read our bonding guide first.
 
Wiebke said:
Please do the intro on neutral ground and carefully read our bonding guide first.
Click to expand...

The baby, Lightning, was over-the-moon to meet Panda. Panda nipped at her and I’m still unsure if Panda is happy or not about Lightening. At one point, she put her back to Lightening and just chattered. She didn’t play with the baby at all. I put them on the floor in our bathroom for two and a half hours. It was neutral territory with a chunk of hay in the middle. No blood so that’s good.
 
Sows rarely draw blood.
have you moved them both to the cage together now then?
 
Yes, they are together but Panda is in her own little hiding spot in the habitat. Poor baby wants to snuggle but I don’t think Panda wants that. Maybe tomorrow...
 
Piggies aren’t always snuggly, so they may never want to share a hidey. as long as there is no negative behaviours, then that’s good
 
Right now, you are in the thick of the post-intro dominance phase (you can find the information on that important part of the bonding process that most people are not aware of at the end of the bonding process).

Your girl is currently making very sure that the little one is respecting her private sphere and is putting the little one firmly in her place. Things will relax once your girl is happy that her dominance in the bond is totally enforced and respected. This also happens at the end of the weaning process by the mothers and other grouo members when the babies lose their special protected status in the group and are very emphatically placed at the bottom of the group hierarchy. It only determines the shape of the group but not how close the bond will eventually become. Dominant or insecure adults are often not very demonstrative. the dominance phase lasts on average abut 2 weeks.
Bonding and Interaction: Illustrated social behaviours and bonding dynamics
Sows: Behaviour and female health problems (including ovarian cysts)

It is a very unrealistic human expectation that all piggies snuggle up; in most cases this is not the case. It is just not 'cute' and therefore not worth posting pictures and videos about it.
 
It has been a few days. However, now I’m concerned that my older girl is bullying the baby. Every time the older girl comes near the baby the baby starts to cry loudly. The baby is freezing in fear and crying. Normal? 😳
 
The issue could be that you project human emotion on to the situation - she may simply be submitting by the squealing not crying with fear. . As they are still within the two week period post introduction, you will see behaviours consistent with them still establishing a relationship.

is the baby being allowed to eat and rest or is she being chased away from food and is losing weight, or being chased out of hideys constantly?

the guide below explains the two weeks period, have a look at it and see if it could be what you are seeing

Bonding and Interaction: Illustrated social behaviours and bonding dynamics
 
AlleyCat said:
It has been a few days. However, now I’m concerned that my older girl is bullying the baby. Every time the older girl comes near the baby the baby starts to cry loudly. The baby is freezing in fear and crying. Normal? 😳
Click to expand...

The post-intro dominance period is never nice. Neither is submission crying - it can really throw owners that have never experienced it but it is a very effective behaviour even though babies are very dramatic. The behaviour is par for the course when the adult is insisting on abject submission.
Dominance Behaviours In Guinea Pigs
 
Piggies&buns said:
The issue could be that you project human emotion on to the situation - she may simply be submitting by the squealing not crying with fear. . As they are still within the two week period post introduction, you will see behaviours consistent with them still establishing a relationship.

is the baby being allowed to eat and rest or is she being chased away from food and is losing weight, or being chased out of hideys constantly?

the guide below explains the two weeks period, have a look at it and see if it could be what you are seeing

Bonding and Interaction: Illustrated social behaviours and bonding dynamics
Click to expand...

Good point, I could be projecting. My older piggy chases her and I did see nipping tonight. I haven’t noticed weight loss but I also spend time hand feeding them each. I
Wiebke said:
The post-intro dominance period is never nice. Neither is submission crying - it can really throw owners that have never experienced it but it is a very effective behaviour even though babies are very dramatic. The behaviour is par for the course when the adult is insisting on abject submission.
Dominance Behaviours In Guinea Pigs
Click to expand...

It’s so alarming to hear it. I keep checking the baby for bites. Hopefully they’ll chill out soon. Thanks for your advice and encouragement. It’s very helpful as I want to be the best piggie parent I can be.
 
Sows use nips that don’t break skin. So more of a...tap I guess. If she’s gaining weight then she’s being allowed to eat. Just remember it can go on for two weeks!
 
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