new girl piggie... fighting

[loubylou34]

Hi, I am posting on behalf of a friend. She has 2 sow piggies from P@H, they have been together in the group with no problems, then on bringing them home they have been fighting, with one really laying into the other and has taken quite a chunk off her ear drawing blood. (no other obvious wounds) they keep squeaking and circling, one deffo trying to 'get' the other. there has been food and water blocking etc.

Now as my friend had to go to work yesterday I suggested keeping the in the cage together but putting one in a carrier ( I have 2 rabbits so have a tiny amount of ideas re bonding etc.) so they can still smell each other etc.

She has tried washing the pigs, but they still fight.

What should she do, she rang P@H who told her there was nothing she could do, just bring them back and they'll give her 2 more (!)

Ow she is doing neutral ground (bathroom) introduction with food in the middle and keeping them together but separated in the cage.

Any gems of wisddom?

 

[Connie]

(written to your friend)

Unfortunatly once piggies have drawn blood it is unlikely they will ever be able to go back together. Piggies will fight to the death if you let them.

However PLEASE dont take either piggy back to pets at home. Any piggy with an injury will likely just be put down.

There are a couple of options.

Firstly, you could choose to bond both of them with a new friend(bonded carefully) At your local rescue centre. If you choose a respectable rescue you have the gaurantee that the animals you take home will be well bonded, health, and not pregnant.
Secondly, if you do not have the space to keep too pairs the rescue may be willing to take in one piggy, and bond the remaining piggy with a friend.

However, a couple of things to be wary of, Are you 100% sure they are both females? If you need any help sexing them, just post pictures of there privates and we can help.

Also, make sure that the cage meets the minimum requirments (pets at home are notorious for selling cages that are far to small. This can causing fighting and is in no way your fault, however a rescue wont rehome untill your cage meets requirments(however it may already meet them ))

I'm sorry you have been put in the sittuation. However unfortunatly pet shop piggies are not carefully bonded like rescue pigs, and that often means you end up taking home a "pair" that dont really like eachother at all!

 

[loubylou34]

Thanks all, my friend has take nadvice from a better pet shop locally who have sold her some neutralising spray to save bathing the pigs, and talked her though re introduction, it seems to be helping a bit although there was some chasing and nipping after the kids had been allowed to hold them, so I think they are going to do some more neutralising today and not let the kids touch them for a few days.

Thanks all, fingers crossed!

 

[Connie]

Goodluck. I hope it works out for her

 

[loubylou34]

Well, all seemed well, girls slept together and semed calm, but it would seem P@H have demonstrated their fabulous skills with live animals again! One of the piggies seems to be gaining weight very rapidly around the middle.... pregnant methinks.. and the other one seems to be itching and agitated with their fur.. any ideas what that could be?

My friend is taking them to the vet (At P@H) to get them both checked out!
Thanks for you help though.xx

 

[Connie]

Please dont go to the pets at home vet. They will likely diagnoise wrong and give more wrong advise endangering the piggies. They may also force her to hand the piggies back untill they are "better" at which point the miraculously die. ¬_¬ If you tell us where in the country you are we can recomend a cavvy savvy vet (guinea pigs are considered exotic pets)

Here is some information regarding preganacy and how to deal with it.

If you rfriend feels he/she is unable to deal with a pregnant sow please find a local rescue centre. P@H will likely try to get you to hand over any babies born. Please dont. If your local rescue cant take the babies we may be able to organise a piggy train through the forum to transport them to another rescue near by. The cycle will only start again if they are left with pets at home. Please Please be super sure they are both female. It is not uncommon for them to be miss sexed at the shop.

Please try to sorce some alfalfa hay (this will help pups bones and should be fed to mum untill end of nursing period, pups may eat it too)

and an extra Vit C rich veg than usual to her daily veg intake and DONT feed parsley (it can cause miscariages).

If when she gives birth shes having trouble unwrapping the pups, please do it for her this will not harm them and she wont reject them.

If she seems at all stressed by her female cage mates (if she has any) please move her to her own cage. All males must be removed as she will come into season right after giving birth, so she could get pregnant again if he isnt removed. If he has been neutered he should still be removed as when she comes into season after the birth he will still try to mate her (even though he cant get her pregnant) and this will be stressfull for her while she needs to be concentraiting on the pups. Also be aware that as she is a first time mum its possible she may at first be afraid of her babies. This can sometimes be delt with by placing her in a smaller enclosed space like a cardboard box, with her and only the pups so she is forced to accept them.

Once babies are born please weight them (give them an hour or two, but in the first day). 70g-100g is normal, anything under this but over 50g please post for advice on here, under 50g, and post as urgent in the pregnancy and labour section as those/that pup will likely need extra help. (dont be alarmed if there weight drops in the first day or two. This is normal but should then start to rise once mothers milk comes through)

Male pups will need seperating at 21 days old provided they reach 250g. If you need help sexing dont be afraid to post pictures. You will need the space to seperate any and all males, then divide them into pairs and/or fine a friend for any lone males left over if you plan to keep them long term. If you dont (which everyone will understand) you will still need to remove males at 21 days or they can get mum pregnant again. If this is difficult, or you need to rehome any please contact a local rescue. They will keep the pups untill 6-8weeks so they are sure the pups are thriving, and then the home they go to will be checked for suitability (please be aware guineas sold on free ads are prime reptile food- espcially little ones).

Also make sure there is a hidey in the cage big enough for her to give birth in should she want some privacy.

Perhaps you could encourage her to research what a roan and lethal guinea pig is to see if her piggies are at risk?

Guinea pig gestation is around 72 days.

Please have the number of a cavvy savvy vet to hand at all times incase you need it. (if she bleeds more than a teaspoon during/after labour please rush her to the vet. Also rush her if she appears to have a pup still inside and it has been 20 minutes since the last one was born.

Also, very important, only handle her when absolutely necessary. Handling pregnant piggies can harm the pups. If you desperately need her to be moved *ie for cleaning out or vet trips) Try to get her into an up side down cardboard box with a hole in the side for her to walk in and out. (maybe place a treat in there for her.) then hold your hand over the hole while carrying her in the box to wherever she needs to go.

Sorry, i know thats alot of info for you, if you have any other questions dont hesitate to ask in out pregnancy and labour section.

 

[loubylou34]

Please dont go to the pets at home vet. They will likely diagnoise wrong and give more wrong advise endangering the piggies. They may also force her to hand the piggies back untill they are "better" at which point the miraculously die. ¬_¬ If you tell us where in the country you are we can recomend a cavvy savvy vet (guinea pigs are considered exotic pets)

Here is some information regarding preganacy and how to deal with it.

If you rfriend feels he/she is unable to deal with a pregnant sow please find a local rescue centre. P@H will likely try to get you to hand over any babies born. Please dont. If your local rescue cant take the babies we may be able to organise a piggy train through the forum to transport them to another rescue near by. The cycle will only start again if they are left with pets at home. Please Please be super sure they are both female. It is not uncommon for them to be miss sexed at the shop.

Please try to sorce some alfalfa hay (this will help pups bones and should be fed to mum untill end of nursing period, pups may eat it too)

and an extra Vit C rich veg than usual to her daily veg intake and DONT feed parsley (it can cause miscariages).

If when she gives birth shes having trouble unwrapping the pups, please do it for her this will not harm them and she wont reject them.

If she seems at all stressed by her female cage mates (if she has any) please move her to her own cage. All males must be removed as she will come into season right after giving birth, so she could get pregnant again if he isnt removed. If he has been neutered he should still be removed as when she comes into season after the birth he will still try to mate her (even though he cant get her pregnant) and this will be stressfull for her while she needs to be concentraiting on the pups. Also be aware that as she is a first time mum its possible she may at first be afraid of her babies. This can sometimes be delt with by placing her in a smaller enclosed space like a cardboard box, with her and only the pups so she is forced to accept them.

Once babies are born please weight them (give them an hour or two, but in the first day). 70g-100g is normal, anything under this but over 50g please post for advice on here, under 50g, and post as urgent in the pregnancy and labour section as those/that pup will likely need extra help. (dont be alarmed if there weight drops in the first day or two. This is normal but should then start to rise once mothers milk comes through)

Male pups will need seperating at 21 days old provided they reach 250g. If you need help sexing dont be afraid to post pictures. You will need the space to seperate any and all males, then divide them into pairs and/or fine a friend for any lone males left over if you plan to keep them long term. If you dont (which everyone will understand) you will still need to remove males at 21 days or they can get mum pregnant again. If this is difficult, or you need to rehome any please contact a local rescue. They will keep the pups untill 6-8weeks so they are sure the pups are thriving, and then the home they go to will be checked for suitability (please be aware guineas sold on free ads are prime reptile food- espcially little ones).

Also make sure there is a hidey in the cage big enough for her to give birth in should she want some privacy.

Perhaps you could encourage her to research what a roan and lethal guinea pig is to see if her piggies are at risk?

Guinea pig gestation is around 72 days.

Please have the number of a cavvy savvy vet to hand at all times incase you need it. (if she bleeds more than a teaspoon during/after labour please rush her to the vet. Also rush her if she appears to have a pup still inside and it has been 20 minutes since the last one was born.

Also, very important, only handle her when absolutely necessary. Handling pregnant piggies can harm the pups. If you desperately need her to be moved *ie for cleaning out or vet trips) Try to get her into an up side down cardboard box with a hole in the side for her to walk in and out. (maybe place a treat in there for her.) then hold your hand over the hole while carrying her in the box to wherever she needs to go.

Sorry, i know thats alot of info for you, if you have any other questions dont hesitate to ask in out pregnancy and labour section.

WOW Connie, what a wondeful source of info, thank you so much for taking time to write that out.
It is a difficult position being the third party here. She took them to P@H and actually they were very helpful (she felt) they sexed the piggies again, and yes both female, and not pregnant, but perhaps not active enough.. the fighting is slowing down and reassuarnce was given re fighting.
So all at home again, seem to settling into new family life.

Thank you for help.x

 

[Connie]

Please be aware there is no way a vet could no for sure if they were pregnant without an ultrasound. Piggies wont show any real signs besides weight gain untill they are 6/7 weeks. (piggies who carry only one baby sometimes NEVER look pregnant and even experienced people miss it)

I'm glad her fears have been calmed somewhat and I also know none of this is in your controll, however at such a young age they should not be overweigh, not if they are being fed the correct diet and are in a cage big enough. Theyshouldnt have had time to get "fat" Any calories they take on at there age should be being used for even growth.

If she wants to make sure (and its good practise anyway) The piggies can be weighed weekly. A stable increase in weight (putting on the same amount it week) Would indicate happy healthy growing piggies. An exponential increase in weight (putting on more weight each week) Would indicate pregnancy.

I think youve done a wonderful thing doing all this research for your friend. And we on the forum are always happy to help anyone who needs it (even more so for those who ask. )