My Guinea Pig Struggle

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jesgon

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all my guinea pigs want in life is for me to STAY AWAY from them. they are much happier beings when I am no where near them and one of them has no trouble showing that.

their names are peanut and minnie

i’ve given them everything and been so good to them. i bought them a c&c cage fleece bedding which i keep spotless so they’ll be happier, little fleece accessories, and i work on taming them all the time.


i never pick up minnie because she’s just too afraid. she can’t even move when she sees me. and i think she’s kind of…..slow…. because whenever she gets startled by a loud noise she runs AT the noise or into a wall. i know its just like her having a heart attack inside so i don’t even try to hold her in my lap because i feel its cruel. if i hold her she can’t move a muscle, i know it must feel like sheer terror for her. so i don’t put her through this.

peanut on the other hand is not afraid. she’s just a certified brat. she will WALTZ right up to me, right up to my hand to smell take food right from my hand even walk up to my face, touch her nose to my nose to sniff it if i put her on the couch and kneel by it. she’s only smelling to try to get food, trust me she freaking hates me. in the beginning of my taming her she was too afraid to show me she hates when i touch her. BUT…. once she got brave and more comfortable with me (more readily takes the food from my hand and just generally shows comfortability) she grew the balls to start showing me just how much she dislikes me. she constantly, constantly bites. and no, please do not be like “guinea pigs aren’t mean she’s just afraid”, god that pisses me off. it is the OPPOSITE. the less afraid of me she gets, the more confident she is in my lap the ballsier she gets to show me “i do not want to be here”. my hand will be no where near her and she’ll seek it out and bite it with all her force to convey this. she’ll even bend her head back 45 degrees to reach around and dig her teeth into my finger to say “put me back b**** i freaking hate you”. yes, her bites have drawn blood. they are not testing “is this food” bites. she seeks out my hand and bites it so freaking hard. the more confident she gets with me, the less time it takes for her to do her first bite once i put her in my lap. i used to be able to have her in my lap for like 2 minutes before she’d gain the confidence to take a chomp out of me. now its more like 20 seconds. and if i don’t put her back, she just keeps doing it. she’ll bite me 10+ times in one setting

and she doesn’t always bite to convey that she doesn’t want to be here. sometimes, she wants something and she’ll bite me to get her way. for example if my hands are blocking something she wants to get to, she’ll go up to my hand and bite it as hard as she can drawing blood, because she wants me to move it. she’s such a little brat its not even funny.

the other day she was sitting in my lap and hadn’t bit yet so i wanted to reward her for being good (Even though going 60 second without biting isn’t really being good). so i let her down to explore the carpet, which i never do i only let her out for floor time on tile. she got so excited to be on the carpet ruining around wheeking like i just brought her hay. 30 seconds to a minute pass, and i decide to pick her back up because i really don’t want her to pee on the carpet. i pick her up properly and gently and put her in my lap. once she’s on my lap and stops wheeking and realizes that i just cut her play time short, she bites into me probably the hardest she’s ever done mad that i took her away from the carpet.

i cried over this, not because it hurt (which it did, so much) just because I’ve done everything for her and been so good to her and i feel like i got the only bitchy guinea pig who bites not out of fear but out of sass, and 10 times each time i have her out. they stink up my apartment, i spot clean their cage every 4 hours, spent 300 on fleeces and c&c etc, and for what? for two animals that would hate me and wish i would just go away? ones that want nothing to do with me? i just wish so badly peanut was not like this. i try so unbelievably hard on her.
 
How long have you had them and do they make any particular sounds when you're handling?
 
Since august i believe. i work on them (particularly peanut) every. damn. day. So hard. Spend so much time trying to socialize them. And no sounds.

If she was biting me out of fear i would understand. But its truly the opposite. The more tame and confident she becomes, the sassier she gets and the less afraid to show me she doesn't like me she is. Before I'd tamed her enough to come up to me and take food from me, she would never bite she was way too afraid. Now she's not afraid at all, she'll come right up to me. And now that she's confident enough, she has the balls to bite me to say I don't like this. And thats what pisses me off.
 
THANK YOU. you are the first person to acknowledge that, everyone else is like "she's just scared!". its the opposite.
 
Hi and welcome!

You may find this thread here helpful to understand what is going on: http://www.theguineapigforum.co.uk/...stincts-and-speak-piggy-body-language.117031/
This is for tips on how to make the pick-up a lot more stress-free: http://www.theguineapigforum.co.uk/videos/

Unfortunately for you and many others, guinea pigs are not born as cuddly toys and not all of them will every come to love being hugged and petted. Most will eventually come to tolerate being handled, though, but it can take months (or even years) and a lot of patience! Concentrate on making friends with her through interacting with her without cuddling her; you will ge a lot of enjoyment out of that and she will trust you more if you do not push her too far. It is actually a good sign that she is trusting you enough to tell you her feelings. You can build on that!

I would recommend that you gently assert your dominance by using the trick I have including in my link; that shuld curb the biting somewhat. Tell her off calmly if she does it, but use a chiding/disappointed tone of voice rather than a sharp one. Piggies don't do "no" well. However, in turn listen to what she has to say to you!

PS: With members from all over the world, we find it very helpful if you added your country, state or (for the UK) your county/city, so we can always give you the best possible advice and recommendations for your part of the world straight away. Please click on your username on the top bar, then go to personal details and scroll down to location. Thanks!
 
Thank you for the links! I could open the first one but not the second

Yes, I can tell that her biting me is a sign of comfortability so its good in that sense but its also mean and hurts quite a bitXD

I've been doing the telling her off calmly thing (never yelling at her, except the accidental yelp that comes out of me when she gets a good one in), and it doesn't seem to work. I say no peanut don't do that that was mean girl be nice in a reprimanding tone that is different from my sweet talking tone i usually use. I've tried NOT giving in to what she wants (when she bites me because she wants to get past me hand I'll not let her get past) and I've also tried giving in to what she wants-- if she bites to say i don't want to be here sometimes ill put her back. neither approach seems to work. and neither does the calmly reprimanding which i do each time. her biting has grown exponentially with her confidence. you would not believe it, seriously. the time it takes for her to land her first bite dwindles each time, and she's comfortable enough/ settled in enough that at this point 20 seconds in she'll have the balls to start biting. and it keeps going the entire duration of the lap time, she keeps going for another bite with maybe 30 seconds in between. you wouldn't believe how many times in a row she'll bite me.

and the other one i just can't interact with. she does the "dead" thing, even after months of taming every damn day. poor thing is just so terrified i feel sorry for her.

I'm just really sad that i didn't end up with a guinea pig i can comfortably interact with. it makes me really sad because i sacrificed my nice new apartment to have them. it smelled pristine before i got them now that i have them (even with cleaning it all the time to keep them happy) it stinks up my whole place. and i've spent a ton of money on them too with all the fleece stuff. and the saddest to me is the amount of hours of love i put into peanut, long periods of time each day, and she's just so mean.
 
jesgon said:
Thank you for the links! I could open the first one but not the second

Yes, I can tell that her biting me is a sign of comfortability so its good in that sense but its also mean and hurts quite a bitXD

I've been doing the telling her off calmly thing (never yelling at her, except the accidental yelp that comes out of me when she gets a good one in), and it doesn't seem to work. I say no peanut don't do that that was mean girl be nice in a reprimanding tone that is different from my sweet talking tone i usually use. I've tried NOT giving in to what she wants (when she bites me because she wants to get past me hand I'll not let her get past) and I've also tried giving in to what she wants-- if she bites to say i don't want to be here sometimes ill put her back. neither approach seems to work. and neither does the calmly reprimanding which i do each time. her biting has grown exponentially with her confidence. you would not believe it, seriously. the time it takes for her to land her first bite dwindles each time, and she's comfortable enough/ settled in enough that at this point 20 seconds in she'll have the balls to start biting. and it keeps going the entire duration of the lap time, she keeps going for another bite with maybe 30 seconds in between. you wouldn't believe how many times in a row she'll bite me.

and the other one i just can't interact with. she does the "dead" thing, even after months of taming every damn day. poor thing is just so terrified i feel sorry for her.

I'm just really sad that i didn't end up with a guinea pig i can comfortably interact with. it makes me really sad because i sacrificed my nice new apartment to have them. it smelled pristine before i got them now that i have them (even with cleaning it all the time to keep them happy) it stinks up my whole place. and i've spent a ton of money on them too with all the fleece stuff. and the saddest to me is the amount of hours of love i put into peanut, long periods of time each day, and she's just so mean.
Click to expand...

I used to have a bad biter, but I worked around it. Eventually, she only bit when she has a real reason for it (like being forced to take horribly tasting meds). It took over a year until she allowed me to touch her, but aptly named Minx is still the most special of my piggies because of her larger than life personality and her being more like a little dog following me everywhere (including upstairs and around the garden) than a guinea pig.
It can well be that your girl associates your hand with some negative. Have you tried giving her little treats and praising her for all the time she does NOT bite you? Or keep your hand out of the way by snuggling her under a towel on your lap? The latter may also work for your frightened girl. Trust is a very tender plant; some piggies have a longer journey depending o their background. But when the day finally comes that you know that they do trust you, it is all the more special!

As to the video link not working for you (it often depends on what kind of appliance you are accessing this forum from), I am tagging admin for you: @BossHogg @Falken @sport_billy
 
I will direct link the video for you in a minute, the link is broken to the video page... I'll just grab the video off youtube
 
I don't think she associates my hand with anything bad, I always give her treats (maybe more than i should) and have never handled her badly at all. i think that she just doesn't want to be on my lap in general and wants to show it and the only thing she can reach is my hand. i think she would bite me anywhere to show it but the hand is what is near her. i can't praise her for the time she doesn't bite me because there is never, ever a time when i take her out that she doesn't bite me. there used to be but not anymore. thats why i got so excited that one time it looked like she wasn't biting that i tried to reward her by letting her on the carpet and when i cut her playtime short she gave me her worst bite ever out of anger.
i could definitely try wrapping my other scared one in a towel while i hold her. i just feel bad to hold her at all, you know? because i know it must feel so awful to be THAT scared and i know its like torturing her.
it makes me sad that these are the only two guinea pigs i have and neither of them i can have even decent interactions with :(
i'd never get rid of them (because i know most likely they wouldn't get to a good home) but they don't bring me any joy because i can't interact with them. and i don't feel happy looking at peanut because she's so aggressive to me i can't think of her as a sweet creature, just a bratty girl. and minnie i just look at and feel sorry for.
but, regardless, I'll still try to give them the best life they i can (as they only live a short life), EVEN THOUGH peanut is ungrateful/mean to me, ill continue to buy them lots of fleece stuff and try to make their cage a palace. and having minnie the scared one is like not having an animal at all, she doesn't even move.
 
Oh I never thought about picking them up in a tube (didn't occur to me that i could just cover each end x) but i do often get them in cozies
 
We had a really bad biter in in Vimto, she would draw blood. I thought she was just one of those piggies that hated being handled and was willing to accept this, she would accept food at the bars off us but whenever she was on our lap she would turn round to snap and bite me, really vicious..
I started just having her out for 20 seconds fed her some coriander and put her back I would do this 2 times a week, 20 seconds no more... After 3 weeks I increased to 30 seconds and so on very slowly. Vimto is now our only pig that enjoys time on our lap and she no longer bites me. We have developed a nice bond.... It turns out she was used to us enough to be brave in the cage but obviously still felt vulnerable and scared on my lap. IT is a fear response you are seeing, not hatred.

I can also recommend getting something like a cavy cosy for laptime this will help the piggies feel more secure too
 
do you think i should just get one more and cross my fingers super hard that this time ill get lucky? so at least ill have one that i can enjoy?
 
jesgon said:
I don't think she associates my hand with anything bad, I always give her treats (maybe more than i should) and have never handled her badly at all. i think that she just doesn't want to be on my lap in general and wants to show it and the only thing she can reach is my hand. i think she would bite me anywhere to show it but the hand is what is near her. i can't praise her for the time she doesn't bite me because there is never, ever a time when i take her out that she doesn't bite me. there used to be but not anymore. thats why i got so excited that one time it looked like she wasn't biting that i tried to reward her by letting her on the carpet and when i cut her playtime short she gave me her worst bite ever out of anger.
i could definitely try wrapping my other scared one in a towel while i hold her. i just feel bad to hold her at all, you know? because i know it must feel so awful to be THAT scared and i know its like torturing her.
it makes me sad that these are the only two guinea pigs i have and neither of them i can have even decent interactions with :(
i'd never get rid of them (because i know most likely they wouldn't get to a good home) but they don't bring me any joy because i can't interact with them. and i don't feel happy looking at peanut because she's so aggressive to me i can't think of her as a sweet creature, just a bratty girl. and minnie i just look at and feel sorry for.
but, regardless, I'll still try to give them the best life they i can (as they only live a short life), EVEN THOUGH peanut is ungrateful/mean to me, ill continue to buy them lots of fleece stuff and try to make their cage a palace. and having minnie the scared one is like not having an animal at all, she doesn't even move.
Click to expand...

It sounds like they were both very traumatised when they arrived, which is a pity for you. Where are they from?

PS: Biting is still a defense/fear response. The previous opinions were not at all wrong. When you take peanut out on your lap, do so on a thick fleece baby blanket that she cannot bite through, but like sport-billy said, do so only shortly, so she sees her own fears appreciated.
 
they were from petco in the US. i could try the 20 second at a time thing, that sounds like a good idea. I just don't see why they are so....."we would rather you not be here"! i gave them this nice c&c cage, i always change out their fleece liner, never leave poop around because i feel it makes them less happy, i rearrange their different fleece accessories (fleece caves/fleece tunnels/ beds) to make their life more exciting lol, give them lots of toys always feed them their favorite treats (APPLES)..... am by their cage all the time (seriously, I sleep on my couch across from them) always talk to them so sweetly and softly and tell them how good they are
 
they aren't worth it to me at this point (mainly the smell it seriously ruins my apartment its so embarrassing), as i get ZERO absolutely zero reward from them all they want is me to leave them alone and not come near them. but id never give them away or to a shelter because i view it as morally wrong. and I'm not going to stop treating them like princesses. I just feel like... kind of unlucky. i know it sounds like I'm whining, but i wish just one of them was interactable. oh well, luck of the draw!
 
It honestly is just fear, you never know the trauma pets may have been in before. Peanut doesn't hate you, she is just very scared. Try and see it as someone who needs lots of love and careful attention to slowly bring her round. I do understand this is distressing for you and that you are struggling to build a bond with her as you are not getting any positivity back despite trying to give her the best life. I struggled with Vimto quite a lot so have been there but you can overcome it with lots of time. As I said it took nearly a year with Vimto to feel safe with me.

You sound like you are giving them an amazing life with lots of lovely things.
 
I've been extremely lucky with my 6, although they protest loudly at being picked up, they've never nipped, in fact Rebel would hold onto my finger with his front paws as he loved being held, Bart and Stanley would happily sit in your lap and let you stroke them till the cows come home. Angel and Bella would squeak non stop till you put them down, and Lola just loves company, whether human or rabbit. Looking forward to her new hutchmate arriving on Saturday. :yahoo:
 
I guess she doesn't hate me, but i do know that they really want me to leave them alone and to stay away. When I hold peanut her entire life's mission will be to get away from me. I even just come near their cage and start talking kindly to them and they chatter their teeth at me. they just more than anything in the world want me to leave them alone.
 
Stanley was bought from a petshop, Bart, Bella, Angel and Lola were rescued from people who no longer wanted them and were going to dump them! and Rebel was my loved freebie pig, we had him from minute one, Lola was 3 weeks pregnant when we got her. He was so handsome we had to keep him. We lost him last month to pnuemonia, he was only 3. :(
 
I'm sorry about rebel! I'm very jealous you got all good ones
 
They were all skittish and afraid when I got them, it takes time to build up their trust, keep going and they will come around when they realise the two legged hairless giant brings cuddles, chin rubs and nom noms. ;)
 
One of my piggies is a biter. I have had her since she was six and she stil bites as she hates being held. I spend time with her once or twice a week and have her on my lap without touching her. This seems to work for us.

Guinea pigs are such nervous little things and them biting is just a way of letting us know they are unhappy. Your piggy is not being mean as she does not understand biting is hurting you. Piggies from pet shops have a terrible time right from birth and do not have any handling so it explains her nerves.

Another of my pigs was abused in the past and plays dead when I hold her. I have had her for two years and although she is slightly more confident she is very nervous still. I just hold her for five minutes a day and hope one day she will learn I will never hurt her.
 
You seem really quite angry about them and I do understand this because you aren't getting what you want from them but if you are going to stand any chance of enjoying them and getting a bond with them then you need to let the anger go as they will probably be picking up on this. Rather than thinking about how you feel let down start trying to find way that you can reach a compromise that meets all of your needs.

I have 2 piggies - Barney has always been a Tazmanian Devil. I wanted to cuddle him FOREVER and he wanted to be as far away from me as possible. It took until he sunk his teeth into me for me to realise that he just hated being held. So now - I still get to have a cuddle but he has to have some food in front of him - as long as that is the case he settles down for lovely cuddles but I have to put him down as soon as he finishes. First he tries to launch himself off the sofa and if I try to stop him he nibbles my hands to start with and if I don't get the hint he will give a good bite - it is just how he communicates.

Toby has always been the big scaredy pig - took months and months and months before he stopped playing dead and even now - if we go to stroke him he will sometimes squeal and jump away - we have had them for nearly 2 years. Now we just laugh and call him a big baby! You have only had yours since august - that is not a lot of time for a traumatised piggy to get used to you. The other night he was on my husbands knee when MrS shouted 'the little just bit me'. 2 seconds later he said 'oh baby - I'm am so so sorry - I hadn't realised you were trying to tell me' - Toby piddled all over him his bite was to let MrS know that he had to be down for a wee!

They chatter like mad at us (it is impatience) - usually because they are hungry and we are taking too long to produce the goods.

Rather than looking at their behaviour as being that of delinquents try to work out what they are telling you because in my experience they are just trying to communicate and if you can learn to speak pig then your relationship will improve massively.

Good luck and keep us updated x
 
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