Multivitamins and minerals.

[PIGGIES FOREVER]

Hello.

Can guinea pigs have to many vitamins and minerals? And if so can it harm them?

 

[Wiebke]

Hello.

Can guinea pigs have to many vitamins and minerals? And if so can it harm them?

Hi!

Yes, they can. With just one or two exceptions, all cases of scurvy we have seen on here have been due to overdosing on vitamin C. The body of especially young guinea pigs gets used to these much higher than normal levels and will react with scurvy symptoms whenever the level drops - even though the actual vitamin C level is still above that of a normal healthy diet. The same also happens in humans who are long term over-supplementing, by the way.
In the case of oil-based vitamins (A+D), they build up in the liver over the course of a life-time if over-supplemente, which can cause problems in this organ down the line.

Please be aware that guinea pigs get everything they need in a normal grass hay based diet; in nearly 15 years existence and tens of thousands of piggies passing through this forum, we haven't seen a single case of genuine scurvy in well kept pet piggies. Instead of getting hung up on supplements, please concentrate on plenty of good quality grass hay (which actually contains enough vitamin C to prevent scurvy) and supplement minerals via fresh herbs and a little kale or greens (a milder UK relative of kale) every now and then. This is much closer to the diet grass/hay based natural diet that guinea pigs have evolved on which is supplemented with some forage for the nutrients and is ultimately healthier. I my own experience, a good hay and grass based diet can prolong a normal healthy life span by another year or two, taking it from the lower to the higher end, even in adopted guinea pigs from a less than optimal background.
Fresh growing grass is actually high in vitamin C and good quality hay still contains enough, too; they are the reason why guinea pigs never had the need to make their own in the first place. Also keep in mind that vitamin C is in fresh veg, in their pellets, in every recovery formula etc...
Long Term Balanced General And Special Needs Guinea Pig Diets

Please don't fall into the trap of overdoing things because there is a whole extremely lucrative industry thriving on the fact that where pets are concerned, commonsense goes out the window because your pets should only have the best and then not just some more of the best but A LOT more...

It is much more effective to give a 2-3 weeks high vitamin C booster if ever one of your piggies is really ill - because the system is not used to it, the short-term will actually do the trick and is not ignored by the body. A normal good diet without supplements is perfectly adequate to keep the immune system in peak condition and doing the job it has been designed for.

 

[PIGGIES FOREVER]

Cheers.

Very helpful.


What kind of damage can the extra vitamins and minerals do, not included vit c do to the liver and kidneys?

Hi!

Yes, they can. With just one or two exceptions, all cases of scurvy we have seen on here have been due to overdosing on vitamin C. The body of especially young guinea pigs gets used to these much higher than normal levels and will react with scurvy symptoms whenever the level drops - even though the actual vitamin C level is still above that of a normal healthy diet. The same also happens in humans who are long term over-supplementing, by the way.
In the case of oil-based vitamins (A+D), they build up in the liver over the course of a life-time if over-supplemente, which can cause problems in this organ down the line.

Please be aware that guinea pigs get everything they need in a normal grass hay based diet; in nearly 15 years existence and tens of thousands of piggies passing through this forum, we haven't seen a single case of genuine scurvy in well kept pet piggies. Instead of getting hung up on supplements, please concentrate on plenty of good quality grass hay (which actually contains enough vitamin C to prevent scurvy) and supplement minerals via fresh herbs and a little kale or greens (a milder UK relative of kale) every now and then. This is much closer to the diet grass/hay based natural diet that guinea pigs have evolved on which is supplemented with some forage for the nutrients and is ultimately healthier. I my own experience, a good hay and grass based diet can prolong a normal healthy life span by another year or two, taking it from the lower to the higher end, even in adopted guinea pigs from a less than optimal background.
Fresh growing grass is actually high in vitamin C and good quality hay still contains enough, too; they are the reason why guinea pigs never had the need to make their own in the first place. Also keep in mind that vitamin C is in fresh veg, in their pellets, in every recovery formula etc...
Long Term Balanced General And Special Needs Guinea Pig Diets

Please don't fall into the trap of overdoing things because there is a whole extremely lucrative industry thriving on the fact that where pets are concerned, commonsense goes out the window because your pets should only have the best and then not just some more of the best but A LOT more...

It is much more effective to give a 2-3 weeks high vitamin C booster if ever one of your piggies is really ill - because the system is not used to it, the short-term will actually do the trick and is not ignored by the body. A normal good diet without supplements is perfectly adequate to keep the immune system in peak condition and doing the job it has been designed for.

Cheers.

Very helpful.


What kind of damage can the extra vitamins and minerals do, not included vit c do to the liver and kidneys?

 

[Wiebke]

Cheers.

Very helpful.


What kind of damage can the extra vitamins and minerals do, not included vit c do to the liver and kidneys?



Cheers.

Very helpful.


What kind of damage can the extra vitamins and minerals do, not included vit c do to the liver and kidneys?

Seeing how little there is available in terms of effective medications to treat liver and kidney issues or failure, it is best to err on the side of caution and just concentrate on not overdoing things because you want to be extra good.
Plain 'good' is absolutely perfect. The closer the diet is to their natural one, the better for your piggies. They don't need a lot of highly processed stuff thrown at them.

I have more piggies living to a good old age of 6-8 years (and that includes adoptees from very bad backgrounds) on a normal grass/hay based diet without any additives than I had before. Concentrate on feeding a good quality of hay and keep your veg and herb diet as green as possible; that is the best long term health booster you can give your piggies. Rather consider researching into wild or garden forage to supplement a healthy diet in a more natural way if you are not living in a city and consider growing your own grass and herbs in windowsill boxes if you do.

 

[PIGGIES FOREVER]

Seeing how little there is available in terms of effective medications to treat liver and kidney issues or failure, it is best to err on the side of caution and just concentrate on not overdoing things because you want to be extra good.
Plain 'good' is absolutely perfect. The closer the diet is to their natural one, the better for your piggies. They don't need a lot of highly processed stuff thrown at them.

I have more piggies living to a good old age of 6-8 years (and that includes adoptees from very bad backgrounds) on a normal grass/hay based diet without any additives than I had before. Concentrate on feeding a good quality of hay and keep your veg and herb diet as green as possible; that is the best long term health booster you can give your piggies. Rather consider researching into wild or garden forage to supplement a healthy diet in a more natural way if you are not living in a city and consider growing your own grass and herbs in windowsill boxes if you do.

Thanks, I do try to grow herbs, it doesn't go to plan ever, lol don't have any grass in garden and not much around us, so not sure how to get enough for 8 pigs every day. I feed LFJ Miller's food baby/adult depends on age( jollies own brand ) I try to give some dry forage and I have recently started feeding super hay. My pigs have to have cranberry juice in the water, a vet recommend this to me, they get spring water. I also put probiotic on their veggies every night, I have had previously piggies bloat, and feel if I leave this off they always seem to bloat or go weird. I don't really give gassy veggies I stay clear of them, because of bloat problems, but try to give a wide range of other veggies.

 

[Wiebke]

Thanks, I do try to grow herbs, it doesn't go to plan ever, lol don't have any grass in garden and not much around us, so not sure how to get enough for 8 pigs every day. I feed LFJ Miller's food baby/adult depends on age( jollies own brand ) I try to give some dry forage and I have recently started feeding super hay. My pigs have to have cranberry juice in the water, a vet recommend this to me, they get spring water. I also put probiotic on their veggies every night, I have had previously piggies bloat, and feel if I leave this off they always seem to bloat or go weird. I don't really give gassy veggies I stay clear of them, because of bloat problems, but try to give a wide range of other veggies.

Please have a look at our veg recommendations; it may be your wide range that is the problem. High sugar veg like carrots for instance (which is like feeding a bar of chocolate) can contribute to dysbiosis, i.e. the overgrowth of the wrong kind of bacteria in the gut. So can cranberry in the water on a daily basis, which may be added vitamin C but it is also a load of sugar to feed the wrong bacteria.
I have made better experiences with a fairly limited diet of veg and giving sugary/starchy veg only as a special treat very occasionally in very small amounts. There has been quite a re-think on veg in recent years.
Long Term Balanced General And Special Needs Guinea Pig Diets

Here is our pellets comparison chart so you can check for yourself: Nugget Comparison Chart

 

[Siikibam]

How old are your piggies?

 

[PIGGIES FOREVER]

Thanks for the information , I will have a read.

The nuggets I give are not on there. I was told to do cranberry juice by a vet, I think it was to help stop urine track infections, I thought the wide variety veggies would be better, as your not limited to certain veggies and they would have plenty vit and mins from them.

 

[Piggies&buns]

Thanks for the information , I will have a read.

The nuggets I give are not on there. I was told to do cranberry juice by a vet, I think it was to help stop urine track infections, I thought the wide variety veggies would be better, as your not limited to certain veggies and they would have plenty vit and mins from them.

I’d definitely stop putting the cranberry in the water. It’s not likely to stop a UTI but it is going to overload them with sugar.
A good hay and grass based diet is what they really need, with vegetables and very limited nuggets. I’ve never given routine supplementary vitamins in all my 30 years of keeping small animals.

 

[PIGGIES FOREVER]

How old are your piggies?

I’d definitely stop putting the cranberry in the water. It’s not likely to stop a UTI but it is going to overload them with sugar.
A good hay and grass based diet is what they really need, with vegetables and very limited nuggets. I’ve never given routine supplementary vitamins in all my 30 years of keeping small animals.

I was told that cranberry juice stops the uti getting a hold. How many nuggets do you give per guinea pig?

 

[Piggies&buns]

I was told that cranberry juice stops the uti getting a hold. How many nuggets do you give per guinea pig?

Id be more concerned about the continual introduction of sugar in the diet to be honest. It’s not something I’d do.

The recommended amount of nuggets is one tablespoon per pig per day.
Mine are fed cold pressed 100% grass pellets rather than the more commercial brands, but they get less than recommended amounts. I only give them half a tablespoon each (amounts to probably four or five pellets each as they are fairly large) but they aren’t given nuggets every day.

 

[PIGGIES FOREVER]

How old are your piggies?

One at 2 years, one at 1 year, two at 1 year 10 mth, one at 1 year 7 mth, one at 11 mth, two at 7 mth.

 

[PIGGIES FOREVER]

Id be more concerned about the continual introduction of sugar in the diet to be honest. It’s not something I’d do.

The recommended amount of nuggets is one tablespoon per pig per day.
Mine are fed cold pressed 100% grass pellets rather than the more commercial brands, but they get less than recommended amounts. I only give them half a tablespoon each (amounts to probably four or five pellets each as they are fairly large) but they aren’t given nuggets every day.

I am concerned about the sugar, I'm not happy the vet told me to do this in the first place.

What nuggets do you feed? Mine are cold pressed pellets no grain or soy I think they are good pellets.

 

[Piggies&buns]

I am concerned about the sugar, I'm not happy the vet told me to do this in the first place.

What nuggets do you feed? Mine are cold pressed pellets no grain or soy I think they are good pellets.

I use Haybox pellets

 

[Siikibam]

One at 2 years, one at 1 year, two at 1 year 10 mth, one at 1 year 7 mth, one at 11 mth, two at 7 mth.

In that case there’s no need to feed them pellets meant for babies. They can all have one tablespoon each.

I don’t know why your vet gave you the advice about cranberry juice. Are they experienced in treating guinea pigs?

Could you add your country to your profile please.

 

[PIGGIES FOREVER]

I use Haybox pellets

I never heard of them.

 

[Piggies&buns]

I never heard of them.

They are a UK based company offering a subscription hay delivery service (Haybox.club) - many forum members are subscribed with them - and they also sell nuggets and forage now too.

 

[PIGGIES FOREVER]

In that case there’s no need to feed them pellets meant for babies. They can all have one tablespoon each.

I don’t know why your vet gave you the advice about cranberry juice. Are they experienced in treating guinea pigs?

Could you add your country to your profile please.

I am a bit confused when you start feeding adult pellets? On my bag of pellets it says up to 16 weeks but when you Google it says 12 mth-18 mth, it's confusing.

Yes he is an exotics vet and used to treating guinea pigs, I have changed vets since then but all the vets I have spoken to haven't said any different.

I live in England.

 

[PIGGIES FOREVER]

They are a UK based company offering a subscription hay delivery service (Haybox.club) - many forum members are subscribed with them - and they also sell nuggets and forage now too.

O.k thank you.

 

[Siikibam]

I am a bit confused when you start feeding adult pellets? On my bag of pellets it says up to 16 weeks but when you Google it says 12 mth-18 mth, it's confusing.

Yes he is an exotics vet and used to treating guinea pigs, I have changed vets since then but all the vets I have spoken to haven't said any different.

I live in England.

Adult pellets can be fed from when they’re weaned, or latest from four months of age. Don’t go by the bags as they’re misleading about the amount to be fed anyway. The companies want to make money and aren’t too fussed about what is right.

Young piggy pellets will also usually contain lucerne/alfalfa. That’s not necessary once they’ve been weaned.

I would take anything on google with a pinch of salt. There is a lot of conflicting information out there.

It’s easier if you put your location on your profile. Then people don’t have to keep asking you

 

[PIGGIES FOREVER]

Adult pellets can be fed from when they’re weaned, or latest from four months of age. Don’t go by the bags as they’re misleading about the amount to be fed anyway. The companies want to make money and aren’t too fussed about what is right.

Young piggy pellets will also usually contain lucerne/alfalfa. That’s not necessary once they’ve been weaned.

I would take anything on google with a pinch of salt. There is a lot of conflicting information out there.

It’s easier if you put your location on your profile. Then people don’t have to keep asking you

Cheers, thank you very much.
Yes I get what you are saying about companies and Google, it's true. Both adult and baby pellets don't contain lucerne/alfalfa, I don't know what the difference is between the two, I have looked at both packages and can't see much difference between the two. I always thought that alfalfa in the diet had to continue for a while till they reach a adult. Which is 12 or 18 MTHS ? Not which one again.

 

[Piggies&buns]

Cheers, thank you very much.
Yes I get what you are saying about companies and Google, it's true. Both adult and baby pellets don't contain lucerne/alfalfa, I don't know what the difference is between the two, I have looked at both packages and can't see much difference between the two. I always thought that alfalfa in the diet had to continue for a while till they reach a adult. Which is 12 or 18 MTHS ? Not which one again.

Alfalfa is really only needed for pregnant sows and nursing babies. It can be stopped when they are weaned at 3 weeks. It’s not a grass hay it’s a legume and is too high in calcium. Giving them alfalfa containing products beyond four months is not advisable. Their teens end at 14 months though.

Alfalfa and Lucerne is the same thing - it has two different names though with one name more commonly used in the US

They can have adult pellets from the beginning but of course, they are the least important part of the diet anyway - they need hay, hay and more hay!

Definitely don’t go by what the packaging says. They usually say something like 40g worth of pellets per day when in actual fact, depending on brand, the recommended one tablespoon of pellets weighs more like 6-10g so you can see how much overfeeding would occur if you by the packaging.

 

[PIGGIES FOREVER]

Alfalfa is really only needed for pregnant sows and nursing babies. It can be stopped when they are weaned at 3 weeks. It’s not a grass hay it’s a legume and is too high in calcium. Giving them alfalfa containing products beyond four months is not advisable. Their teens end at 14 months though.

Alfalfa and Lucerne is the same thing - it has two different names though with one name more commonly used in the US

They can have adult pellets from the beginning but of course, they are the least important part of the diet anyway - they need hay, hay and more hay!

Definitely don’t go by what the packaging says. They usually say something like 40g worth of pellets per day when in actual fact, depending on brand, the recommended one tablespoon of pellets weighs more like 6-10g so you can see how much overfeeding would occur if you by the packaging.

Oh yes , I understand that alfalfa had the two names, that shocked me to hear they don't need any alfalfa after 3 weeks I also thought it was antill they reach their adult years because of bone growth, I didn't know when their teens ended, not totally sure when they start? My package says 20-60g baby not sure if it's because they need access to pellets more than adults, because of the growth of them etc... Not sure what says for adult on package, but have always followed the tablespoon of pellets per guinea pig anyway, is this per once a day or twice a day?

 

[Piggies&buns]

Oh yes , I understand that alfalfa had the two names, that shocked me to hear they don't need any alfalfa after 3 weeks I also thought it was antill they reach their adult years because of bone growth, I didn't know when their teens ended, not totally sure when they start? My package says 20-60g baby not sure if it's because they need access to pellets more than adults, because of the growth of them etc... Not sure what says for adult on package, but have always followed the tablespoon of pellets per guinea pig anyway, is this per once a day or twice a day?

Their teens is from 16 weeks until 14 months.

Babies up until four months of age -
- if they are fed baby pellets (which isn’t essential at all) then it’s one tablespoon per day. The nutrients are adjusted in baby pellets so they don’t need as much to vet the same nutrition. At four months they should then move to adult pellets and have one tablespoon of them.
- if they are fed adult pellets from birth, then they can have 1-2 tablespoons until four months of age and then dropping down to one tablespoon per day.

Whatever their age the majority of their diet still needs to be hay, with pellets being the least important.

That’s good you’ve stuck to the one tablespoon. The packaging is not something to go by.
Its one tablespoon per day, so obviously if you’re going to give pellets twice a day, the you only give half a tablespoon each time

 

[PIGGIES FOREVER]

Their teens is from 16 weeks until 14 months.

Babies up until four months of age -
- if they are fed baby pellets (which isn’t essential at all) then it’s one tablespoon per day. The nutrients are adjusted in baby pellets so they don’t need as much to vet the same nutrition. At four months they should then move to adult pellets and have one tablespoon of them.
- if they are fed adult pellets from birth, then they can have 1-2 tablespoons until four months of age and then dropping down to one tablespoon per day.

Whatever their age the majority of their diet still needs to be hay, with pellets being the least important.

That’s good you’ve stuck to the one tablespoon. The packaging is not something to go by.
Its one tablespoon per day, so obviously if you’re going to give pellets twice a day, the you only give half a tablespoon each time

Thank you for your help. I see, I was given a whole tablespoon twice a day per pig.