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Long term care of arthritis in guinea pigs

A

AngryPenguin

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Hi all,

Long time lurker, first time poster. I'm a very experienced guinea pig owner and come from a scientific background. Our pigs live a life of luxury (organic food, no pellets, lots of hay, and 3 piggies in an enclosure that >40 square feet) and have access to the best medical care possible.

I've literally read every study out there on pain management in guinea pigs and a long story short, my vet prescribes me whatever I'd like due to the trust and education that I provide them (their clinic only deals with guinea pigs...that should tell you a lot! - they're the top vet firm in the Province and I drive hours to see them).

I am, however, unsure how to proceed.

3 year old boar that is 1.4kg (he was taken off of pellets at age 1 but he never lost the weight - that is on me, I didn't know better then) and has a severe case of arthritis. We didn't catch it until he stopped moving and stopped eating, most likely due to the pain from moving. He's now on 0.2ml of 1.5mg/ml (dog) meloxicam three times a day (yes, every 8 hours...because that is best for him due to the 6-8 hour half life of the drug). We tried different variations such as at bid (twice a day) but he would start to show more and more pain as his dose wore off. He's much better now at 0.2ml tid (three times a day). He went from not moving/eating, to now moving both of his back feet 80% of the time with a hop 20% of the time.

I have tried giving him gabapentin but he literally did not respond well so I took him off of it 2 days after starting him on it. Yes, I know the medication can take 3 weeks to show effect but he scared me to pieces when he was on gabapentin. I'm not against trying at a lower dose over a longer period of time...

I now will be getting a rx/prescription of tramadol, but there are NO studies on in vivo effects on tramadol on guinea pigs. I saw an in vitro study that showed that tramadol may cause GI peristalsis to stop completely at very high dosages, but that's in vitro and not in vivo. Other in vivo studies show tramadol to be safe in rabbits from a GI perspective.

We all know that GI mobility is key in guinea pigs...so here goes my question:

1) What is the half life of tramadol in guinea pigs? This will help me determine if it's once/twice or three times a day of dosage (whatever is best for him, I will do, period)
2) I am well aware of high dose of meloxicam as per Dr. Carpenter, with piggies being able to potentially tolerate 0.5->2mg/kg of (yes, mg/kg, not ml/kg) of meloxicam a day as per research done on rodents. Anyone have any information or experience with tramadol long term?

Our piggie is 3, and it breaks my heart that he's so young but I read this as a common occurrence on this forum re: arthritis. I have no concerns with our current dosage of meloxicam, but the fact that an informed owner missed how much pain he was in until he literally called it quits on life is scaring the crap out of me.

If you have any thoughts or guidance, I/we'd really appreciate it. I've reached the limit of my academic knowledge and research on this subject. TY!
 
I havent used tramadol, but I do use metacam at high doses long term, up to 1ml twice daily of the 1.5mg/ml for 3 pigs and its been very effective and safe.

While I have no advice re tramadol, something that may be worth trying is cartrophen injections, it has been an absolute game changer for many guinea pigs suffering from interstitial cystitis pain, however it's original use is for arthritis. I have 2 piggies on these injections for IC, and a 5 year old with bad arthritis who I will be asking about trialling cartrophen with at her next appointment, I can only see a good outcome for her trying them. Just something to consider as it won't put the same kind of strain on the kidneys like some pain medication can.
 
Hi

I had tramadol prescribed for twice a day (together with a high dose of dog metacam) for a piggy I have been looking after over the summer for a few weeks with both arthritis and a dental pain issue this summer. I don't however have long term experience but some other members may have; I know that some forum piggies with advanced arthritis have been on it for the duration.

The benefits in terms improvement of quality of life outweigh by far any other concerns as the sheer pain and crippling from advanced arthritis will kill your piggy much sooner than any problems the tramadol could cause. :(
Unfortunately, glucosamine is not necessarily as effective with cases of advanced arthritis and it takes time to build up.

Please do not beat yourself up. Arthritis is not necessarily easy to spot, especially without experience. I have missed it in a piggy of mine that has it quite a bit in the spine but not in the legs, so she can still run and jump but she did lose weight all of a sudden this summer.

PS: I would also review your veg diet if needed (both what you feed and how much you feed). Many people are for instance not aware that carrots are like a feeding a block of chocolate to piggies.
Long Term Balanced General And Special Needs Guinea Pig Diets
 
i have used tramadol for a piggie with longterm arthritis .He was on it for two years and worked really well.He lived until he was 7 years of age.For me personally i was more concerned for quality of life,rather than the quantity of life.we used a low dose of gabepentin .,,with this and he really moved around well.There is some research into carprofen injections being used for arthritis in guinea pigs.ive not had any experience of using this.
 
Thank you all for the suggestions! TIL re: cartrophen. I did not see any of this in my research so my sincerest thank you to everyone for the guidance!

I'm also exploring laser therapy. It's not that expensive for a bundle of 8 treatments ($400?) and I figure there's no real cost other than the money and the insane amount of driving. Downsides is it doesn't work, but upsides is that he could walk better.

I'm looking into CBD oil but no studies on it and no real idea what dosage is safe as a result. Will continue researching! Thanks again all
 
Hi all,

I'm early in my research of helping one of my piggies with arthritis. He's on high ish dose meloxicam, and I'm exploring tramadol (maybe), low light laser therapy (ruled it out) and now cartrophen.

From what I read, it's not approved in humans, but has been used in the vet space forever. Initial studies for humans seem promising, though I can't find a single study for guinea pigs.

What dosage are people using for their pets, and any good/bad reactions from it? Thanks.

I did read this one off case of a severe issue following administration of the active ingredient of cartrophen

https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/full/10.1177/20551169211058650
 
It would be better to keep all of your questions on the same topic to one thread.
This is more useful when people are researching, as it links everything together.
It also saves people repeating the same advice multiple times in different threads.
 
AngryPenguin said:
Hi all,

Long time lurker, first time poster. I'm a very experienced guinea pig owner and come from a scientific background. Our pigs live a life of luxury (organic food, no pellets, lots of hay, and 3 piggies in an enclosure that >40 square feet) and have access to the best medical care possible.

I've literally read every study out there on pain management in guinea pigs and a long story short, my vet prescribes me whatever I'd like due to the trust and education that I provide them (their clinic only deals with guinea pigs...that should tell you a lot! - they're the top vet firm in the Province and I drive hours to see them).

I am, however, unsure how to proceed.

3 year old boar that is 1.4kg (he was taken off of pellets at age 1 but he never lost the weight - that is on me, I didn't know better then) and has a severe case of arthritis. We didn't catch it until he stopped moving and stopped eating, most likely due to the pain from moving. He's now on 0.2ml of 1.5mg/ml (dog) meloxicam three times a day (yes, every 8 hours...because that is best for him due to the 6-8 hour half life of the drug). We tried different variations such as at bid (twice a day) but he would start to show more and more pain as his dose wore off. He's much better now at 0.2ml tid (three times a day). He went from not moving/eating, to now moving both of his back feet 80% of the time with a hop 20% of the time.

I have tried giving him gabapentin but he literally did not respond well so I took him off of it 2 days after starting him on it. Yes, I know the medication can take 3 weeks to show effect but he scared me to pieces when he was on gabapentin. I'm not against trying at a lower dose over a longer period of time...

I now will be getting a rx/prescription of tramadol, but there are NO studies on in vivo effects on tramadol on guinea pigs. I saw an in vitro study that showed that tramadol may cause GI peristalsis to stop completely at very high dosages, but that's in vitro and not in vivo. Other in vivo studies show tramadol to be safe in rabbits from a GI perspective.

We all know that GI mobility is key in guinea pigs...so here goes my question:

1) What is the half life of tramadol in guinea pigs? This will help me determine if it's once/twice or three times a day of dosage (whatever is best for him, I will do, period)
2) I am well aware of high dose of meloxicam as per Dr. Carpenter, with piggies being able to potentially tolerate 0.5->2mg/kg of (yes, mg/kg, not ml/kg) of meloxicam a day as per research done on rodents. Anyone have any information or experience with tramadol long term?

Our piggie is 3, and it breaks my heart that he's so young but I read this as a common occurrence on this forum re: arthritis. I have no concerns with our current dosage of meloxicam, but the fact that an informed owner missed how much pain he was in until he literally called it quits on life is scaring the crap out of me.

If you have any thoughts or guidance, I/we'd really appreciate it. I've reached the limit of my academic knowledge and research on this subject. TY!
Click to expand...
My boy Graham has been on Tramadol for about 2 years on & off but more on than off (up to 2 tablets daily in his bad cases of pain for suspected cystitis).
 
My boy George was 3 1/2 when the vet spotted arthritis in his knees. I just thought he lay around a lot because he was a big, chilled out boy! He hadn't shown any real signs of pain, just a reluctance to move. He had developed impaction a little bit prior which is why we were at the vet. George went onto 1.5mg/ml metacam twice a day but we then inherited a glucosamine supplement from a friend (half a bag of oxbow joint support biscuits) and I tried them not really expecting much. But they worked well for George at that age and that stage. It took me a full month to be convinced that it wasn't just my imagination but after that he moved round a lot more and actually lost a little weight (50-100g). They made significantly more difference to his visible symptoms than the metacam had. He also regarded them as a treat and was happy to sit and crunch the biscuit in his hidey. They contain about 90mg glucosamine each.

George is now 6 and has developed other more serious issues (bladder stone, stubborn UTI) but until this he was an active boy on his JS biccies and twice daily metacam (about 0.25ml each time). We might just have been lucky that his arthritis didn't get any worse - or maybe that was all he was ever going to get. He's now off his food some days so he won't eat the biscuit but knowing how it benefitted him and how it's also beneficial for bladders I grind one up every day and syringe it. I hope you find some respite for your lovely boy x
 
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