• Discussions taking place within this forum are intended for the purpose of assisting you in discussing options with your vet. Any other use of advice given here is done so at your risk, is solely your responsibility and not that of this forum or its owner. Before posting it is your responsibility you abide by this Statement

Interstitial cystitis

S

Surfergirl

Junior Guinea Pig
Joined
Jan 24, 2021
Messages
249
Reaction score
134
Points
340
Location
Cornwall
A month or so back my 4 year old started bleeding out the back end. The vet gave her Sulfatrim for 14 days and the bleeding stopped, but then returned a week after the antibiotics stopped. The same thing happened with Baytril.
whilst I was on holiday, the bleeding returned a week after the Baytril stopped. I consulted an experienced exotics vet. She suspected interstitial cystitis and prescribed Nutracyst which I’ve just started giving.
I just wondered if anyone else has experienced this and how they managed to stop the bleeding please?
My guineas have a large variety of veggies daily plus lots of hay and don’t eat many pellets. They love grass and I sprinkle the veg and grass with water. They also have a bottle and bowl of water to drink from.
Any advice much appreciated thank you.
 
Ps I should also say that she’s on Loxicom daily and doesn’t show and signs of pain although has never made any noise from a baby. She’s eating as normal and hasn’t lost weight.
 
Hello,

If there is continued bleeding I would seriously consider having another chat with your vet, to rule out any other conditions. As I haven’t come across prolonged bleeding with IC, I just found my piggy to be uncomfortable urinating.

I’m sure our more experienced members can advise more.
@Siikibam @Wiebke ?

As for IC, I kept my IC piggy on Cystease twice daily, filtered water and only minimal (low calcium veggies). What veggies are you feeding?
 
Thank you for the advice. Can you confirm which veggies are ok please? Mine love green peppers, a little celery, some spring greens, not many carrots, a few home grown mixed leaves, parsley and cucumber.
What else do you think it could be? I’ve never experienced anything like this before.
 
I would keep spring greens and parsley to a minimum as they are higher calcium. My pigs would only get these once a week as a very small treat.

Things like peppers, cucumber, coriander, romaine lettuce etc is low calcium.
also keep any pellets to a minimum.

I’ve attached the diet guide for you 😊

Diet Guides
 
That’s great thanks. They aren’t as keen on spring greens, so that’s good and my parsley isn’t growing well, so they only get a tiny sprinkle of that once a week. It’s good to see fresh grass is so good, they get a mountain of that daily, hay always available, veggies once a day and barely eat any nuggets.
 
Surfergirl said:
That’s great thanks. They aren’t as keen on spring greens, so that’s good and my parsley isn’t growing well, so they only get a tiny sprinkle of that once a week. It’s good to see fresh grass is so good, they get a mountain of that daily, hay always available, veggies once a day and barely eat any nuggets.
Click to expand...
Yes, grass and hay is the way forward! Should be ad-lib. I always think of a few veggies as an afternoon snack rather than something fed in huge amounts 😊
 
Surfergirl said:
Thank you for the advice. Can you confirm which veggies are ok please? Mine love green peppers, a little celery, some spring greens, not many carrots, a few home grown mixed leaves, parsley and cucumber.
What else do you think it could be? I’ve never experienced anything like this before.
Click to expand...

Hi

Please stay off carrots and don't change your diet much; sterile (i.e. non-bacterial) IC piggies can react to new foods with a flare rather than it being specific foods in our experience with our own piggies.

Can you please confirm whether you are talking about intensely red pophyrine coloured pees (which may or may not test high in blood) or pees (clear or porphyrine coloured) testing high in blood? The red coloured pees can throw many people but with IC they are not sheer blood.

It is very common for IC starting out as a seemingly persistent or or chronic UTI, which doesn't react to antibiotics at all or can only be temporarily suppressed. You and your vet have to however make sure that you treat for at least 3-4 weeks with sulfatrim/bactrim (preferably to baytril) to exclude UTI; it can be treated too shortly. As a next step your vet needs to exclude stones/sludge etc. before a diagnosis of sterile IC can usually be reached by default more than anything else.

Treatment is mainly with glucosamine, since sterile IC seems to mostly affect the natural glucosamine coating of the urinary tract. It is not going to be quick fix because it will take several weeks to build up.
Milder cases can be managed by oral glucosamine. We recommend Feliway cat cystease capsules for ease of dosage and application, as you mix the contents of a capsule with 2 ml of water and either syringe it all in 24 hours or 1 ml every 12 hours. I have found with my Breila, my own current IC piggy that in an acute flare 1 capsule every 12 hours helps to bring symptoms under control more quickly.
More severe cases can be treated with cartrofen injections, which have only come in recently but seem to be mostly very successful in those cases where oral treatment is not enough.
Especially the flares and times of squeaky pees are managed by upping the basic metacam maintenance dosage to get on top of the pain and inflammation from corrosive urine coming into contact with raw tissue where the glucosamine coating has thinned or gone. Dog metacam is better as you can get larger bottles and need only 1/3 of the volume of cat metacam, so you do not have to clamour for more all the time.

Sterile IC cannot be healed, only managed until it goes away on its own, never to return - but that is a matter of years rather than weeks or months. The intervals between acute flares will hopefully eventually lengthen. You will have to learn just how much glucosamine (which is classed as a food supplement and not as a medication) and how much metacam your piggy will need.

I hope that this will help you?

More information:
Links - Interstitial Cystitis - Guinea Lynx Records
Long Term Balanced General And Special Needs Guinea Pig Diets
 
I cannot thank you enough for your help. You clearly know more than many vets I’ve seen!
I’m not entirely sure what porphyrine urine is, but it is definitely blood. The urine was tested by the vet and did contain blood. It was obvious because it was blood coloured. She did a wee in a bowl on my knee and the end of the wee was like pure blood. The vet couldn’t see bacteria she said because I’d given antibiotics the night before.
There are also blood stains on the newspaper in the hutch and I see blood coming from the back end, excuse my ignorance but I’m unsure which hole it’s coming from.
I still have plenty of sulfatrim left, I think the previous vet mis measured it! I only did 2 x 14 days of this with a gap in between. She did stop bleeding immediately but then started bleeding again after a week of stopping it. Is it ok to give this another try for longer or should I ask the vet for more Baytril?
How do they exclude stones/sludge please? Is it an X-ray?
She did mention maybe trying that, it’s £250. Does that sound about right? I’m already up to about £1,000 and don’t work at present, so don’t want to pay for the wrong investigation.
what is the treatment for stones/sludge please?
Is Metacam only available from the vet please? Assume the same for Baytril? I’ve bought Loxicom from the vet but happy to source online if that’s an option. I have got dog Loxicom this time first time ever. I’m usually sold the cat one which the last vet said is 3 x the price.
Thank you so much for your help, I am desperate to help her although am unsure if at 4, she’s getting too old to treat?
 
Surfergirl said:
I cannot thank you enough for your help. You clearly know more than many vets I’ve seen!
I’m not entirely sure what porphyrine urine is, but it is definitely blood. The urine was tested by the vet and did contain blood. It was obvious because it was blood coloured. She did a wee in a bowl on my knee and the end of the wee was like pure blood. The vet couldn’t see bacteria she said because I’d given antibiotics the night before.
There are also blood stains on the newspaper in the hutch and I see blood coming from the back end, excuse my ignorance but I’m unsure which hole it’s coming from.
I still have plenty of sulfatrim left, I think the previous vet mis measured it! I only did 2 x 14 days of this with a gap in between. She did stop bleeding immediately but then started bleeding again after a week of stopping it. Is it ok to give this another try for longer or should I ask the vet for more Baytril?
How do they exclude stones/sludge please? Is it an X-ray?
She did mention maybe trying that, it’s £250. Does that sound about right? I’m already up to about £1,000 and don’t work at present, so don’t want to pay for the wrong investigation.
what is the treatment for stones/sludge please?
Is Metacam only available from the vet please? Assume the same for Baytril? I’ve bought Loxicom from the vet but happy to source online if that’s an option. I have got dog Loxicom this time first time ever. I’m usually sold the cat one which the last vet said is 3 x the price.
Thank you so much for your help, I am desperate to help her although am unsure if at 4, she’s getting too old to treat?
Click to expand...

Porphyrine is a natural colouring. The pees are looking very much like very bloody pees but the colouration is unrelated to the actual blood content. What most people don't know that seemingly clear urine can hold quite a large amount (enough to test high on a test stick) without showing it. I have done the whole caboodle with seemingly dark red pees testing free of blood and clear pees testing high more than once with my vets. :(

In terms of sterile IC, it doesn't matter which antibiotic because IC is non bacterial and antibiotics spcifically target bacteria. Sulfatrim is generally considered better for urinary tract problems.

Bladder stones or a bladder full of sludge will require an x-ray as stones start in the kidney and can fetch up anywhere in the urinary tract.
An experienced vet can generally feel whether a bladder is soft and relaxed or whether it is hard and small as a quick guide to what line of treatment they may pursue first but when the quick and easy solution doesn't work, then it is important that stones or sludge are excluded before treating for IC. Bladder and urethral stones require an operation; with sludge it depends on how much there is and how tightly packed it is but it is much less common than a bladder stone.

Metacam and antibiotics are all POMs (prescription-only medications) in the UK.
 
Thank you again. I’ll re read in the morning to ensure I’ve fully understood it, and come back to you if that’s ok with any queries.

Is it safe for me to give 3-4 weeks of sulfatrim now to try please? It did stop the bleeding and my gut feeling was always that the antibiotics needed to continue for longer.

I think I know what you mean about the urine colour. I usually see a red wee when they’ve eaten dandelions, but only for that day. I read a while back that they aren’t good for them so have stopped them, I’d appreciate your advice on this because they absolutely love them!

It is most definitely blood coming out 100% of that just looking at the blood.
 
Surfergirl said:
Thank you again. I’ll re read in the morning to ensure I’ve fully understood it, and come back to you if that’s ok with any queries.

Is it safe for me to give 3-4 weeks of sulfatrim now to try please? It did stop the bleeding and my gut feeling was always that the antibiotics needed to continue for longer.

I think I know what you mean about the urine colour. I usually see a red wee when they’ve eaten dandelions, but only for that day. I read a while back that they aren’t good for them so have stopped them, I’d appreciate your advice on this because they absolutely love them!

It is most definitely blood coming out 100% of that just looking at the blood.
Click to expand...

Veg coloured wee looks very different to porphyrine wee (which has fooled vets of mine before because it really looks like full-on bloody wees) but I am not going to split hairs about it with you. ;)

Please discuss another round of antibiotic with your treating vet. We don't have access to your piggy so this is not a judgement we can make on your behalf. We can show up possible avenues and bring in our own experiences and mention treatments used successfully by experienced vets but we cannot make treatment decisions for you; that is strictly between you and your vet. ;)
 
Thanks for your advice. I’ll ring the vet again this morning.
Are there any probiotics for guineas I can buy please? I assume they’d benefit from them like humans alongside antibiotics?
Thank you.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top