High calorie diets

[asegna]

I have a guinea pig that is eating but losing weight, constipated frequently. Vet visit and hundreds of dollars later we have ruled out thyroid and dental issues. Vet feels a tumor is likely, but that if that is the case there isn't much we can do except keep him comfortable as long as we can. He is still perky and friendly, so we are going for quality of life. She recommended a high calorie diet, so we have alfalfa, carrots, getting beets, and I have ordered soy powder to sprinkle on everything. What other suggestions do you have? I should mention that the nearest grocery store is half an hour away and there isn't a health food store for hours, so anything uncommon will need to be Amazoned. Also, this vet's last day was yesterday, and I don;t want to start all over with a new vet, but if there is anything else you can think of that it could be, i would be happy to hear that!

 

[Wiebke]

I have a guinea pig that is eating but losing weight, constipated frequently. Vet visit and hundreds of dollars later we have ruled out thyroid and dental issues. Vet feels a tumor is likely, but that if that is the case there isn't much we can do except keep him comfortable as long as we can. He is still perky and friendly, so we are going for quality of life. She recommended a high calorie diet, so we have alfalfa, carrots, getting beets, and I have ordered soy powder to sprinkle on everything. What other suggestions do you have? I should mention that the nearest grocery store is half an hour away and there isn't a health food store for hours, so anything uncommon will need to be Amazoned. Also, this vet's last day was yesterday, and I don;t want to start all over with a new vet, but if there is anything else you can think of that it could be, i would be happy to hear that!

Hi

Please esure that grass/hay fibre is still making at least three quarters of the diet. Alfalfa is a legume not a grass and very high in calcium; it can be used as a supplement. You do not want to additionally unbalance the digestive microbiome by overfeeding on high sugar veg which can promote bloating events.

We have some tips for underweight guinea pigs in the link below that are more sustainable but please be aware that unless the underlying cause is treated these measures can only act as a temporary patch solution.
Weight - Monitoring and Management (see chapter on underweight)

I am very sorry for the situation you are finding yourself in. Diagnostics in guinea pigs have made great advances in recent years but we sadly still come up against limits all the time.

You may also find the advice and discussion in the chapter on caring for terminally ill piggies helpful in order to make the best of whatever little or much time you have left, whether that is just days or months. It does really make a difference for both of you if you do so with open eyes and an open mind because it doesn't have to be all sad and filled with just your fears of loss and struggles to prolong life; there is so much more to be gained - believe me!
A Practical and Sensitive Guide to Dying, Terminal Illness and Euthanasia in Guinea Pigs

 

[asegna]

Hi

Please esure that grass/hay fibre is still making at least three quarters of the diet. Alfalfa is a legume not a grass and very high in calcium. You do not want to additionally unbalance the digestive microbiome.

We have some tips for underweight guinea pigs in the link below that are more sustainable but please be aware that unless the underlying cause is treated these measures can only act as a temporary patch solution.
Weight - Monitoring and Management

Thanks! He is on bedding of timothy hay, so plenty available (cleaned out every three days). The vet seems to feel we have ruled out every underlying cause except tumors. I am open to other suggestions, though. All bloodwork came back normal except a slightly elevated ALT, which can be indicative of cancer. Sedating him for an x-ray didn't seem like a smart option, especially since there isn't anything that can be done for it if he does have a tumor. I will check the link, thank-you! Right now we are pretty much resigned, but wanting to keep him happy as long as possible.

 

[Siikibam]

I’m sorry your boy is unwell. How much weight has he lost and over what period of time.

I wouldn’t suggest you feed alfalfa and carrots regularly. The carrot is high in sugar and is not something that should feature regularly in their diet. If he’s losing weight then you need to step in and syringe feed him to help him maintain. Also start weighing him once daily and adjust the amount you syringe feed accordingly. You are initially aiming for 40-60ml in a 24 hour period.

If you don’t have any fibre rich critical care/recovery food then you can use his usual pellets until you have got some to hand. Was he given any meds at all? If so, what were they and for how long?

Guinea pigs don’t get constipated. If you mean he’s not pooping as much or his poops are smaller then that means he’s not eating enough. Bear in mind that poo output is 1-2 days behind. Unexplained weight loss is a difficult thing. I hope they get to the bottom of it soon.



Not Eating, Weight Loss And The Importance Of Syringe Feeding Fibre
All About Syringe Feeding and Medicating Guinea Pigs with Videos and Pictures

 

[asegna]

I’m sorry your boy is unwell. How much weight has he lost and over what period of time.

I wouldn’t suggest you feed alfalfa and carrots regularly. The carrot is high in sugar and is not something that should feature regularly in their diet. If he’s losing weight then you need to step in and syringe feed him to help him maintain. Also start weighing him once daily and adjust the amount you syringe feed accordingly. You are initially aiming for 40-60ml in a 24 hour period.

If you don’t have any fibre rich critical care/recovery food then you can use his usual pellets until you have got some to hand. Was he given any meds at all? If so, what were they and for how long?

Guinea pigs don’t get constipated. If you mean he’s not pooping as much or his poops are smaller then that means he’s not eating enough. Bear in mind that poo output is 1-2 days behind. Unexplained weight loss is a difficult thing. I hope they get to the bottom of it soon.



Not Eating, Weight Loss And The Importance Of Syringe Feeding Fibre
All About Syringe Feeding and Medicating Guinea Pigs with Videos and Pictures

He is not pushing the poop out and I have to help him express it by gently pushing around the area several times a day. The vet felt that was part of him not taking in nutrients from the food, which is why we initially thought thyroid issues. Huge amounts of poop, not in pellets but in mushy masses. He eats a LOT (pellets, timothy hay, alfalfa and fresh veggies), so I do not see that syringe feeding would be beneficial. We know he is taking the calories in, he is just not processing them.

 

[Wiebke]

He is not pushing the poop out and I have to help him express it by gently pushing around the area several times a day. The vet felt that was part of him not taking in nutrients from the food, which is why we initially thought thyroid issues. Huge amounts of poop, not in pellets but in mushy masses. He eats a LOT (pellets, timothy hay, alfalfa and fresh veggies), so I do not see that syringe feeding would be beneficial. We know he is taking the calories in, he is just not processing them.

Hi

Is your boy suffering from impaction? It can also be caused by a pain issue in the lower spine or body: Impaction - How To Help Your Guinea Pig.

 

[Wheekallweek]

Impaction is a common problem in older boars as they lose muscle tone. It's a stinky job but expressing the poop mass is the best way to help him

 

[asegna]

Hi

Is your boy suffering from impaction? It can also be caused by a pain issue in the lower spine or body: Impaction - How To Help Your Guinea Pig.

How would I determine that? As I mentioned, the vet's last day was yesterday, and the clinic is currently shut down.

 

[Wiebke]

How would I determine that? As I mentioned, the vet's last day was yesterday, and the clinic is currently shut down.

Hi

There are several pretty graphic videos in the link; please have a look and decide for yourself. We cannot tell you sight unseen and just going by your description; we just can give you the necessary material to help you to either rule it in or out.

 

[asegna]

Impaction is a common problem in older boars as they lose muscle tone. It's a stinky job but expressing the poop mass is the best way to help him

He is only three I don't mind doing it (I mean, I don't love it, but it's not the worst thing I have ever done). The weight loss has probably caused the loss in muscle tone.

 

[Piggies&buns]

I'm sorry to hear this.

Obviously plenty of hay but also some fresh grass if you can get it. You can also offer a bowl of plain, dry oats in a bowl. They are high calorie and could give him a boost.

I don’t think I would use the beets or carrots much. You don’t want the sugars to cause digestive issues on top of everything else.
I don’t know what @Wiebke thinks about soy powder and what impact that would have?
Alfalfa can be given in very small quantities in this situation. Don’t let it become much though.

Is he on any medications at present? Painkillers perhaps?

 

[asegna]

Hi

There are several pretty graphic videos in the link; please have a look and decide for yourself. We cannot tell you sight unseen and just going by your description; we just can give you the necessary material to help you to either rule it in or out.

Sorry, I meant how would I check for pain issues? He is not showing any obvious signs, does not mind being picked up and held or even turned over so I can express the poop. I do think it's loss of muscle tone from weight loss, but I don't want to dismiss anything without ruling it out.

 

[asegna]

I'm sorry to hear this.

Obviously plenty of hay but also some fresh grass if you can get it. You can also offer a bowl of plain, dry oats in a bowl. They are high calorie and could give him a boost.

I don’t think I would use the beets or carrots much. You don’t want the sugars to cause digestive issues on top of everything else.
I don’t know what @Wiebke thinks about soy powder and what impact that would have?
Alfalfa can be given in very small quantities in this situation. Don’t let it become much though.

Is he on any medications at present? Painkillers perhaps?

No meds. The vet suggested the veggies and soy powder as a way to put on weight.

 

[Wiebke]

I'm sorry to hear this.

Obviously plenty of hay but also some fresh grass if you can get it. You can also offer a bowl of plain, dry oats in a bowl. They are high calorie and could give him a boost.

I don’t think I would use the beets or carrots much. You don’t want the sugars to cause digestive issues on top of everything else.
I don’t know what @Wiebke thinks about soy powder and what impact that would have?
Alfalfa can be given in very small quantities in this situation. Don’t let it become much though.

Is he on any medications at present? Painkillers perhaps?

Soy is/has been used as a filler product in several pellet brands.

Guinea pigs are prey animals and wired to suppress pain to an amazing degree, unfortunately but it often comes with loss of appetite as one of the first symptoms. Your vet was right to look at a metabolic issues first and foremost.

Mystery weight loss is my least favourite symptom because so many different issues can be behind it, some of them you would never suspect. You can check how flexible his lower spine is and whether he is uncomfortable around his boar bits.
We are just trying to cover things you have mentioned that could impinge so we have a better idea of what could be going on and whether there may be more avenues that could be pursued,

 

[asegna]

Soy is/has been used as a filler product in several pellet brands.

Guinea pigs are prey animals and wired to suppress pain to an amazing degree, unfortunately but it often comes with loss of appetite as one of the first symptoms. Your vet was right to look at a metabolic issues first and foremost.

Mystery weight loss is my least favourite symptom because so many different issues can be behind it, some of them you would never suspect. You can check how flexible his lower spine is and whether he is uncomfortable around his boar bits.
We are just trying to cover things you have mentioned that could impinge so we have a better idea of what could be going on and whether there may be more avenues that could be pursued,

That's why I'm here, to see what might have been missed and how I can make him most comfortable if nothing else really can be done.

 

[Bill & Ted]

So sorry your little man is not very well. You could place a small bowl of plain dry porridge oats in his cage and see if he will eat them. Oats are healthy and have a good amount of fibre, high calories and easy to eat. My piggies like them as a treat

 

[Siikibam]

He is not pushing the poop out and I have to help him express it by gently pushing around the area several times a day. The vet felt that was part of him not taking in nutrients from the food, which is why we initially thought thyroid issues. Huge amounts of poop, not in pellets but in mushy masses. He eats a LOT (pellets, timothy hay, alfalfa and fresh veggies), so I do not see that syringe feeding would be beneficial. We know he is taking the calories in, he is just not processing them.

If he is consistently losing weight (how much and over what time period?) then he does need a top up to help him maintain. The thing that helps them maintain and/or increase weight is hay. So if there’s a continuous downward trend in his weight then he’s not eating enough hay.

Do you know when the new vet starts and could you book him in to be seen? Sorry.

 

[asegna]

If he is consistently losing weight (how much and over what time period?) then he does need a top up to help him maintain. The thing that helps them maintain and/or increase weight is hay. So if there’s a continuous downward trend in his weight then he’s not eating enough hay.

Do you know when the new vet starts and could you book him in to be seen? Sorry.

Unfortunately there may not be a new vet. It's kind of a mess I don't want to get into online. I don't have previous weights on him (if ANYBODY knows where my kids put the small scale please tell me), but currently 1.323 lbs, visibly underweight, you can feel ribs. Happened pretty quickly over the last few weeks. Of course, any weight loss on an animal that small is a big deal and adds up fast! He is on a bed of timothy hay and I am now supplementing with alfalfa and veggies for more calories as suggested by the vet. I see him eating lots of the timothy hay, as well as food pellets and veggies.

Again, he has been seen and had a full panel of blood tests. All normal except slightly elevated ALT, which vet said could indicate cancer. Teeth checked (and since he goes to town on carrots those are probably not bothering him). The only other test she said she could do was an x-ray for tumors, and since there wouldn't be anything we could do about that, it didn't seem kind or safe to put him through the anesthesia. Her specialty is small animals and she has a good reputation, so I am inclined to trust her. I just want to make him comfortable for as long as possible, and she said we can do that by upping the calories. That is not to say if someone knows of another cause she didn't look at that I can't pursue it, but at this point I feel like I would get the same news from another vet and put him through more stress in the process.

 

[Siikibam]

How old is he? You really need to get some scales so you can keep an eye on his weight. Unfortunately you cannot judge hay intake by eye (life would be so much easier if you could). Try the oats but I think you really need to step in with top up feeds. If he can at least maintain that would be something.

All the best and hope he turns a corner soon.

 

[Wheekallweek]

@Siikibam he's three