Help please!

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katiejfreer

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Hi, I need help please!
We had a bonded pair of boar guinea pigs that we rehomed 2 years ago who are about 4.5 years. One of them has a cataract in one eye and possibly a 2nd developing in the other eye and our guinea pig loving vet thought that he would become completely blind at some point. She felt that he would be fine as long as he had other piggies to live with and were advised that it would probably be ok to introduce a pair of baby boars to keep him company as he is older if we lost his mate.
We unfortunately suddenly lost his mate a few weeks ago and have got 2 baby boars which appeared to be bonded when we got them. They are half brothers and were 12
Weeks and 10 weeks old when we got them 2
weeks ago. We introduced them all together and all initially seemed fine but the youngest one Ziggy has increasingly been strutting and annoying the other two and showing signs of asserting his dominance. Coco our elderly pig is annoyed by him but not really responding to Ziggy behaviour but he is really pestering Pickle the other little one and I’ve noticed this morning that Pickle has some scabs on his rump.
It always appears one sided with Ziggy chasing Pickle and Pickle seems withdrawn and doesn’t really move around the cage and hides himself in the corner. They are all still
Eating tho. Ziggy, never seems relax so wondering if equally he is stressed because he’s the smallest and youngest but he always positions himself in the middle of their cage and gets in everyone’s business 😬.
They are in a large furplast cage 140x60 with multiple hides, tunnels etc. They usually go out into an outside run every day on the grass.

I really need advise on my options please and whether I should be removing one of the pigs or if I should give it more time etc 🥴. Ziggy and pickle came together (not sure how long they were bonded for before we got them) and they have been in all together for a week.
Any help greatly appreciated. We just wanted to give poor Coco some company without leaving a single piggie when we lost him as he is a decent age 😞.

Thx
 
I’m sorry to hear this and I’m sorry for your loss.

I’m afraid you were given bad advice in the ability to keep a boar trio. Attempting to keep three boars together unfortunately does not work, particularly where you are dealing with a pair of youngsters. Added to the fact your cage is not really big enough for two young boars, its definitely not big enough for three.
Carer boar groups can occasionally work but all the piggies would need to be considerably older 4/5 years plus.

The cage for anybody to attempt a boar trio (which we would never recommend) needs to be 300x100cm as a minimum to provide enough territory but because they find it hard to form a functioning hierarchy, even then a big space doesn’t make it more likely to work.

Ordinarily we would say it takes two weeks for bonding for a pair to be complete but given the chances of a trio working aren’t great, injuries seem to be occurring and one piggy is bordering on being bullied, you are likely going to need to separate them into a functioning pair and a single piggy.
You may do better to keep Pickle and Coco together and put Ziggy in a separate cage by himself. His cage must be side by side with the others so they can interact through the bars.
A boar pair need a minimum of 150x60cm but ideally 180x60cm. Unfortunately commercial cages don’t go that big so most boar owners would choose a c&c (a 5x2 being the ideal size for a boar pair) where there are no other pets or cats or dogs that could pose a risk to the piggies.

Adding More Guinea Pigs Or Merging Pairs – What Works And What Not?
Boars: Teenage, Bullying, Fighting, Fall-outs And What Next?
A Comprehensive Guide to Guinea Pig Boars
 
To add, he sounds to be dominant so his behaviour is because he is trying to take over.
Ordinarily that’s fine and in a pair you’d leave them to get on with it (you need one submissive piggy and one dominant) but it is if it goes too far and other piggies become withdrawn because of it then it becomes a dysfunctional bond
 
Thanks for this advise. I have rejigged the cage and taken out the non open ended hides so it’s all tunnels and put more hay around to see if that helps at all and actually pickle seems to be happier with this set up. If we seperate Ziggy is it possible do you think that we could rebond the 2 little ones in the future when we lose Coco?
 
katiejfreer said:
Thanks for this advise. I have rejigged the cage and taken out the non open ended hides so it’s all tunnels and put more hay around to see if that helps at all and actually pickle seems to be happier with this set up. If we seperate Ziggy is it possible do you think that we could rebond the 2 little ones in the future when we lose Coco?
Click to expand...

It depends on what happens between them and whether they are compatible.
A successful bond comes entirely down to character compatibility. If their bond breaks then no, reintroduction will never be possible.
 
Ok, so one final question! And I am really grateful for the
Piggies&buns said:
If you have to separate then no, I'm afraid no time physically together
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Thank you for all the advice. I have separated Ziggy. I feel really sad that he is now on his own… we have the option in returning him to the lady we got him from as she has rescues as well as breeding some piggies. In your opinion is it better to keep Ziggy in a seperate cage next to the other 2 or return him to be bonded with another piggie?
Thx again
 
katiejfreer said:
Ok, so one final question! And I am really grateful for the

Thank you for all the advice. I have separated Ziggy. I feel really sad that he is now on his own… we have the option in returning him to the lady we got him from as she has rescues as well as breeding some piggies. In your opinion is it better to keep Ziggy in a seperate cage next to the other 2 or return him to be bonded with another piggie?
Thx again
Click to expand...

It’s really a call for you to make.
Living alongside is a suitable way to live - I have two separated boars myself (as well as a bonded pair) as they had a full fight and their bond is fully broken. They now happily live side by side.
Equally, it would be nice for him to have a friend.
It comes down to whether you can manage two separate cages.
 
Piggies&buns said:
It’s really a call for you to make.
Living alongside is a suitable way to live - I have two separated boars myself (as well as a bonded pair) as they had a full fight and their bond is fully broken. They now happily live side by side.
Equally, it would be nice for him to have a friend.
It comes down to whether you can manage two separate cages.
Click to expand...
Ok thx
 
katiejfreer said:
Ok thx
Click to expand...
Piggies&buns said:
It’s really a call for you to make.
Living alongside is a suitable way to live - I have two separated boars myself (as well as a bonded pair) as they had a full fight and their bond is fully broken. They now happily live side by side.
Equally, it would be nice for him to have a friend.
It comes down to whether you can manage two separate cages.
Click to expand...
Ziggy hasn’t stopped squeaking since we separated them and is agitated and chewing the bars of his cage… he is next to the other cage who seem more relaxed and enjoying not hiding. Sorry, I’m just questioning everything I’m doing as don’t want to do wrong by them 🤷🏻‍♀️
 
Piggies&buns said:
It’s really a call for you to make.
Living alongside is a suitable way to live - I have two separated boars myself (as well as a bonded pair) as they had a full fight and their bond is fully broken. They now happily live side by side.
Equally, it would be nice for him to have a friend.
It comes down to whether you can manage two separate cages.
Click to expand...
Ziggy hasn’t stopped squeaking since we separated them and is agitated and chewing the bars of his cage… he is next to the other cage who seem more relaxed and enjoying not hiding. Sorry, I’m just questioning everything I’m doing as don’t want to do wrong by them 🤷🏻‍♀️.
I’ve never seen him chew the bars before…
 
If Pickle is happier without Ziggy in the cage then that is usually a sure sign of a problem. It’s not Ziggy’s reaction you go by.

What usually happens and why trios don’t work is that there is usually two dominant boars, then they fight and the third one could be bullied.
That doesn’t sound to be what is happening here. It sounds as if you’ve got one dominant which is good and means in theory things might be ok. However if pickle wasn’t happy then that may be a sign of bullying rather than dominance. A bullying relationship won’t work - pickle will either have an unhappy life or he will get fed up, fight back and then things will be fully broken.
It sounds as if Coco just wants to stay out of the drama.
There is also the fact that it takes two weeks for any new bond to settle - ordinarily you’d think wait it out.
Add in the fact that they will soon become teenagers, hormones will rise and that is when a trio is most likely to fail.

If you are in any doubt as to the functionality of their relationship then you can try to reintroduce them in neutral territory (don’t just put him back in the current cage as it will be seen as a territory invasion) in a few days time and see what happens. Again Pickle will be the key here.
The issue is that if he is bullying Pickle and this isn’t just normal dominance or if there is any issue with the fact it’s a trio, then things could escalate. To be able to reunite them then your cage is nowhere near big enough so you would have to increase it to 300x100 to be big enough for a boar trio.

Bonds In Trouble
 
How long can I leave Ziggy to see if he’ll settle on his own before I take him back to the breeder do you think?
Pickle is very chilled and it def seems a much better dynamic with the 2 of them on their own and I think I would permanently be worried even with a bigger cage about Ziggy and Pickle. I’m just worrying now that poor Ziggy is stressed by himself… I think that’s been a lot of the problem all along. He seems quite highly strung and wired compared to the other 2.
 
katiejfreer said:
How long can I leave Ziggy to see if he’ll settle on his own before I take him back to the breeder do you think?
Pickle is very chilled and it def seems a much better dynamic with the 2 of them on their own and I think I would permanently be worried even with a bigger cage about Ziggy and Pickle. I’m just worrying now that poor Ziggy is stressed by himself… I think that’s been a lot of the problem all along. He seems quite highly strung and wired compared to the other 2.
Click to expand...

It will probably take a few days for him to calm down.
 
katiejfreer said:
Thx so much for all your advice!
Click to expand...

No problem.

Give it some time for you to think. If you can’t manage two cages then obviously finding him a new home is the option.
But they can be happy living side by side. They get the interaction through the bars just without the territorial issues from living together.
If you decide you want to keep him, then ensure his cage is 120x60cm as a minimum.
 
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