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Heavy Breathing - Chest Infection or Heart Problems?

Dom R

Junior Guinea Pig
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Hi All,

I have recently noticed that Peanut, who is around 4.5 years old, has started heavy breathing, as well it being quicker sometimes. I have taken him to the vet and he got prescribed just Baytril at 0.22ml twice daily. He's made very little if not no improvement after being on it for just over a week. I'm going to be ringing the vets tomorrow to see if I can speak to the vet we originally saw. She said that he had an infection in his right lung, but didn't offer any form of Diuretic or anything, so that will be one thing I will ask for when I ring them up, and maybe another antibiotic such as Doxycycline to go along with the Baytril. She didn't mention anything about his heart or anything else, there's no crackling, hooting etc.

There are no other symptoms other than the breathing, he hasn't lost weight or changed in himself really, he sometimes bobs his head forwards when resting and breathing. I'm just wondering what you guys may think it could be, I have a weird feeling it could be a heart issue as there's no other signs of a respiratory infection and the fact it never really seemed to bother him too much. Just wondering what you think it could be? Is there anything else I should ask for at the vets other than Diuretic and another antibiotic?

Cheers,

Dom
 
Hi

Please see a vet again as there is no improvement and discuss a reassessement and any further treatment like a different antibiotic (please be aware that doxycycline does often come with some major side effects) and the advisability of a diuretic. It very much depends on what is going on exactly and how badly the lung is impacted.
If there is an issue with pneumonia then there isn't usually an issue with acute heart failure happening at the same time. What we have seen in recent years however is a growing resistance in respiratory tract bacteria to antibiotics due to overuse. A lab test to what your variety reacts to may be the next step, especially as your piggy seems to be currently stable.

Please accept that without access to your piggy and no vet qualifications that is as far as we can go.
 
Hi

Please see a vet again as there is no improvement and discuss a reassessement and any further treatment like a different antibiotic (please be aware that doxycycline does often come with some major side effects) and the advisability of a diuretic. It very much depends on what is going on exactly and how badly the lung is impacted.
If there is an issue with pneumonia then there isn't usually an issue with acute heart failure happening at the same time. What we have seen in recent years however is a growing resistance in respiratory tract bacteria to antibiotics due to overuse. A lab test to what your variety reacts to may be the next step, especially as your piggy seems to be currently stable.

Please accept that without access to your piggy and no vet qualifications that is as far as we can go.

As mentioned I will be ringing them again tomorrow to see what my vet says. He's had Doxycycline before and hasn't had any issues with it previously. She didn't seem too worried about him thankfully. I'll be pushing for a diuretic and a second antibiotic alongside the Baytril, which should hopefully help him a lot in the recovery.

I was mainly asking just to see if anyone had experience with a piggy with similar symptoms and what their piggy was diagnosed with and what medication they had, so I can put forward ideas to the vet as she's thankfully understanding and willing to listen to me. Thank you for the response :)
 
As mentioned I will be ringing them again tomorrow to see what my vet says. He's had Doxycycline before and hasn't had any issues with it previously. She didn't seem too worried about him thankfully. I'll be pushing for a diuretic and a second antibiotic alongside the Baytril, which should hopefully help him a lot in the recovery.

I was mainly asking just to see if anyone had experience with a piggy with similar symptoms and what their piggy was diagnosed with and what medication they had, so I can put forward ideas to the vet as she's thankfully understanding and willing to listen to me. Thank you for the response :)

It is mush more difficult to diagnose heart problems in guinea pigs than most people would think. If there is a congestion in a lung, then that is your utmost priority to clear that. I am sure that the diagnosing vet will have had a good listen to the heart as well. ;)
 
It is mush more difficult to diagnose heart problems in guinea pigs than most people would think. If there is a congestion in a lung, then that is your utmost priority to clear that. I am sure that the diagnosing vet will have had a good listen to the heart as well. ;)

I can believe it. I'll make sure to get a diuretic as that will help clear his breathing and hopefully allow the antibiotics to kick in better (if that's how it works, anyhow), either way it'll hopefully help him out. I'm sure they did, they did say it was specifically his right lung, and his left one is clear, so luckily it isn't too bad and in both lungs.
 
A diuretic would usually only be indicated if the lung was especially congested with fluid as a complication of a heart issue, although it is good to question a vet's findings to fully understand them better, please beware of suggesting medicines that there is no medical need for, especially if you are not a trained vet, vet nurse or pharmacologist. Certainly in the UK doxycycline would only be prescribed rarely, after baytril was ineffective sulfatrim would be tried, and as @Wiebke says swabs should be taken to demonstrate a definite infection that is definitely resistant to those 2 on-label piggy safe antibiotics before anything else was tried.
 
A diuretic would usually only be indicated if the lung was especially congested with fluid as a complication of a heart issue, although it is good to question a vet's findings to fully understand them better, please beware of suggesting medicines that there is no medical need for, especially if you are not a trained vet, vet nurse or pharmacologist. Certainly in the UK doxycycline would only be prescribed rarely, after baytril was ineffective sulfatrim would be tried, and as @Wiebke says swabs should be taken to demonstrate a definite infection that is definitely resistant to those 2 on-label piggy safe antibiotics before anything else was tried.

You basically nailed it, I suggested Doxy but he suggested to try Sulfatrim first, which I went along with. I've had Doxy in the past and it worked well so just went with experiences with another pig I had with lung issues. He got dosed at 0.17ml twice daily and I got some Meloxaid for dogs (Metacam) at 0.1ml once daily (Quite a low dose from my experience but hey ho).

I asked if Diuretics would help but he said he couldn't hear liquid on his lungs so it wasn't required, which was fair enough.

Hopefully these antibiotics will kick in and help get him better.

Holding you in my thoughts
Thank you!
 
I’m afraid I have no advise but I hope your piggy will be ok x

I'll make sure he recovers, he has no choice in my eyes haha. Thank you anyway!
He's still eating, drinking and everything, just breathing badly but he seems happy otherwise, so I'm confident that he'll be okay.
 
Diagnosing heart and complex lung problems in piggies can be tricky, our piggy is off to see a specialist after 8 months of recurring respiratory issues to have some expensive diagnostics done- more detailed xrays, CT scan, maybe an ultrasound scan of the heart- but this is very much an "after repeated antibiotics of all kinds make little difference" scenario and will come with a hefty price tag.
Hopefully your piggy will be sorted out with just a different antibiotic or a longer course or higher dose of antibiotics- most piggies are in the end, mine just likes to spend all my hard earned money on posh vets :)
 
Diagnosing heart and complex lung problems in piggies can be tricky, our piggy is off to see a specialist after 8 months of recurring respiratory issues to have some expensive diagnostics done- more detailed xrays, CT scan, maybe an ultrasound scan of the heart- but this is very much an "after repeated antibiotics of all kinds make little difference" scenario and will come with a hefty price tag.
Hopefully your piggy will be sorted out with just a different antibiotic or a longer course or higher dose of antibiotics- most piggies are in the end, mine just likes to spend all my hard earned money on posh vets :)

They're definitely expensive when things go wrong, bless them. They're worth the money and stress they cause, and they pay it back with their amazing personalities and love. I hope your piggy is okay and manages to get the medication they need.

Luckily I have a specialist that's nearby and really fair on prices (Ellie Whitehead in Matlock), but unfortunately she's not got any appointments for another week or something. So some treatment from a local vet is better than none at all, especially with lung issues.
 
Just another question. I have been listening to Peanut's chest (putting my ear against his chest), even though it isn't the best way of doing it, and I've heard some slight cracking, which to me suggests there could be some liquid in his airways/chest. I'm just wondering if this could possibly be either the infection clearing up and loosening the liquid causing it to be noticeable, or could it be getting worse and now started developing liquid, meaning it could be turning into Pneumonia maybe. I will be ringing the vets to get him seen again anyway.

Would it be worth trying to get him a Diuretic, even if not 100% necessary? Will it cause damage just after one dose (Injection, maybe?) to see how it impacts him and his breathing? I asked the vet last time but he suggested that one dose will hurt his kidneys.

Peanut had quite a bad day on Saturday, sleeping a lot and seemingly down, but picked up again the next day and he's also doing good today, his breathing is still bad but I'm figuring that it's quite a stubborn chest infection. He still hasn't lost weight and is still eating.
 
Just another question. I have been listening to Peanut's chest (putting my ear against his chest), even though it isn't the best way of doing it, and I've heard some slight cracking, which to me suggests there could be some liquid in his airways/chest. I'm just wondering if this could possibly be either the infection clearing up and loosening the liquid causing it to be noticeable, or could it be getting worse and now started developing liquid, meaning it could be turning into Pneumonia maybe. I will be ringing the vets to get him seen again anyway.

Would it be worth trying to get him a Diuretic, even if not 100% necessary? Will it cause damage just after one dose (Injection, maybe?) to see how it impacts him and his breathing? I asked the vet last time but he suggested that one dose will hurt his kidneys.

Peanut had quite a bad day on Saturday, sleeping a lot and seemingly down, but picked up again the next day and he's also doing good today, his breathing is still bad but I'm figuring that it's quite a stubborn chest infection. He still hasn't lost weight and is still eating.
I would go see the specialist vet, we had an amazingly positive experience taking Blodwen to the specialist vet today, got some great insights into probably is, what possibly is, and what definitely isnt going on in Blod's lungs- and her heart is absolutely fine, despite an experienced local vet being unsure. We have actually got frusol diuretic and doxycycline antibiotic for Blod, but we know exactly why and how the vet arrived at that conclusion and also what we might try afterwards if that is ineffective, we have some actual answers and a long term plan- none of the "just try this and hope for the best" stuff. But yes a diuretic may help clear excess lung fluid even in the absence of a heart condition, but you need a good xray to confirm there is fluid I think rather than just suspecting it from listening by ear :)
 
I would go see the specialist vet, we had an amazingly positive experience taking Blodwen to the specialist vet today, got some great insights into probably is, what possibly is, and what definitely isnt going on in Blod's lungs- and her heart is absolutely fine, despite an experienced local vet being unsure. We have actually got frusol diuretic and doxycycline antibiotic for Blod, but we know exactly why and how the vet arrived at that conclusion and also what we might try afterwards if that is ineffective, we have some actual answers and a long term plan- none of the "just try this and hope for the best" stuff. But yes a diuretic may help clear excess lung fluid even in the absence of a heart condition, but you need a good xray to confirm there is fluid I think rather than just suspecting it from listening by ear :)

I'd go and see a more local vet that works with guinea pigs, but she doesn't have appointments till next Tuesday, which if his breathing is getting worse would be too long. As long as I can see the vet that I've seen many times before, she's reasonable and willing to listen and try things within reason.

Do you know whether or not a Diuretic will hurt the kidneys, even if it is a one off? I'll be syringing him water if he's willing to take it, so he doesn't get dehydrated, but he's good at drinking anyway, and gets a lot of his hydration from his daily vegetables.

I'd be willing to get him X-Rayed if suggested but I'm trying to keep it as reasonable cost-wise as possible. I'm currently unemployed so don't have any money coming in and I'm living off of savings and selling the odd thing I no longer need. Luckily my expenses are small and I have backups for moments like this.
 
I think you need to discuss all this with your vet, but a recurrent respiratory issue does always really need an xray even at the local vet if it hasnt cleared up after a couple of courses of antibiotics, to see what's going on. Conscious xrays arent that expensive at all, maybe £150? Which is about the same as 2 or 3 routine vet consultations plus meds.
Getting a better diagnosis with an xray may save money in the long run, or even over a couple of months, as the treatment would definitely be more tailored to what they can see going on in the chest so less likely you have to go back in a couple of weeks with persistent or recurring symptoms.
That's my thoughts anyway, but you should really talk all this through with a trusted vet and get their opinion on the best way forward and price quotes for additional diagnostics that may be needed.
Best of luck, keep us posted!
 
Hi, just a quick update.

I took Peanut to see Ellie at Derwent Valley Vets. She suggested to trial Vetmedin and Frusol for 2 weeks and to see how he gets on. So now he's on 1/4 Tablet of 1.25mg Vetmedin and 0.5ml of Frusol, both twice daily.

I'm hoping this works well for him and he can get back to breathing easily and what not for the future. Thanks all for the help!
 
Hi all,

Figured I would give an update on Peanut. Two weeks after we started the trial, and noticing no improvement I took him back to the Ellie. We decided the next best step would be to take an xray of his chest (See attached) to see what was going on. This showed that there was liquid in his chest cavity, and therefore meaning he has a heart condition.

He's currently on 1ml twice daily of Frusol (20mg/5ml) and 1/4 tablet twice daily of Vetmedin. His breathing isn't improving so we're bumping him up to 2ml twice daily once I get the prescription through.

He's still eating, seemingly happy and maintaining his weight. But his xrays are fairly scary, I don't really know how to read them, but you're barely even able to see his lungs, so to me it is quite bad. But I will not give up on him until he tells me that it's time. I'm just using this as a good excuse to spoil him (and the others) a little bit more, he's not complaining about the extra food.



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