General Questions: Vitamin C, Hydration, Limping

[YourPigness]

We got two male piggies end of last year that my kids picked out and affectionately named Clover and Jerome. They are about 8 months old now. They have a nice big cage, several hidey spots and some tubes to crawl through (thanks GuineaDad! lol), lots of west timothy hay and water and Oxbow pellets and veggies. Daily, we feed them a generous amount of parsley, cucumber, romaine lettuce, cherry tomatoes, red/green/yellow peppers, carrots and occasionally green beans and other various green leaf veggies (spinach, kale, green leaf lettuce, etc, but they prefer romaine over all!), not to mention periodic

I hear guinea pigs need a good amount of vitamin C. I figured with the amount of veggies they eat, supplements shouldn't be necessary? What to look for or consider with regards to this? If I should consider supplements what's the best kind? They don't drink a ton of water, but I usually water down their veggies heavily before feeding, so I figure hydration shouldn't be a big concern either.

Also, one of our piggies, Clover, is chunkier than the other. He was always pretty mild mannered though, less excitable and squeaky compared to the other one, even as a pup. I'm assuming it's normal for piggies to have pretty big personality differences? I hope so, I like it that way.

The sad thing now though is that our big guy, Clover, recently started limping, not putting much pressure on his back left leg. Not sure if related, but a few days ago, he seemed very lethargic, but for the last couple of days he seemed fine, then today, when we got them out to cuddle, we noticed him keeping off his left rear leg. Otherwise he seemed normal, eating fine.

Finding a small animal vet within a reasonable distance is harder than I thought, other than an emergency vet clinic that typically has a 2-3 hour wait at any given time, or one that will only take checkup appointments that are a couple months out. I was just going to give it a few days to see if he improves, or is this something I should take him in right away for?

Here's image of our piggies:

https://imgur.com/a/HAeX05R

 

[Siikibam]

Hi and welcome. If your piggies are given a well balanced diet of hay (80%) and veg then they don’t need supplements. Pellets are also fortified with vitamins.

I will say though that your diet is high in calcium veg and some that shouldn’t be fed daily. Carrots are high in sugar so should only be an occasional treat. Tomatoes are acidic so should also be fed occasionally. Too much (including acidic fruits) can cause sores on the mouth.

Parsley, spinach and kale are also high in calcium so should only be fed once weekly, and only one of them. You’d be surprised that pellets and water actually contribute more calcium than the veg. So we recommend filtered water and keeping pellets limited to one tablespoon a day for each piggy. Veg only makes up 15% and pellets 5% of their diet.

On a daily basis you can feed a leaf of lettuce, green bean, cucumber, bell pepper and coriander. The latter two are a good source of vitamin c. You can then mix in other veg. The link to the diet guide is in the first one below.

I would try and get him seen for his foot. It’s not urgent but I would if possible. I’ll link to the vet locator below.

New Owners' Most Helpful How-To Guides and Information
Guinea Lynx :: GL's Vet List

 

[Claire W]

with the above advise. Your boys are gorgeous

 

[Wiebke]

We got two male piggies end of last year that my kids picked out and affectionately named Clover and Jerome. They are about 8 months old now. They have a nice big cage, several hidey spots and some tubes to crawl through (thanks GuineaDad! lol), lots of west timothy hay and water and Oxbow pellets and veggies. Daily, we feed them a generous amount of parsley, cucumber, romaine lettuce, cherry tomatoes, red/green/yellow peppers, carrots and occasionally green beans and other various green leaf veggies (spinach, kale, green leaf lettuce, etc, but they prefer romaine over all!), not to mention periodic

I hear guinea pigs need a good amount of vitamin C. I figured with the amount of veggies they eat, supplements shouldn't be necessary? What to look for or consider with regards to this? If I should consider supplements what's the best kind? They don't drink a ton of water, but I usually water down their veggies heavily before feeding, so I figure hydration shouldn't be a big concern either.

Also, one of our piggies, Clover, is chunkier than the other. He was always pretty mild mannered though, less excitable and squeaky compared to the other one, even as a pup. I'm assuming it's normal for piggies to have pretty big personality differences? I hope so, I like it that way.

The sad thing now though is that our big guy, Clover, recently started limping, not putting much pressure on his back left leg. Not sure if related, but a few days ago, he seemed very lethargic, but for the last couple of days he seemed fine, then today, when we got them out to cuddle, we noticed him keeping off his left rear leg. Otherwise he seemed normal, eating fine.

Finding a small animal vet within a reasonable distance is harder than I thought, other than an emergency vet clinic that typically has a 2-3 hour wait at any given time, or one that will only take checkup appointments that are a couple months out. I was just going to give it a few days to see if he improves, or is this something I should take him in right away for?

Here's image of our piggies:

https://imgur.com/a/HAeX05R

Hi!

Piggies on a good grass hay based general diet with a modicum of preferably green veg and fresh herbs and just 1 tablespoon of pellets don't need any vitamin C supplements. It is much better to use them as a targeted 2-3 weeks booster when recovering from an illness or suffering from problems in connection with lowered immune system. Most survy cases we see on here are ironically from guinea pigs on a very high level of supplemented vitamin C to which the body has adapted and to the dropping of which it will react with scurvy symptoms, even if the actual vitamin C level is still above normal. None of the long term members on here has ever had an issue with scurvy resulting from a balanced grass hay based normal diet.
Drinking levels can vary largely individually but eating piggies don't usually dehydrate because the need to drink comes before the need to eat; blocked/dripping bottles or frozen or overheated water in weather extremes can however lead to problems. Some piggies will hardly ever drink while others can empty a bottle in a day and either can be perfectly normal and live a normal healthy life span.

Please take the time to read our diet guide. It is looking at diet as a whole and at all food groups (including water) in practical and precise detail. You should find it very helpful: Long Term Balanced General And Special Needs Guinea Pig Diets

Guinea pig sizes and personalities can differ greatly. When you start your life-long weekly health monitoring routine, we recommend to establish the BMI/feel for the 'heft' around the ribcage to see whether your piggies are a good weight for their invidual size. This give you the ball park in which each piggy plays so you can then judge any weekly weight changes on that background. Weight guidelines are unfortunately far too narrow; we regularly see people with perfectly normal and healthy piggies that are larger or smaller than the 50% average being called overweight or underweight. On a good normal diet without too much high sugar/starch calorific veg, over-treating and regular exercise, guinea pigs won't be badly overweight.
It is well worth to read the links in this post because because they can add 1-2 years to a healthy normal life span and boost the overall health.
Here our health monitoring guides, which teach you what is normal and what not so you can step in earlier on slowly developing issues before they become a fight for life:
Weight - Monitoring and Management
Guinea pig body quirks - What is normal and what not?
Boar Care: Bits, Bums & Baths
Early Signs Of Illness
How Soon Should My Guinea Pig See A Vet? - A Quick Guide

All these guides are part of our much larger New Owners guide collection, which aims to help you understand your piggies and make friends with them in their own body language, care for them well and help you avoid as many of the pitfalls that can await the wary as possible. You may want to bookmark the link, browse, read and re-read at need. It is one of the most comprehensive practical information resources currently around. The guide format allows us to update and extend at need and as we have spare time.
Here is the link: Getting Started - New Owners' Most Helpful Guides
Our full and even wider information can be accessed via the guides shortcut on the top bar where it is laid out in thematical order.

As to the leg: especially young and lively piggies are quite prone to sprain and twist their legs at any point from the shoulder/hip downwards. As long as they are able to still move around and put a little weight on the leg, it is most likely just a sprain. It can be aggravated when too much weight is put on it again. An analgesic (painkiller cum anti-inflammatory) may help with the swelling and pain.
If you can, please see a vet. It can be difficult to find a vet in the USA as exotics vets can be far and few in between and often have long waiting times for an appointment. In rural areas, finding a general vet willing to see a small pet that has hardly featured in their curriculum (since rodents are classed as an exotic pet), can be a problem.
A guide to vets fees, insurance and payment support.
Guinea Lynx :: Finding a Veterinarian (practical tips for finding a vet)
Guinea Lynx :: GL's Vet List

I hope that this helps you?

 

[YourPigness]

Thanks everyone, I'll reassess their diet and read through the guides. Thanks for putting this together.

They love their cucumber and parsley the most followed by romaine lettuce, tomatoes, peppers and then everything else. I'll start to rotate carrots and tomatoes and reduce the amount of pellets too. I basically put in a bowl of pellets and let them eat at it. But usually if there's plenty of hay they prefer that over the pellets anyhow.

Finding a vet, especially one that really knows about small animals/exotic pets is definitely more of a challenge than I thought. Makes me a bit upset, before we got them, I did a cursory check online for vets in the area that accept guinea pigs, and there were a few that listed them on their website. But when I go to call now, they say they "don't normally accept them." So I guess I'll have to take him to the emergency clinic where they say they will look him over, hoping they know what they're doing, and in the meantime do some more searching for a proper guinea pig vet.

 

[Siikibam]

Have a look at the link I put in my earlier post. You can see if there are any vets in your state or a nearby one.

I would really cut back on the high calcium veg and carrots and tomatoes. Give it as a monthly treat and no more. You can instead give them different types of hay or forage (frequency depends on content).

 

[YourPigness]

OK, thanks. I will definitely reassess their diet. But they really love their parsley, but other than romaine lettuce, haven't been too fond of kale or dandelion or many other types of greens. Maybe I've spoiled them already. Although Hay is a significant part of their diet. But finding consistently good hay has also been a challenge.

 

[Wiebke]

OK, thanks. I will definitely reassess their diet. But they really love their parsley, but other than romaine lettuce, haven't been too fond of kale or dandelion or many other types of greens. Maybe I've spoiled them already. Although Hay is a significant part of their diet. But finding consistently good hay has also been a challenge.

If they likely parsley and other types of fresh herbs, then just feed a little more of it.

Keep in mind that piggies that have only had very limited access to fresh veg at a time when they learn what is safe to eat and what not by sniffing their elders' mouths or snatching food from their elders' mouths, then they can struggle to accept new foods without that assurance. This learning happens during the first 4 months of their lives. Be patient and persist.

If you have access to fresh growing dog pee free grass, then that is another great source of vitamin C (and the reason why guinea pigs never had the need to make their own in the first place) - but you need to start slowly in small quantities and as part of a food mix as any new food can cause diarrhea or bloating because the sensitive gut microbiome is not accustomed to it. You can give a little more with each new feed over the coming days; this goes with all new foods. Please be aware that you cannot feed grass clippings from mowed grass because they start fermenting the moment they are cut.

Hay is the staple that should make the equivalent of a human breakfast, lunch and dinner (ca. 80%). Fresh veg is replacing the role of wild forage as supplementation in trace elements, minerals and vitamins not coming with the grass/hay bulk. It is about the equivalent of an afternoon snack. Pellets are in the way of a dessert. More vitamin C; but compared to hay a lot less fibre, a lot more calcium and empty fillers. A piggy will eat a lot less hay compared to the amount of pellets because they are more calorific - but that means also a lot more soft feed for chewing and more fat on the body in the long term. The more grass/hay fibre your piggies eat, the better because the growth of their grinding molars at the back has evolved against the very abrasive silica in grass fibre and the gut is perfectly laid out to break down the fibre and get the most out of it in two runs through it (piggies eat the poos that contain the nutrional fibre for the second run; these special poos are called caecotrophs). The happier you keep the back teeth and gut, the overall healthier and fitter your piggies will be.

Try to vary with different hay varieties, especially if the quality is not always the same. And save up so you can buy more bags whenever the hay is a good quality. You can find a guide link to all things hay (including sourcing it in several countries) in the diet guide.