Dominance Going Too Far?

[pip and squeak]

HI everyone, I'm new to this forum so hope you will be able to give some advice. We got two 4 month old sows- Pip and Squeak just over three weeks ago who are both super cute- sorry no pictures yet! They were living together in the pet shop (couldn't find any shelters with guineas here) and appeared to be happy together. For the first week they were getting on great with no narkiness, lying together, sharing spaces. If anything Pip seemed to be a little more in charge but is also the more laid back guinea while Squeak is more inquisitive and busy.

After about a week Squeak started the rumblestruttling and trying to mount Pip. It went on for a couple of days but then stopped and after looking up this forum it looked like maybe she was in season for those days. Now just over two weeks later it's started again so I was thinking maybe in season again? There is a bit of chasing and rumblestrutting but no taking over areas or not letting Pip eat or anything. The thing is that this time Squeak has nipped Pip on her side a couple of times and there is some dry blood there. Most of the time though they are still happy together, Pip doesn't seem down, she is relaxed, not hiding away etc. However, on the advice on this forum it says to separate them if they draw blood but to me it was not outright fighting but her nipping drew blood- what do you think I should do?

 

[Wiebke]

HI everyone, I'm new to this forum so hope you will be able to give some advice. We got two 4 month old sows- Pip and Squeak just over three weeks ago who are both super cute- sorry no pictures yet! They were living together in the pet shop (couldn't find any shelters with guineas here) and appeared to be happy together. For the first week they were getting on great with no narkiness, lying together, sharing spaces. If anything Pip seemed to be a little more in charge but is also the more laid back guinea while Squeak is more inquisitive and busy.

After about a week Squeak started the rumblestruttling and trying to mount Pip. It went on for a couple of days but then stopped and after looking up this forum it looked like maybe she was in season for those days. Now just over two weeks later it's started again so I was thinking maybe in season again? There is a bit of chasing and rumblestrutting but no taking over areas or not letting Pip eat or anything. The thing is that this time Squeak has nipped Pip on her side a couple of times and there is some dry blood there. Most of the time though they are still happy together, Pip doesn't seem down, she is relaxed, not hiding away etc. However, on the advice on this forum it says to separate them if they draw blood but to me it was not outright fighting but her nipping drew blood- what do you think I should do?

Hi and welcome!

I understand that you have got sows and not boars that fight seriously with intentional bites deep enough to cripple your hand when they are not personality matched and really get going with no space to get away from each other! It is rare that sows fight and fall-out, but yours are definitely not in that category.

Nipping is usually a very carefully judged gesture of dominance, but it can go a bit wrong occasionally if the underpiggy can;t get out of the way quickly enough. As your girls are not on the outs with each other, they quite obviously don't see it as a fight, so neither should you.
Your girls sound like the dominant one has been in season again.
Sow Behaviour

 

[pip and squeak]

Thanks Wiebke, that's reassuring, hopefully it will settle down again! Thinking about it when I have seen it happen it has mostly been on the upper level where their hay is which is smaller and might be harder for Pip to get out of the way. Should I try to wipe the little cuts with something or just leave them to heal by themselves?

 

[Wiebke]

Thanks Wiebke, that's reassuring, hopefully it will settle down again! Thinking about it when I have seen it happen it has mostly been on the upper level where their hay is which is smaller and might be harder for Pip to get out of the way. Should I try to wipe the little cuts with something or just leave them to heal by themselves?

You can disinfect them with saline solution, either sterile from the pharmacy, or home made by mixing 1 teaspoon of salt into 1 pint of boiled, cooled water.
First Aid Kit For Guinea Pigs

 

[pip and squeak]

Thanks so much Wiebke, I'll do that now. More rumblestrutting today but Squeak is also licking Pip and being nice to her too- think her hormones might just be all over the place like lots of teenagers!

 

[Wiebke]

Thanks so much Wiebke, I'll do that now. More rumblestrutting today but Squeak is also licking Pip and being nice to her too- think her hormones might just be all over the place like lots of teenagers!

Sub-adult sows can have stronger seasons and hormonal peaks, but as they usually don't lead to fall-outs, they are much less known.
It is a very good sign that your girls are busy reaffirming their bond after a shared excess of emotions; experiences like these serve to bond them even tighter. They are really best of friends when the chips are down, so you can forget about any fall-outs and separations!

 

[pip and squeak]

UPDATE- so my guinea pigs have been getting on great again but Pip continued to have sores on her back which I thought were the result of bites from Squeak. I had been keeping the sores clean with saline solution but then I thought there was swelling under some of them and worried there could be an abscess. Anyway I took them to the vet and she thinks that actually the sores are from mange mites so she gave them both an injection (forgot to check what it was) and I have to bring them back again after a week for another injection. She also gave Pip Baytril to take twice a day and both to take Metacam once a day. Does this sound like the right treatment?
Also in relation to cleaning the cage they are on fleece so I have changed it and disinfected their hay box etc. They have a wooden house though and I'm not sure how best to clean it to get rid of the mites. I have a disinfectant spray I could just spray all over or would I be better to immerse it in water and soap or something- what do you think?
Lastly- any way to prevent them? Have read some things about them coming in on hay and people putting the hay in the freezer- is this necessary or maybe they got it from the petshop?
Thanks

 

[Wiebke]

UPDATE- so my guinea pigs have been getting on great again but Pip continued to have sores on her back which I thought were the result of bites from Squeak. I had been keeping the sores clean with saline solution but then I thought there was swelling under some of them and worried there could be an abscess. Anyway I took them to the vet and she thinks that actually the sores are from mange mites so she gave them both an injection (forgot to check what it was) and I have to bring them back again after a week for another injection. She also gave Pip Baytril to take twice a day and both to take Metacam once a day. Does this sound like the right treatment?
Also in relation to cleaning the cage they are on fleece so I have changed it and disinfected their hay box etc. They have a wooden house though and I'm not sure how best to clean it to get rid of the mites. I have a disinfectant spray I could just spray all over or would I be better to immerse it in water and soap or something- what do you think?
Lastly- any way to prevent them? Have read some things about them coming in on hay and people putting the hay in the freezer- is this necessary or maybe they got it from the petshop?
Thanks

Mange mites need a 3-4 rounds course of high dosed ivermectin, so you will have to go back to your vet for that. Please monitor the swelling/potential abscess; baytril may not be strong enough to cut through it. The pain in the sore skin can help to make piggies irritable. it is always important to have any bite wounds vet checked, as they are more often self-inflicted than not (mange mites, fungal, pain).
Visible hay/fur mites tend to come with untreated hay. Most shop hay is treated these days so you are much more unlikely to get sikin parasites than you used to.

Most guinea pigs have mange mite eggs in their skin these days. These are usually kept under control by a fully working immune system, but they can come up whenever that is not the case (illness, stress). The best way is to hit the mites hard with a full 3-4 rounds course of properly high dosed ivermection (the most efficient is an infection, which is what your vet is doing) at the product specific interval. Just a one-off injection is not going to do the trick.
Please do not be tempted to treat proactively with a low dosed shop product. All you achieve is to help the mites in the skin develop resistence to ivermectin. This is unfortunately already happening.
If treated promptly and correctly when are dealing with an acute outbreak, mange mites will not become more than short-term nuisance.

By all means give your cage a once monthly deep clean with a good product like F10, which addresses both bacteria and fungal and wash the fleece at a higher temperature like 60-90 C.

 

[pip and squeak]

Thanks Wiebke, the vet said that there is no abscess, what I was concerned was one was hard scab tissue under the skin. She said that an abscess would be softer and have pus. I think she was just going to have them back for one more injection but sounds like from what you are saying they should have three or four so maybe I'll get her to do that.
I feel bad now blaming Squeak for biting Pip when she was doing it to herself! Maybe though the stress from being hassled by Squeak could have made the mites be activated? Anyway, hope we are on the right course now to getting it resolved. Thanks for your advice.