• Discussions taking place within this forum are intended for the purpose of assisting you in discussing options with your vet. Any other use of advice given here is done so at your risk, is solely your responsibility and not that of this forum or its owner. Before posting it is your responsibility you abide by this Statement

Dental pain and syringe feeding

Angela99

Junior Guinea Pig
Joined
Mar 22, 2018
Messages
249
Reaction score
236
Points
330
Location
Vancouver BC CANADA
Hi my Truffle has a dental problem and can’t eat anything. The Vet gave me medication for his GI STASIS AND PAIN… and he isn’t going back to Vet until 30th for hopefully surgery/treatment… they said to bring him early to do it. My question is in the last week he is struggling even with syringe critical care and so how fast do teeth grow? He was able to eat parsley last week but now not a thing! All other small pet Vets are out of town so I am stuck until the 30th. His GI stasis is now better and his strength is up from me feeding… can he choke on his food when this happens? Any help to get me through the week is helpful!
Angela
 
I am sorry so for you both, you are between a rock and a hard place. Try and syringe feed at the pace of your piggie, put on more than 1/3rd of 1mg at a time, less if she is really struggling aim for 60 mg st per day.Weigh her daily at the same time to make sure she is getting enough food
Do look at our syringe feeding guide is great 😊
Good luck it’s an awful position to be in
 
I am sorry so for you both, you are between a rock and a hard place. Try and syringe feed at the pace of your piggie, put on more than 1/3rd of 1mg at a time, less if she is really struggling aim for 60 mg st per day.Weigh her daily at the same time to make sure she is getting enough food
Do look at our syringe feeding guide is great 😊
Good luck it’s an awful position to be in
Thank you yes I’m going at his pace and his Gi stasis is better now. I have a question about night time… I feed every 2 hours or so … what about night time? Should I feed in middle of night? He’s not able to eat anything on his own. I’ve been leaving 6 hours for sleep
 
It’s a difficult situation as obviously you don’t want him to go without food for too long if he isn’t able to nibble at anything at all but you simply must look after yourself - you can’t look after him if you are exhausted.

I would give him a feed just before you go to bed and then as soon as you wake up.
 
It’s a difficult situation as obviously you don’t want him to go without food for too long if he isn’t able to nibble at anything at all but you simply must look after yourself - you can’t look after him if you are exhausted.

I would give him a feed just before you go to bed and then as soon as you wake up.
Ok thank you… that’s what I’ve been doing. I’m not working.. just feeding him full time. It’s just breaking my heart 🥹🐹❤️
 
Thank you yes I’m going at his pace and his Gi stasis is better now. I have a question about night time… I feed every 2 hours or so … what about night time? Should I feed in middle of night? He’s not able to eat anything on his own. I’ve been leaving 6 hours for sleep
feeding through the night should only be done for a short length of time and in critical times as you have to look after yourself too. I always tried to get most done during the day, first feed at 6.00 am and last feed at 11.00 pm
It’s very hard on you :hug: I hope your vet can help him in the long term x
 
I am very sorry 😞 Have a look at our syringe feeding guide which was been linked above, it really is helpful.

My friend who is a member of this forum is currently looking after my boy Edward who is getting treatment from a specialist dental vet here in the U.K. she’s having to syringe feed him and he is a poorly boy. His next appointment is also on the 30th as the vet is currently on holiday. It sadly doesn’t look good for him 😞

You have to look after yourself too so give Truffle a feed before you go to bed and as soon as you wake up. You need your sleep otherwise you’ll be no good for anyone.

I hope Truffle will be ok x
 
My little sow survived on syringe food only for over a month. We couldn't save her in the end - we think she had a swallowing problem although she started out with a dental as I noticed she'd stopped eating. The vet did say teeth can be the primary problem or just a secondary effect.
Ivy averaged about 45 ml per day and was fed between 6:30 am and 11pm. It took a long time - she chewed but didn't seem to swallow. She was on antibiotics and metacam too but neither made any difference. It took about 6 hours every day to feed her... we did 4 or 5 sessions. She'd lost weight but maintained at about 950g on this regime. She didn't eat anything at all herself - she didn't touch syringe food unless it was syringed in. She wasn't particularly happy about it but she was hungry and sniffing for food so we both settled with the idea that it was an 'uncomfortable compromise' and tried to make it as stress-free as possible. I feel for your situation - it is relentless for piggy and owner

The one thing to check is that the incisors do not interfere with the back teeth chewing. Ivy's dental just tackled the molars which had overgrown slightly. She had painkiller and antibiotic for a week after as routine. The incisors were OK at that point. But a couple of weeks of not eating later meant the incisors overgrew to the point where she could not actually close her mouth! It took a different vet to spot it - they were then quickly burred down (a little too short actually - it is done w/o anaesthetic in about 5 mins) and the speed and smoothness of her chewing greatly improved. I would syringe in a very little and then rest my fingers lightly on the bald patches behind her ears where I could feel the even vibrations of her chewing... but she would just chew forever without seeming to swallow.

I also tried varying her diet by pounding up carrot with water or parsley with water and then mixing that water into the food slurry for a different flavour. Anything to keep her interest up at a difficult time. Good luck Truffle - I hope you can get sorted x
 
I am very sorry 😞 Have a look at our syringe feeding guide which was been linked above, it really is helpful.

My friend who is a member of this forum is currently looking after my boy Edward who is getting treatment from a specialist dental vet here in the U.K. she’s having to syringe feed him and he is a poorly boy. His next appointment is also on the 30th as the vet is currently on holiday. It sadly doesn’t look good for him 😞

You have to look after yourself too so give Truffle a feed before you go to bed and as soon as you wake up. You need your sleep otherwise you’ll be no good for anyone.

I hope Truffle will be ok x
So sorry to hear about your pig! Oh it’s killing me to wait til the 30th! And he’s 5.5 years old so he’ll need anaesthesia.
I keep hearing that dental problems are the worst but hoping he’ll just need a teeth shaving. I’ve been doing 11pm and 6am night program. Thank you
No one understands around me how much I love my Truffle. Hopefully our pigs will make it through! 🙏🙏🙏
 
My little sow survived on syringe food only for over a month. We couldn't save her in the end - we think she had a swallowing problem although she started out with a dental as I noticed she'd stopped eating. The vet did say teeth can be the primary problem or just a secondary effect.
Ivy averaged about 45 ml per day and was fed between 6:30 am and 11pm. It took a long time - she chewed but didn't seem to swallow. She was on antibiotics and metacam too but neither made any difference. It took about 6 hours every day to feed her... we did 4 or 5 sessions. She'd lost weight but maintained at about 950g on this regime. She didn't eat anything at all herself - she didn't touch syringe food unless it was syringed in. She wasn't particularly happy about it but she was hungry and sniffing for food so we both settled with the idea that it was an 'uncomfortable compromise' and tried to make it as stress-free as possible. I feel for your situation - it is relentless for piggy and owner

The one thing to check is that the incisors do not interfere with the back teeth chewing. Ivy's dental just tackled the molars which had overgrown slightly. She had painkiller and antibiotic for a week after as routine. The incisors were OK at that point. But a couple of weeks of not eating later meant the incisors overgrew to the point where she could not actually close her mouth! It took a different vet to spot it - they were then quickly burred down (a little too short actually - it is done w/o anaesthetic in about 5 mins) and the speed and smoothness of her chewing greatly improved. I would syringe in a very little and then rest my fingers lightly on the bald patches behind her ears where I could feel the even vibrations of her chewing... but she would just chew forever without seeming to swallow.

I also tried varying her diet by pounding up carrot with water or parsley with water and then mixing that water into the food slurry for a different flavour. Anything to keep her interest up at a difficult time. Good luck Truffle - I hope you can get sorted x
Thank you for sharing… so sorry 😞 I don’t understand though…. The teeth grow so fast that in a week they can close up the throat?! What? You see he is really struggling to swallow now but a week and a half ago he ate a bunch of dill so I was really hopeful! And now nothing … he can’t eat anything at all. Last night I bawled my eyes out and had him on my chest I thought he was going to pass.

He is also on morphine medication so I was wondering if it’s too much. Metacam, morphine and cisapride bc he also has Gi stasis. His Vet away for August and no other emergency or even exotic Vet deal with dental…. I’m just feeling hopeless right now 😞
 

Attachments

  • 79C9A6C8-D95F-4B2E-B694-785455262678.webp
    79C9A6C8-D95F-4B2E-B694-785455262678.webp
    65.4 KB · Views: 9
No, my girl's teeth were not her primary problem as far as we can say. Something else stopped her swallowing - maybe a growth in the throat we couldn't detect. The teeth were a secondary issue. The mystery problem caused her to eat less and less until she stopped. Then the vet said her back teeth were slightly overgrown (likely because she'd been eating less and less hay) but her tongue was still moving freely. This is important for the swallowing and of course with some dental pigs the tongue gets trapped by a 'bridge' of back molars. Her back teeth were taken down a bit to give comfortable grinding surfaces but the front ones were left at that point as if the dental had worked she would have been biting for herself within a few days. But she didn't start eating again and it was a few weeks later that we could see the incisors had now gotten too long now and needed to be burred down too because they blocked proper chewing.

Ivy could chew - in fact she would chew and chew at the syringe food for hours but not swallow which is why her feeds took so long. The vet had felt all round the jaw and mouth for lumps or tender spots that could indicate an abscess but found nothing. By the end we were throwing everything at it - scans, painkillers, different types of antibiotics etc. But of course if it had turned out to be a cancer in the throat then nothing would have helped anyway. The vet team were very good working with me over that time - I mean, it's a long time to keep a little girl alive who can't eat herself but we had hope because she seemed to want to eat so much and tbh she looked in good condition - bright eyes, shiny coat and all that. She was 3 1/2. But on the last weekend she went downhill within a day or so and you could tell she'd just had enough. I took her in for pts and the vet said she was ready. And it hits very hard when you nurse them for so long.

How is your boy's chewing? Remember I said above about feeling the bit behind the ears to tell if it's smooth or regular? If his teeth are bothering him it's likely to be slower and more erratic. What are the signs he might be in pain? Morphine-type drugs are a very effective painkiller but have they supressed his appetite? I only ask because one of my pigs once had an opioid injection while she was trying to pee out a bladder stone - it worked and she had no pain but while she was on it she didn't eat a thing. It might have been buprenorphine but I can't remember at this point. If his appetite dropped off when he started the morphine drug (orally?) that might be telling you something...?

Try and focus on resting yourself too. You're in this together x
 
No, my girl's teeth were not her primary problem as far as we can say. Something else stopped her swallowing - maybe a growth in the throat we couldn't detect. The teeth were a secondary issue. The mystery problem caused her to eat less and less until she stopped. Then the vet said her back teeth were slightly overgrown (likely because she'd been eating less and less hay) but her tongue was still moving freely. This is important for the swallowing and of course with some dental pigs the tongue gets trapped by a 'bridge' of back molars. Her back teeth were taken down a bit to give comfortable grinding surfaces but the front ones were left at that point as if the dental had worked she would have been biting for herself within a few days. But she didn't start eating again and it was a few weeks later that we could see the incisors had now gotten too long now and needed to be burred down too because they blocked proper chewing.

Ivy could chew - in fact she would chew and chew at the syringe food for hours but not swallow which is why her feeds took so long. The vet had felt all round the jaw and mouth for lumps or tender spots that could indicate an abscess but found nothing. By the end we were throwing everything at it - scans, painkillers, different types of antibiotics etc. But of course if it had turned out to be a cancer in the throat then nothing would have helped anyway. The vet team were very good working with me over that time - I mean, it's a long time to keep a little girl alive who can't eat herself but we had hope because she seemed to want to eat so much and tbh she looked in good condition - bright eyes, shiny coat and all that. She was 3 1/2. But on the last weekend she went downhill within a day or so and you could tell she'd just had enough. I took her in for pts and the vet said she was ready. And it hits very hard when you nurse them for so long.

How is your boy's chewing? Remember I said above about feeling the bit behind the ears to tell if it's smooth or regular? If his teeth are bothering him it's likely to be slower and more erratic. What are the signs he might be in pain? Morphine-type drugs are a very effective painkiller but have they supressed his appetite? I only ask because one of my pigs once had an opioid injection while she was trying to pee out a bladder stone - it worked and she had no pain but while she was on it she didn't eat a thing. It might have been buprenorphine but I can't remember at this point. If his appetite dropped off when he started the morphine drug (orally?) that might be telling you something...?

Try and focus on resting yourself too. You're in this together x
Wow sounds like that was a lot for you to endure! Sorry 😞 and she was so young🙏 I decided to feed in the middle of night bc I thought he was going to die … and fell apart crying 😭 So 11pm
and 2 30am and 6am I also made poo soup and gave him 10 syringes of that… he loves it. Last night I saw he pooped a little and his energy was better, but then I gave morphine and yes he is sedated on me right now. He doesn’t sleep on his side … he just sits and doesn’t move …normally he is very active, talkative and plays with me. He is swallowing his food but he seems to be struggling so much sometimes so I just don’t know until the Vet. This morning he ate happily though his syringe food. Can the Vet treat GI STASIS or do we continue feeding and hope for the best? I read posts on here that piggies die. It’s just heartbreaking

Thank you for sharing your story❤️🙏❤️
 
We got something called emeprid to encourage the guts to keep going - but if he's keen for poop soup and able to eat sometimes and pooping a little they're still moving. Yes, it can be very wearing though. First thing is to try and get enough sleep but accept that if you've had a rough night yourself you won't be feeling positive. It's just one day at a time. We tried to make feeding as relaxing a time as possible: prepping the syringe food fresh, pounding chopped carrot or parsley in a little water in the mortar & pestle to get some flavour, filling the med syringes and lining them up, getting the notebook and pen ready to make notes on how much was taken etc. Getting it all ready in advance. Then I would make my own breakfast too - muesli and a cup of tea as a rule - and sit on the floor near the piggies. This way Ivy was close to her house and her companion who was also eating at that time of day so we put the radio on quietly and listened to the news for a couple hours. The late morning/ lunchtime feeds were often on a bench in the back garden to get a bit of fresh air which made a change. Afternoons we went into the TV room and watched an old movie for the feed - the sound is quieter on the old black & whites. Bedtime was back on the floor by the cages. I got a lot of support from my family who didn't mind heating up a pre-cooked meal for themselves if I was busy. In our case it turned out that these were the last times I spent with Ivy so we made the most of them.

You said he ate happily through his syringe food in the morning... was that before you gave any of the morphine? Or when it had worn off? Do you see it suppressing his appetite? I mean, it is an effective painkiller but I wonder is it actually making him eat less rather than helping him eat more?!
Could you tell us if it's actually labelled as 'morphine' or maybe something else like buprenorphine? And what is the concentration, dose and how many times do you give it? I've little experience here but I'm going to tag in @furryfriends (TEAS) who has dental experience and may have something else to add.
 
We got something called emeprid to encourage the guts to keep going - but if he's keen for poop soup and able to eat sometimes and pooping a little they're still moving. Yes, it can be very wearing though. First thing is to try and get enough sleep but accept that if you've had a rough night yourself you won't be feeling positive. It's just one day at a time. We tried to make feeding as relaxing a time as possible: prepping the syringe food fresh, pounding chopped carrot or parsley in a little water in the mortar & pestle to get some flavour, filling the med syringes and lining them up, getting the notebook and pen ready to make notes on how much was taken etc. Getting it all ready in advance. Then I would make my own breakfast too - muesli and a cup of tea as a rule - and sit on the floor near the piggies. This way Ivy was close to her house and her companion who was also eating at that time of day so we put the radio on quietly and listened to the news for a couple hours. The late morning/ lunchtime feeds were often on a bench in the back garden to get a bit of fresh air which made a change. Afternoons we went into the TV room and watched an old movie for the feed - the sound is quieter on the old black & whites. Bedtime was back on the floor by the cages. I got a lot of support from my family who didn't mind heating up a pre-cooked meal for themselves if I was busy. In our case it turned out that these were the last times I spent with Ivy so we made the most of them.

You said he ate happily through his syringe food in the morning... was that before you gave any of the morphine? Or when it had worn off? Do you see it suppressing his appetite? I mean, it is an effective painkiller but I wonder is it actually making him eat less rather than helping him eat more?!
Could you tell us if it's actually labelled as 'morphine' or maybe something else like buprenorphine? And what is the concentration, dose and how many times do you give it? I've little experience here but I'm going to tag in @furryfriends (TEAS) who has dental experience and may have something else to add.
That’s quite the routine you had! ☺️ I feed him on my kitchen table which is beside his cage and his brother feels close to us… he gets up and eats too. But I feed at
7am
10/11am
1pm
4pm
7pm
10pm
3am so 7 times a day. I almost lost him last week so I’m getting up in middle of night and it’s made a huge difference! Also poop soup ….3- 10 syringe full every feed. I’m absolutely exhausted but I don’t see any solution until Vet sees him Tuesday. He wants to eat but can’t. He was playing today and ran around with his brother so his strength is up! But almost 5 weeks on syringe food!

He gets .1 ml buemorphine every 12 hours and .8mil metacam once a day and cisapride .6 mil every 12 hours

I minced dill and his a few pellets in food and he was purring happily this morning. I want to reduce morphine but he is always adjusting his body as in he is in pain AND he was grinding his teeth so I can’t bear seeing him suffer. He can’t sleep on side and looks like he never sleeps at all. Praying he will get through this. I am not able to anything else but be with him right now and I’m alone, but he means everything to me! I feel for you and Ivy…. She was blessed to have you🐹❤️
 
You are being so determined to give him his best chance - Ivy was on twice a day metacam but she never ground teeth and we don't think she had any pain once the initial tenderness from the first dental wore off. It feels like forever but you are so close to the vet visit now and his strength is up from the night-time feeds. We're nearly at Tuesday...

It's great he is going for the poop soup. Ivy was hungry but didn't look forward to the feeding process and adding a bit of poop soup made her pull a face but didn't affect anything. When my big girl Louise suffered bloat earlier this year she was greatly helped by a poop soup donation from George (on the left) but she looked absolutely horrified when the syringe went in and I'd even tried to disguise it with tasty recovery food!

Ivy and George were companions but not snugglers, yet when she was unwell they went in the snuggle-tunnel together. Since then George has been very fond of comfy fleece tunnels, especially as he has gotten older and developed arthritis and impaction. They give him a comfy surface to lie on to ease his aches and pains. We have been total converts to fleecy things. Does it help Truffle to lie on something soft?
 
You are being so determined to give him his best chance - Ivy was on twice a day metacam but she never ground teeth and we don't think she had any pain once the initial tenderness from the first dental wore off. It feels like forever but you are so close to the vet visit now and his strength is up from the night-time feeds. We're nearly at Tuesday...

It's great he is going for the poop soup. Ivy was hungry but didn't look forward to the feeding process and adding a bit of poop soup made her pull a face but didn't affect anything. When my big girl Louise suffered bloat earlier this year she was greatly helped by a poop soup donation from George (on the left) but she looked absolutely horrified when the syringe went in and I'd even tried to disguise it with tasty recovery food!

Ivy and George were companions but not snugglers, yet when she was unwell they went in the snuggle-tunnel together. Since then George has been very fond of comfy fleece tunnels, especially as he has gotten older and developed arthritis and impaction. They give him a comfy surface to lie on to ease his aches and pains. We have been total converts to fleecy things. Does it help Truffle to lie on something soft?
I assumed all piggies loved poop soup!

Yes they have all fleece cage and I made pillows for them. He was sitting over one last night. This morning is energy is low again and I’m so worried. Does GI stasis never get better? Is it terminal? Or can it be? I just understand why he can’t eat if he wants to… other than if his teeth are not good. I’ll of course ask the vet tomorrow. How many months are you able to syringe feed a piggy?
 
Hi I’ve been syringe feeding my Truffle over a month 7 times a day…we FINALLY see Vet tomorrow! He has Gi stasis and I’m not sure why or if it’s his teeth but he is very weak. On medication but zero improvement… he is 5.5 years old and was prior a super pig ! High energy talkative etc. i don’t want him to suffer so any guidance is helpful. But really how long can he live on syringe food? I add pellets and minced dill . My heart is broken 😞
 
I’m sorry your boy is so unwell. A few questions first to get an idea of what’s going on. What did the vet think was wrong with him? How is/was his GI stasis treated? What medications is he on, if any?
And what were his initial symptoms a month ago?

Lastly, how has his weight been over the past month and (roughly) how much syringe feed are you getting into him in a 24 hour period?

I am not sure how long you can syringe feed. There has to come a point (taking everything into consideration) where you have to consider if it’s working for him. And you have to think about whether it’s doable for you as you have to be well to look after him as well.

I’m sorry I don’t really have any answers for you. I hope the vet visit tomorrow gives you some more answers and helps you decide how to love forward.

Someone else will be along in good time to maybe help you more.
 
You can keep them alive on syringe food but there will be an underlying physical cause why they can't eat that will in the end make the difference. And teeth will likely need doing on a regular basis which will be upsetting for them. In Ivy's case we never found out what the problem was and I still go over and over it sometimes. The only reason I can say that I don't think it was actually teeth was that her chewing was very efficient and she seemed to have no pain. But on her final weekend with me I noticed she'd lost a little more weight, looked a little bit rough, and then within a day or so was isolating herself from George and sitting in a hunch facing the wall. From the moment she first turned away from her food she didn't eat a thing on her own. Not syringe food from a bowl, or a spoon, or cucumber middles, or even a drink of water. Maybe she couldn't swallow, maybe there was a tumour, maybe she felt sick all the time, I just don't know.

If piggy is eating and pooping he's not in gut stasis, but if he's not eating well on his own we give the syringe food and gut stimulant (I think that's what your cisapride is) to try and help everything keep moving along. It might be a good opportunity for you vet to have a good examination of him while he's under GA for the teeth to see if there are any lumps or swellings in the abdomen or throat. You are doing so well to keep him going at this stage, you are giving him every chance. Good luck for tomorrow x
 
You can keep them alive on syringe food but there will be an underlying physical cause why they can't eat that will in the end make the difference. And teeth will likely need doing on a regular basis which will be upsetting for them. In Ivy's case we never found out what the problem was and I still go over and over it sometimes. The only reason I can say that I don't think it was actually teeth was that her chewing was very efficient and she seemed to have no pain. But on her final weekend with me I noticed she'd lost a little more weight, looked a little bit rough, and then within a day or so was isolating herself from George and sitting in a hunch facing the wall. From the moment she first turned away from her food she didn't eat a thing on her own. Not syringe food from a bowl, or a spoon, or cucumber middles, or even a drink of water. Maybe she couldn't swallow, maybe there was a tumour, maybe she felt sick all the time, I just don't know.

If piggy is eating and pooping he's not in gut stasis, but if he's not eating well on his own we give the syringe food and gut stimulant (I think that's what your cisapride is) to try and help everything keep moving along. It might be a good opportunity for you vet to have a good examination of him while he's under GA for the teeth to see if there are any lumps or swellings in the abdomen or throat. You are doing so well to keep him going at this stage, you are giving him every chance. Good luck for tomorrow x
 
Ok thank you 🙏 yes he is 5 years old so I worry about anesthesia but if it’s his teeth which I’m sure it is then they will need to do it. Between teeth and gum pain and the Gi stasis he’s suffering! He’s not pooping much and can’t eat. And he adjusts his body while sitting constantly so he is in pain plus he is grinding teeth
He tried to play a bit today and tried to eat but realized he couldn’t and then I bawled my eyes out😭😭😭

I will know more tomorrow. I appreciate your feedback, there aren’t any Guinea pig people around me🙏🙏🙏🙏




QUOTE="Free Ranger, post: 2751969, member: 140940"]
You can keep them alive on syringe food but there will be an underlying physical cause why they can't eat that will in the end make the difference. And teeth will likely need doing on a regular basis which will be upsetting for them. In Ivy's case we never found out what the problem was and I still go over and over it sometimes. The only reason I can say that I don't think it was actually teeth was that her chewing was very efficient and she seemed to have no pain. But on her final weekend with me I noticed she'd lost a little more weight, looked a little bit rough, and then within a day or so was isolating herself from George and sitting in a hunch facing the wall. From the moment she first turned away from her food she didn't eat a thing on her own. Not syringe food from a bowl, or a spoon, or cucumber middles, or even a drink of water. Maybe she couldn't swallow, maybe there was a tumour, maybe she felt sick all the time, I just don't know.

If piggy is eating and pooping he's not in gut stasis, but if he's not eating well on his own we give the syringe food and gut stimulant (I think that's what your cisapride is) to try and help everything keep moving along. It might be a good opportunity for you vet to have a good examination of him while he's under GA for the teeth to see if there are any lumps or swellings in the abdomen or throat. You are doing so well to keep him going at this stage, you are giving him every chance. Good luck for tomorrow x
[/QUOTE]
 

Attachments

  • 6092AF07-CC55-4D30-B314-9CD3E7707C3B.webp
    6092AF07-CC55-4D30-B314-9CD3E7707C3B.webp
    44.4 KB · Views: 7
He is a beautiful boy 💕
The prospect of the general anaesthetic is difficult at any age but we do get nervous for our older pigs. However, once he's under he's under and he won't know any more about it. I had an op myself earlier this year and was a bag of nerves beforehand but once they put me out I didn't know anything at all until I came round and at that point I'd had so much local anaesthetic I wasn't sure the procedure had actually happened.

If I'm working out the time correctly it's late evening there and your last night feeding through until the 30th. It's early morning on the 30th here as the world slowly turns. You're nearly there. Hopefully it's just going to be something simple like a couple of molar spurs that they'll file down when they sort his teeth out. But if it's anything more complex or more serious these next night time hours together will become very precious in your memory so be present with him and be peaceful. I'll be thinking and praying for you both x
 
Thank you so much for your help! We are back from Vet and he said his incisors were way too long… so he cut them. I don’t understand how that created so much pain for him, but he said it did and that he should start eating in a day or two. He said to stop all pain meds as well.
I tried to give him tiny pieces of veggies and tried to slide dill in his mouth but he couldn’t chew and spat it out.
He said the molars look fine as well.
Why can’t he eat if his teeth are good now? Is he scared?
I’ll have to see how it goes… he goes back in three weeks

He is a beautiful boy 💕
The prospect of the general anaesthetic is difficult at any age but we do get nervous for our older pigs. However, once he's under he's under and he won't know any more about it. I had an op myself earlier this year and was a bag of nerves beforehand but once they put me out I didn't know anything at all until I came round and at that point I'd had so much local anaesthetic I wasn't sure the procedure had actually happened.

If I'm working out the time correctly it's late evening there and your last night feeding through until the 30th. It's early morning on the 30th here as the world slowly turns. You're nearly there. Hopefully it's just going to be something simple like a couple of molar spurs that they'll file down when they sort his teeth out. But if it's anything more complex or more serious these next night time hours together will become very precious in your memory so be present with him and be peaceful. I'll be thinking and praying for you both x
 
Having incisors 'cut' can be done 2 ways as far as I know: burring (with something like a little dremel tool and a very solid pair of hands to restrain that pig!) or clipping. Clipping actually isn't ideal as the pressure can cause splitting of the teeth but that's not inevitable - it's just something to watch out for if you got clipped and lots of vets still use this for pigs and rabbits too. Both methods can be done rather too short (so food slips back out of the mouth or they struggle to pick things up) but again that's not actually a massive problem as those teeth do grow very fast. Ivy got burred down after a few weeks - she looked very gummy and very cross as the vet had actually caught her lip which puffed up. A couple of days later her swelling was down and we were already seeing the teeth were longer. But Ivy's incisors were not bothering her originally - they just got too long when she stopped eating for other reasons.

Too-long incisors can impede chewing but I'm not sure about causing pain. When we've had a broken or infected incisor that has caused pain but when Ivy's got too long it was awkward and uncomfortable as she tried to chew but that was it. She chewed much faster after they were done, but it didn't cure her. There have been forum pigs missing one or even both (bottom) incisors that have managed well, but they do have to 're-learn' how to eat with their new mouth (for those reasons above) and confidence can be an issue initially. It sounds like your vet is thinking that the incisors were the obvious problem and your boy shouldn't therefore be in any pain and he'll get back on the horse - so to speak - when he realises he can. Long incisors are certainly an obvious thing to pick up on, but did that prevent him/her from looking a bit deeper? If they're right that's great - your issue is going to be if they're wrong and the overgrown incisors were, as in Ivy's case, just something inevitable when piggy is not biting and chewing independently for a while.

I'm assuming you didn't have a general anaesthetic then... so did the vet give him a good all over exam? Did they mention about the gut stasis or pain? Did they say if he'd lost any weight (has he?) or did they ask you about his weight? We can't tell you to go against vet instruction because it's against the forum regs and rightly so. What I can say is that personally in my 10 years of piggy keeping I've never seen metacam or loxicom interfere with appetite in a negative way (tho I have seen opioid painkiller prevent eating so I'm a bit wary of that). Pigs in pain eat less or stop eating - even if it's a general pain and not a specific mouth pain - then pain relief like metacam will encourage them to eat and keep their strength up. Even when my fat girl got bloat she got metacam as bloat is very uncomfortable and you'd think that digestive issues might warrant avoiding anything weird being put into the guts but no, vet said good old metacam will help her feel more comfortable and encourage eating the syringe food and it did. Old George is nearly 6 now, 1.3 kilo and on 0.3ml of 1.5mg/ml dog strength metacam twice a day for his arthritis, and has been for nearly 2 years and it has never affected his appetite as his weight shows. So I'm thinking the vet must have felt very secure in his diagnosis that pain relief would be irrelevant in a couple of days but I get the sense that you aren't so sure yourself because you've seen how your lovely boy has struggled. If he doesn't start eating while on metacam I can't see why he'd suddenly start if you stop giving it. Do you happen to have enough metacam left for more than the next couple of days...? :hmm:

You are in Vancouver, right, so presumably there are other veterinary options available...? I have to say that in your shoes I'd be thinking now about my options because until Truffle eats on his own - even if that's just a bowl of sloppy syringe food - you're still in life-support mode. If your vet felt that a follow-up was necessary to check that diagnosis was correct then frankly 3 weeks is a long time: 3 weeks of round the clock syringing is a big ask for both you and Truffle because that's where things would end up, wouldn't they. If they'd said "come back Friday" or "phone in if no change in a few days" I'd feel more confident. Right now I'd be feeling not so confident - but still prepared for a happy turnaround in Truffle's condition. If it was just his incisors he would start to improve as he realised he could eat without pain or discomfort. Maybe start with little pieces of soft cucumber middle as they can just be slurped up. If you offer bell pepper peel off the skin and offer tiny slivers at first. Soak some food pellets in water and offer those because they can also just be slurped up. Nothing too hard like carrot, or too tricky to handle like lettuce as they have to sort of origami it into their mouths. And keep up the syringing - you won't kill his appetite by support feeding him - if they feel well enough to eat independently they certainly will, no matter how much we feel we've stuffed into them.

Would I personally be phoning round other vets at this stage and trying to get an appointment for the end of the week? Trying to find a vet who is piggy savvy, or keeps their own pigs so you feel more confident about their piggy credentials? Or maybe contacting any local guinea-pig/small animal rescues and finding which vets they use - because they would be seeing pigs on a regular basis with a range of health problems. Well, I'm a belt-and-braces sort of gal, so I'd have to say I probably would...
 
Thank you so much for your feedback! His teeth are SO short… he is sad about it! I mean he cut too short! His pain however is improved since they were cut! The Vet tech said it hurts his whole mouth as he had discharge come out through his eyes. I stopped all medication as Vet said but am tempted to give a lower dose of metacam.
He is still not moving much, sitting facing the wall or hiding under hay… so I just don’t know! But he is eating his syringe food with a big open mouth! It’s so cute.
vet I saw is the best in Vancouver… the other best isn’t taking new patients and all the others don’t address dental… he did say to watch him and we will address it… he said molars were fine. And he offered a full x ray of his mouth as well …
As for veggies it’s as if he’s forgotten how to eat! I yes took skin off peppers cut in tiny pieces… cucumbers thin slices no skin, but he just smells it.
I’m glad though that his pain is reduced… I’m going to order his favourite pellets which are not so healthy… they go crazy for them … to see if it gives him confidence to eat.
But his teeth are way to short and you say they grow back in a few days so I hope as the Vet said in a few days he should be eating in his own.
Oh also he said he’s not having GI stasis now…. It passed… no bloat … He is pooping tiny poos .
I’d like more information on incisors too long causing tremendous pain though.. I was confused. Vet tech said it’s like a strained back all the muscles in the mouth are fatigued and aching and it creates pressure and pain so cutting the teeth frees the muscles.
Hopefully he can eat on his own soon! There’s no Guinea pigs rescue here either only rabbits 🫤
Thank you I appreciate your help it means a lot! 🙏🙏🙏🙏🙏🐹

Having incisors 'cut' can be done 2 ways as far as I know: burring (with something like a little dremel tool and a very solid pair of hands to restrain that pig!) or clipping. Clipping actually isn't ideal as the pressure can cause splitting of the teeth but that's not inevitable - it's just something to watch out for if you got clipped and lots of vets still use this for pigs and rabbits too. Both methods can be done rather too short (so food slips back out of the mouth or they struggle to pick things up) but again that's not actually a massive problem as those teeth do grow very fast. Ivy got burred down after a few weeks - she looked very gummy and very cross as the vet had actually caught her lip which puffed up. A couple of days later her swelling was down and we were already seeing the teeth were longer. But Ivy's incisors were not bothering her originally - they just got too long when she stopped eating for other reasons.

Too-long incisors can impede chewing but I'm not sure about causing pain. When we've had a broken or infected incisor that has caused pain but when Ivy's got too long it was awkward and uncomfortable as she tried to chew but that was it. She chewed much faster after they were done, but it didn't cure her. There have been forum pigs missing one or even both (bottom) incisors that have managed well, but they do have to 're-learn' how to eat with their new mouth (for those reasons above) and confidence can be an issue initially. It sounds like your vet is thinking that the incisors were the obvious problem and your boy shouldn't therefore be in any pain and he'll get back on the horse - so to speak - when he realises he can. Long incisors are certainly an obvious thing to pick up on, but did that prevent him/her from looking a bit deeper? If they're right that's great - your issue is going to be if they're wrong and the overgrown incisors were, as in Ivy's case, just something inevitable when piggy is not biting and chewing independently for a while.

I'm assuming you didn't have a general anaesthetic then... so did the vet give him a good all over exam? Did they mention about the gut stasis or pain? Did they say if he'd lost any weight (has he?) or did they ask you about his weight? We can't tell you to go against vet instruction because it's against the forum regs and rightly so. What I can say is that personally in my 10 years of piggy keeping I've never seen metacam or loxicom interfere with appetite in a negative way (tho I have seen opioid painkiller prevent eating so I'm a bit wary of that). Pigs in pain eat less or stop eating - even if it's a general pain and not a specific mouth pain - then pain relief like metacam will encourage them to eat and keep their strength up. Even when my fat girl got bloat she got metacam as bloat is very uncomfortable and you'd think that digestive issues might warrant avoiding anything weird being put into the guts but no, vet said good old metacam will help her feel more comfortable and encourage eating the syringe food and it did. Old George is nearly 6 now, 1.3 kilo and on 0.3ml of 1.5mg/ml dog strength metacam twice a day for his arthritis, and has been for nearly 2 years and it has never affected his appetite as his weight shows. So I'm thinking the vet must have felt very secure in his diagnosis that pain relief would be irrelevant in a couple of days but I get the sense that you aren't so sure yourself because you've seen how your lovely boy has struggled. If he doesn't start eating while on metacam I can't see why he'd suddenly start if you stop giving it. Do you happen to have enough metacam left for more than the next couple of days...? :hmm:

You are in Vancouver, right, so presumably there are other veterinary options available...? I have to say that in your shoes I'd be thinking now about my options because until Truffle eats on his own - even if that's just a bowl of sloppy syringe food - you're still in life-support mode. If your vet felt that a follow-up was necessary to check that diagnosis was correct then frankly 3 weeks is a long time: 3 weeks of round the clock syringing is a big ask for both you and Truffle because that's where things would end up, wouldn't they. If they'd said "come back Friday" or "phone in if no change in a few days" I'd feel more confident. Right now I'd be feeling not so confident - but still prepared for a happy turnaround in Truffle's condition. If it was just his incisors he would start to improve as he realised he could eat without pain or discomfort. Maybe start with little pieces of soft cucumber middle as they can just be slurped up. If you offer bell pepper peel off the skin and offer tiny slivers at first. Soak some food pellets in water and offer those because they can also just be slurped up. Nothing too hard like carrot, or too tricky to handle like lettuce as they have to sort of origami it into their mouths. And keep up the syringing - you won't kill his appetite by support feeding him - if they feel well enough to eat independently they certainly will, no matter how much we feel we've stuffed into them.

Would I personally be phoning round other vets at this stage and trying to get an appointment for the end of the week? Trying to find a vet who is piggy savvy, or keeps their own pigs so you feel more confident about their piggy credentials? Or maybe contacting any local guinea-pig/small animal rescues and finding which vets they use - because they would be seeing pigs on a regular basis with a range of health problems. Well, I'm a belt-and-braces sort of gal, so I'd have to say I probably would...
 
I've seen tales before about piggies being taken into rescue with front teeth so long the mouth is propped open and when they were trimmed the mouth couldn't close properly because the jaw had gone slack! But how on earth they survived until that point I can't imagine. I've even heard that for the worst cases tiny chin-slings help them to chew again... but I wouldn't be trying that because he won't be happy. It's brilliant he's going at the syringe food again - he can obvs chew something. Can he eat it from a bowl or plate overnight so you can get some rest? Keep up daily weighing so you can monitor gains or losses to get the best idea about how he's doing overall. If he's not eating anything else you ideally want him to eat enough that his poops return to normal and he maintains weight, even if he can't regain any lost weight at first.

When Zara couldn't chew with her tender incisor I cut a chunk of cucumber into 4 and scooped out just the seedy middle bit and chopped it into lumps about the size of the tip of my little finger. She slurped them up and I could see her having a little chew before she swallowed... but the thin slices she couldn't manipulate properly as it hurt the front tooth. The other thing that worked funnily enough was celery, which I did a thin slice but then cut that half-moon into 3. It seemed big enough to slurp in and have a chew without trying to manipulate it too much. This wasn't anywhere near enough to fuel her gut and keep her pooping but it did seem to give her confidence that there was a way back from her difficulties. After all, left to nature a pig in this situation without help wouldn't last long. Anything flat and leafy she just couldn't manage at all.

You're doing a great job for him. I know what you mean about the sad look - after all their teeth are everything to them and they are so helpless without their best tools and weapons. Ivy looked very down once she got over looking very cross but she did pick up over the next few days. I kept up with her metacam though - in part because of the sore lip but mainly because I was trying to cover all the bases - and I tried to be especially gentle and soothing so she wouldn't get frightened or worried again. If only they could tell us what's wrong 💕
 
Thank you yes I grated carrot minced dill and softened his pellets and hand fed him and he loved it … but still not eating and still in pain. I tried tiny matchstick s but he spits out or it falls out

Since he wants to eat and can’t it’s obvious that it’s something in his mouth. Vet will call tomorrow. X rays would be next . I also thought that he may have fractured his jaw because he crazy chews the bars. I put cardboard layers around the box but eats through it
… it must have happened while I was sleeping.

Still feeding through the night as well. His teeth I hope grow asap he is drooling a lot. Oh it’s heartbreaking…. I love when he puts his little paw on my hand to tell me he’s had enough food! So priceless!🐹❤️




I've seen tales before about piggies being taken into rescue with front teeth so long the mouth is propped open and when they were trimmed the mouth couldn't close properly because the jaw had gone slack! But how on earth they survived until that point I can't imagine. I've even heard that for the worst cases tiny chin-slings help them to chew again... but I wouldn't be trying that because he won't be happy. It's brilliant he's going at the syringe food again - he can obvs chew something. Can he eat it from a bowl or plate overnight so you can get some rest? Keep up daily weighing so you can monitor gains or losses to get the best idea about how he's doing overall. If he's not eating anything else you ideally want him to eat enough that his poops return to normal and he maintains weight, even if he can't regain any lost weight at first.

When Zara couldn't chew with her tender incisor I cut a chunk of cucumber into 4 and scooped out just the seedy middle bit and chopped it into lumps about the size of the tip of my little finger. She slurped them up and I could see her having a little chew before she swallowed... but the thin slices she couldn't manipulate properly as it hurt the front tooth. The other thing that worked funnily enough was celery, which I did a thin slice but then cut that half-moon into 3. It seemed big enough to slurp in and have a chew without trying to manipulate it too much. This wasn't anywhere near enough to fuel her gut and keep her pooping but it did seem to give her confidence that there was a way back from her difficulties. After all, left to nature a pig in this situation without help wouldn't last long. Anything flat and leafy she just couldn't manage at all.

You're doing a great job for him. I know what you mean about the sad look - after all their teeth are everything to them and they are so helpless without their best tools and weapons. Ivy looked very down once she got over looking very cross but she did pick up over the next few days. I kept up with her metacam though - in part because of the sore lip but mainly because I was trying to cover all the bases - and I tried to be especially gentle and soothing so she wouldn't get frightened or worried again. If only they could tell us what's wrong 💕
 
Unfortunately Truffle isn’t better. Vet is doing anesthesia dental and x rays tomorrow morning. He said otherwise euthanized him . So I’m a mess. Just breaking my heart ❤️‍🩹🐹❤️

I've seen tales before about piggies being taken into rescue with front teeth so long the mouth is propped open and when they were trimmed the mouth couldn't close properly because the jaw had gone slack! But how on earth they survived until that point I can't imagine. I've even heard that for the worst cases tiny chin-slings help them to chew again... but I wouldn't be trying that because he won't be happy. It's brilliant he's going at the syringe food again - he can obvs chew something. Can he eat it from a bowl or plate overnight so you can get some rest? Keep up daily weighing so you can monitor gains or losses to get the best idea about how he's doing overall. If he's not eating anything else you ideally want him to eat enough that his poops return to normal and he maintains weight, even if he can't regain any lost weight at first.

When Zara couldn't chew with her tender incisor I cut a chunk of cucumber into 4 and scooped out just the seedy middle bit and chopped it into lumps about the size of the tip of my little finger. She slurped them up and I could see her having a little chew before she swallowed... but the thin slices she couldn't manipulate properly as it hurt the front tooth. The other thing that worked funnily enough was celery, which I did a thin slice but then cut that half-moon into 3. It seemed big enough to slurp in and have a chew without trying to manipulate it too much. This wasn't anywhere near enough to fuel her gut and keep her pooping but it did seem to give her confidence that there was a way back from her difficulties. After all, left to nature a pig in this situation without help wouldn't last long. Anything flat and leafy she just couldn't manage at all.

You're doing a great job for him. I know what you mean about the sad look - after all their teeth are everything to them and they are so helpless without their best tools and weapons. Ivy looked very down once she got over looking very cross but she did pick up over the next few days. I kept up with her metacam though - in part because of the sore lip but mainly because I was trying to cover all the bases - and I tried to be especially gentle and soothing so she wouldn't get frightened or worried again. If only they could tell us what's wrong 💕
 
Back
Top