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Dental concerns....

AbbieMiddleton

AbbieMiddleton

Junior Guinea Pig
Joined
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Location
Hucknall, Nottingham.
Good afternoon,

I feel dreadful having to come on here asking for advice again but I don't know where else to turn...

My sow, Floof, started having difficulty chewing and slight weight loss about 10 days ago. We took her to our exotics specialist who suspected dental issues but he couldn't find anything under GA. He did find an ovarian cyst which he drained on the spot. (Unrelated, I know, but was suspected to be causing appetite loss.) She could eat hay, pellets and vegetables if they were cut into strips. She was still very active and happy. We were advised to give her Metacam and monitor the situation.

Fast forward a few days of no improvement. We took her to a different vet for a second opinion because I was certain it was definitely dental related. The second vet found her left front incisor to be showing signs of discolouration, probably a root infection. Tenderness and pain response on her right back molar too, most likely an abscess. Uneven teeth wear because of those two issues. Her teeth were corrected during that appointment (Thursday) and we've been told she needs to eat hay etc to help her teeth get back to normal. Except, she can't... Since the appointment she will not eat pellets. She barely touches hay. She'll eat some grass but, again, very little. She can eat small bits of cucumber or lettuce if I hold it very still. Most disturbingly, she can no longer walk properly. Taking her out of the pet carrier after the appointment terrified me. She just fell over. Genuinely struggling to walk. Her movement has improved over the last few days, she can "bunny run"/hop at full speed but walking looks wobbly. I'm feeding her critical care at regular intervals to maintain her weight and giving her .25ml Loxicom (dog strength) and .3ml of an antibiotic twice a day. We've been told to go back for a check up in two weeks to see if the abscess needs surgery and to see how her teeth are doing.

My main problem at the moment is feeding her. I'm concerned that if I'm force feeding her Critical Care (and I am having to really force her) won't this impact her appetite for hay and pellets, meaning she won't be maintaining her teeth and realigning them? But, she can't eat properly anyway because she has issues/infections/abscesses with both her front and back teeth... I feel like I'm going in circles. Can anyone help me understand this please? She's been on the antibiotics since Friday evening (the vet suggested leaving it until the next day because of the state Floof was in on Thursday night) so, in a few days, will her teeth hurt less from infection and enable her to eat on her own? I'm just at a loss.

(She's about 4 years old and between 910g and 950g on average.)

Thank you for taking the time to read this.
 
I’m sorry to hear this.

Syringe feeding does not impact their appetite for independently eating hay - if a piggy can eat sufficient hay, then they will and will refuse the syringe feeds. (Pellets are not important enough in the diet and don’t wear teeth so even eating them won’t be enough if she isn’t eating hay).
You will need to syringe feed enough to keep her weight stable while she is not able to eat hay for herself.

What antibiotic is she on? Baytril for example can often not be enough to deal with abscesses.
I personally would not want to leave her for two weeks and would rather be back at the vet sooner if there is no improvement in a couple of days.
 
Hi, I am very sorry that your girl is poorly 😞 what antibiotic is she on?

Is there any chance you can get to Northamton? Simon and Kim Maddock at the cat and rabbit care clinic in Northamton are the go to vets for anything teeth related. They carry out dentals consciously so no need for an anaesthetic

You’re right that the longer they don’t eat hay, the worse their molars will get but this could take several weeks so please continue with the critical care to maintain her weight

I’d want to see a vet sooner than two weeks especially if she can’t walk properly
 
I agree, if you can get to see Simon or Kim they are the go to vets for anything dental related. You will get a proper assessment of Fluffs teeth and jaw etc and any dental work will be done there and then. They are really great at treating abscesses and other pain related issues

They do conscious dentistry which does not involve General anaesthetic which is much safer too
 
Thanks for the replies, I appreciate your time. The antibiotic is Zithromax. I've never been prescribed it before and I've been told to monitor Floof because it can have negative consequences. The second vet visit was a conscious dental at Northlands Veterinary Group Cat and Rabbit Care Clinic. Floof saw Kim and Simon. I think it was Kim who sent us advice over the phone when we called in a panic upon seeing Floof falling over when removed from the pet carrier. I'm just going a bit mad seeing no improvements and having to force feed her. I know it's essential to maintain her weight but it feels counterproductive if it's stopping her eating hay etc because she's never had a huge appetite. We've always called her our "Baby Bird" because she's so petite compared to our 1.5kg boar and 1.3kg Teddy sow.

Could her wobbly walking be because in the space of 10 days she's had GA, a cyst drain, dental work, molar abscess, incisor infection and a 3 hour car journey? 🥲
Are the antibiotics likely to take hold and improve something soon? I just don't really have a route map of expectations and I'm clutching at straws because I'm exhausted and stressed. Hundreds of pounds down and seeing her worse off makes me feel like I'm making all the wrong decisions.
 
Just to add, I am maintaining her weight at between 910g and 930g using around 60ml of Critical Care during 24 hours, any vegetables she'll attempt, small piles of grass and mushed up pellets. Probiotic water is also being syringed in .5ml to 1ml doses during feeding time.
 
Gosh poor girl has been through such a lot over the last few weeks. I cannot say if it’s all this that is making her wobble or not. I think I would be inclined to ring Kim or Simon and see what they say. Dental problems are the worst in my opinion, it’s a never ending circle of ups and downs. I assume the AB’s are for a brewing abscess. Do hang in there, you are doing everything right, she’s getting a good amount of Critical Care and maintaining her weight.

There are quite a few piggies that have had great success with Zithromax that has cured their abscesse

@furryfriends (TEAS)

@weepweeps
 
Bill & Ted said:
Gosh poor girl has been through such a lot over the last few weeks. I cannot say if it’s all this that is making her wobble or not. I think I would be inclined to ring Kim or Simon and see what they say. Dental problems are the worst in my opinion, it’s a never ending circle of ups and downs. I assume the AB’s are for a brewing abscess. Do hang in there, you are doing everything right, she’s getting a good amount of Critical Care and maintaining her weight.

There are quite a few piggies that have had great success with Zithromax that has cured their abscesse

@furryfriends (TEAS)

@weepweeps
Click to expand...

Thank you, I'll just keep doing what I'm doing and hoping for improvements. We did ring the vet immediately when Floof couldn't even stand but since then she has regained the ability to stand/bunny run. After watching her for a few minutes right now, I'm wondering if it's a pronounced limp instead of a wobble. (I had a sow with kidney failure a year or so ago and a wobby piggy always sets off my panic mode. ) I think the limp is possibly on the front right arm, the side where the abscess is suspected to be. My concern here is if this limp has manifested due to trauma, infections or the deep abscess, is taking her to the vet again this week the right thing when she's already on Loxicom and Zithromax and having been through so much? Are there any signs I can look for to spot a break or dislocation? Our Teddy sow had a sprain last year which was resolved using Metacam.

The AB is indeed for the back tooth abscess. It's so small they can't take action to find it, which is why the two week wait is necessary. Has there been cases where Zithromax has cured a small abscess without surgical intervention!?

Does anyone know if Kim/Simon will charge a full consultation fee if we call them tomorrow for a follow-up over the phone and to ask about her limping since the conscious dental?
 
TEAS is a sanctuary for guinea pigs with ongoing health issues, primarily dental, and I have used zithromax on many occasions, to deal with abscesses. A small abscess may resolve without the need for surgery, but it isn't immediately obvious which way it will go. I have had great success, on most occasions, with zithromax so hopefully you will start to see some improvement soon.

If you would like a chat, on the phone, tomorrow, let me know and I will send you my number?

I also offer boarding for guinea pigs belonging to long distance clients of the Cat and Rabbit Care Clinic, through my pet care business, Little Badger's Pet Care.

Ring the practice in the morning and ask if a consultation fee would be charged to discuss how things are going, with Simon/Kim.
 
AbbieMiddleton said:
Thank you, I'll just keep doing what I'm doing and hoping for improvements. We did ring the vet immediately when Floof couldn't even stand but since then she has regained the ability to stand/bunny run. After watching her for a few minutes right now, I'm wondering if it's a pronounced limp instead of a wobble. (I had a sow with kidney failure a year or so ago and a wobby piggy always sets off my panic mode. ) I think the limp is possibly on the front right arm, the side where the abscess is suspected to be. My concern here is if this limp has manifested due to trauma, infections or the deep abscess, is taking her to the vet again this week the right thing when she's already on Loxicom and Zithromax and having been through so much? Are there any signs I can look for to spot a break or dislocation? Our Teddy sow had a sprain last year which was resolved using Metacam.

The AB is indeed for the back tooth abscess. It's so small they can't take action to find it, which is why the two week wait is necessary. Has there been cases where Zithromax has cured a small abscess without surgical intervention!?

Does anyone know if Kim/Simon will charge a full consultation fee if we call them tomorrow for a follow-up over the phone and to ask about her limping since the conscious dental?
Click to expand...
I will leave you with @furryfriends (TEAS) as I personally have no experience of abscesses only dental spurs and misaligned incisors, she is “the abscess queen” and is very experienced with all dental issues including abscesses but wishing you and your little piggie all the very best I hope she will be better soon 🤞
 
Thank you, everyone. I feel like I have a bit more clarity now. I just want the best for my lil' Floof. I'll keep hand feeding her and try to get some feedback regarding her mobility if nothing improves over the next day or so.

Thank you, @furryfriends (TEAS) - If I have any more questions about abscesses I'll pop over a message and we could chat over the phone. I appreciate the offer. At the moment I'm just going to keep up with the medications and feeding.
 
Just a quick update for anyone following this thread.

I've maintained Floof's weight over the last 11 days. I actually managed to help her go from 910g to 1009g and she's now stabilised at around 975g to 1kg. I've slowly reduced syringe feeds to zero: The first ones I dropped were the night feeds for my own sanity! 😅

After a full week on Zithromax and Loxicom, a switch flicked and she started eating completely unaided. You wouldn't even know there's an issue. She's even back to chewing wooden objects. We decided to monitor her limp because she has been showing daily improvements with her mobility and is already on painkillers. She's booked in this Thursday for a dental check up, very early in the morning, incase she requires surgery to remove the dental abscess. Her limp will also be fully investigated at this time if it hasn't resolved. Our reasoning is if she needed GA to check it out, we may not have been able to go ahead with the abscess removal if it's required because both procedures/investigations would end up being very close together and appointments are also scarce.

Fingers crossed for Thursday! So far, she's probably cost us the same amount of £ as a small holiday, but that's OK. I didn't want to go anywhere anyway. 🤣
 
Not the best news today, unfortunately.

While Floof's teeth seem to be correcting their alignment and she's eating enough to have gained weight, the abscess hasn't resolved and is going to be lanced. I'm finding that really surprising and frustrating because I was under the impression it would be completely removed so that it couldn't reoccur, which is why we waited two weeks for it to get larger. As it stands, it'll probably reoccur and need regular draining under GA for the foreseeable. (We've been told reoccurrence rate is common/high.)

As for her arm, it could be a shoulder fracture which, generally speaking, can't be treated because of her small bones. So we just need to manage the pain and allow it to fuse into a new, unnatural position. We're getting an Xray done to confirm the damage while she's under GA for the abscess draining. I literally can't fathom how she fractured her arm while immobile in a pet carrier.

I'm feeling very defeated. We've spent nearly £1000 so far with no proper resolution in sight. On-going draining will cost in the region of £150/£250 a session until we decide to... not be able to afford the continuation. I can't even write what that means. It's breaking me.
 
When abscesses are in that area, it is impossible to completely remove the capsule! However, they can resolve completely with marsupialisation and daily flushing, in addition to a strong antibiotic. I’ve treated many abscesses, with almost all resolving completely, using this method.
 
Thank you for the information. I misunderstood at the last appointment. I just had it in my head that it was too small to find and deal with so, as per instructions, we waited for it to grow. Because my Guineas in the past always had them fully removed, from other locations, I just assumed it was going to be the same situation after it got larger. I should have asked for more information. I feel like an idiot but very willing to do everything within my power to help her resolve it. I've had to clean out cysts and things before on an older sow, so I'm hoping it'll be similar. Although the cysts were generally on the body/rump and were easy to reach. I better get researching.... I want this nasty thing GONE so I can have my baby back.

If you have a missed call ending 103, it was me in a panic. 😅 @furryfriends (TEAS)
Thank you for giving me some hope by saying you've managed to resolve most of the ones you've dealt with. I really want Floof to be in that bracket.
 
Hello. Sorry I’ve missed this thread. I have been away on holiday. I have had a piggy with a massive tooth root abscess. It was 4cm and had 20ml of gunk removed my Simon. This was last August. It has not returned. It was stitched open and I flushed it three times a day for two weeks. He didn’t need any further operations. He did lose his bottom incisor but he has put back on 200g of the 400g he lost.

Good luck.

His thread is here if you’d like to have a read. It’s full of very helpful tips from everyone on here. I thought Pepper would never get better and eat on his own again. But slowly , slowly he got there. I also spent about £1,000 on him.

Dental? Pepper is off to the vets tomorrow
 
Thank you @furryfriends (TEAS), I appreciate your time just now on the phone!

For anyone following...

Strange turn of events. Simon couldn't find any pus in order to drain the abscess, so we're going to continue with antibiotics instead. Not entirely sure what the jaw tenderness could be other than a small infection, but it's back to monitoring and administering medication.
The x-ray, however, showed her right arm is dislocated and we're going to manage it with pain relief in the hope it'll gradually reposition itself correctly or she'll just adapt. Her left arm, which we didn't even know had a problem, has unusual bone growth which looks a bit beyond arthritis and perhaps a very old injury. (She is a rescue, so I don't know how to find out.) Her mobility and quality of life is still high. She's chasing and mounting other pigs, running around the house when she wants to, barging into little huts and turfing other pigs out, throwing herself around in piles of hay....

So we're just going to do what we can.
 
weepweeps said:
Hello. Sorry I’ve missed this thread. I have been away on holiday. I have had a piggy with a massive tooth root abscess. It was 4cm and had 20ml of gunk removed my Simon. This was last August. It has not returned. It was stitched open and I flushed it three times a day for two weeks. He didn’t need any further operations. He did lose his bottom incisor but he has put back on 200g of the 400g he lost.

Good luck.

His thread is here if you’d like to have a read. It’s full of very helpful tips from everyone on here. I thought Pepper would never get better and eat on his own again. But slowly , slowly he got there. I also spent about £1,000 on him.

Dental? Pepper is off to the vets tomorrow
Click to expand...
Thank you! I'll give it a read!
If this abscess/infection does begin to manifest in a more noticeable way, the tips will be very useful to me.
I'm so pleased Pepper pulled through for you!
 
Just a quick update for anyone following and for those people (like myself) who often search Google for help with Guinea related things and want as much information as possible!

Floof had her final check up today. A month since the issues started. The back tooth dental root abscess has resolved medically and without the need for surgical intervention. As has the front tooth infection. Thank you, Zithromax! It's been hard on her stomach but nothing some probiotics and critical care couldn't fix. Her eating is fully back to normal and her teeth are fine. They're back to being maintained adequately via hay chewing and shouldn't be needing further dental work, although we will follow up in three months as a precaution. Her weight is fine. Settled at around 970g to 1kg. Her mobility has also improved dramatically, despite one front arm being dislocated and the other one showing strange bone formation, you wouldn't actually know anything is wrong as she's fully adapted. We're administering life-long pain relief, just in case. (Dog strength Loxicom and a small dose of Tramadol on a daily basis.)

I also just wanted to say thank you to everyone for your patience, support, understanding and well wishes. Floof and I really appreciate it.
 
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