Critical Care

[Julieo]

Hello,

I'm wondering if any of you can give me some advice please and if so I'm extremely grateful in advance.

This is my first encounter with guinea pigs and I have learnt a lot already from YouTube and reading but I would really like some advice from someone with hands on experience, if anyone has any of this particular situation.

Backstory: A friend bought two 'female' Guine Pigs' which gave birth to three babies but unfortunately the mother died at birth. I took the litter on and started hand rearing them. One passed away at 7 Days, the second one passed away at 6 weeks. This was after two vets trips and me interviewing with critical care for two days.

On my second visit, or controll, the vet advised that as she was eating again to stop the critical care treatment, she also advised that I should stop giving her the formula - replacement mothers milk. I did and she passed away 24hrs later. The first time I had the warning of seeing the poos chained together but the second time it was much, much faster.

So to my third remaining Piggie.... I noticed the same symptoms, not eating, puffed up and sat still, chaining poo's but fortunately only one or two so I treated with critical care and fiberplex as instructed by the vet. When she started eating again, I stopped. (I live in rural France and my NAC - exotic specialist here, had no Idea what the chain poo's were, I'm not confident in her advice unfortunately).

Now to the real thing I hope you can advise me with; each time I stop the treatment because she seems to be eating again, (her poo's are looking healthy and she is in fine fettle.... popping & Zooming, tapping on her dish for more formula) Then things start to deteriorate.

What can I do? Do I carry on with the treatment (which is basically force feeding Fiberplex three times a day and Critical Care four times a day plus syringing water and she is still also very much wanting formula.

I guess my question is, exactly, should I be doing Critical Care a few days after she seems to be better to get her completely over this or is it always going to be the same scenario ?

Any and all advice gratefully received, I just want this beautiful little girl to make it....

Julie

 

[Siikibam]

I’m sorry that you lost the other two pups. You are doing a great job with the little one. I would consider continuing with the syringe feeding. How old is she? If she is over 6 weeks then she may not need formula anymore. They’re usually weaned around 3 weeks I believe (don’t quite me!). Is she eating hay by herself as well as some veg and pellets?

Have a read of the guide I’ve linked to below. All of it is useful but the 3rd section may be more useful (assuming she’s over 3 weeks of age). Someone with more experience will be along in good time once they see the thread. They’ll be able to give you more information and support. I hope your little one pulls through.

https://www.theguineapigforum.co.uk...pport-feeding-orphans-and-tiny-babies.159468/

 

[Wiebke]

Hello,

I'm wondering if any of you can give me some advice please and if so I'm extremely grateful in advance.

This is my first encounter with guinea pigs and I have learnt a lot already from YouTube and reading but I would really like some advice from someone with hands on experience, if anyone has any of this particular situation.

Backstory: A friend bought two 'female' Guine Pigs' which gave birth to three babies but unfortunately the mother died at birth. I took the litter on and started hand rearing them. One passed away at 7 Days, the second one passed away at 6 weeks. This was after two vets trips and me interviewing with critical care for two days.

On my second visit, or controll, the vet advised that as she was eating again to stop the critical care treatment, she also advised that I should stop giving her the formula - replacement mothers milk. I did and she passed away 24hrs later. The first time I had the warning of seeing the poos chained together but the second time it was much, much faster.

So to my third remaining Piggie.... I noticed the same symptoms, not eating, puffed up and sat still, chaining poo's but fortunately only one or two so I treated with critical care and fiberplex as instructed by the vet. When she started eating again, I stopped. (I live in rural France and my NAC - exotic specialist here, had no Idea what the chain poo's were, I'm not confident in her advice unfortunately).

Now to the real thing I hope you can advise me with; each time I stop the treatment because she seems to be eating again, (her poo's are looking healthy and she is in fine fettle.... popping & Zooming, tapping on her dish for more formula) Then things start to deteriorate.

What can I do? Do I carry on with the treatment (which is basically force feeding Fiberplex three times a day and Critical Care four times a day plus syringing water and she is still also very much wanting formula.

I guess my question is, exactly, should I be doing Critical Care a few days after she seems to be better to get her completely over this or is it always going to be the same scenario ?

Any and all advice gratefully received, I just want this beautiful little girl to make it....

Julie

Hi and welcome

I am very sorry that you are finding yourself in such a heart-breaking situation.

Please continue with the feeding support until your baby is healthy and able to support itself in additions. You cannot just withdraw it and force them to eat on their own; this does not work for piggies who rely on a constant food supply,
Please be aware that babies with mothers get traces of the various feeds she eats via the milk and then by nibbling little amounts, so they can slowly develop their own digestive gut microbiome.
In orphans you have to gradually introduce your babies to very small amounts and cannot feed them fully straight away without causing a major tummy upset. Also keep in mind that about three quarters of what a guinea pig needs to eat in a day should be hay.
You monitor the food intake by daily weighing on your kitchen scales.

Here is lots more helpful how-to information:
Hand-rearing-and-support-feeding-orphans-and-tiny-babies
All About Syringe Feeding and Medicating Guinea Pigs with Videos and Pictures

Journey through a Lifetime: The Ages of Guinea Pigs (the first two chapters deal with baby development until weaning)

Our information collection for baby care: Surprise-babies-care-and-information-collection-incl-help-with-any-dads

Long Term Balanced General And Special Needs Guinea Pig Diets

Getting Started - Essential Information for New Owners (please bookmark as you will find it very helpful)

All the best! Please be aware that bringing up orphans is not at all easy because they are very fragile and do lack the initial immune system boost from their mother's first milk (colostrum). Even with the best of care, babies can suddenly die very quickly.

 

[Julieo]

Hi and welcome

I am very sorry that you are finding yourself in such a heart-breaking situation.

Please continue with the feeding support until your baby is healthy and able to support itself in additions. You cannot just withdraw it and force them to eat on their own; this does not work for piggies who rely on a constant food supply,
Please be aware that babies with mothers get traces of the various feeds she eats via the milk and then by nibbling little amounts, so they can slowly develop their own digestive gut microbiome.
In orphans you have to gradually introduce your babies to very small amounts and cannot feed them fully straight away without causing a major tummy upset. Also keep in mind that about three quarters of what a guinea pig needs to eat in a day should be hay.
You monitor the food intake by daily weighing on your kitchen scales.

Here is lots more helpful how-to information:
Hand-rearing-and-support-feeding-orphans-and-tiny-babies
All About Syringe Feeding and Medicating Guinea Pigs with Videos and Pictures

Journey through a Lifetime: The Ages of Guinea Pigs (the first two chapters deal with baby development until weaning)

Our information collection for baby care: Surprise-babies-care-and-information-collection-incl-help-with-any-dads

Long Term Balanced General And Special Needs Guinea Pig Diets

Getting Started - Essential Information for New Owners (please bookmark as you will find it very helpful)

All the best! Please be aware that bringing up orphans is not at all easy because they are very fragile and do lack the initial immune system boost from their mother's first milk (colostrum). Even with the best of care, babies can suddenly die very quickly.

Thank you for this, It is as I thought.. I think her tummy lacks the microbiome to eat what she should be eating on her own and without the support of the formula it's not enough. She will be eight weeks on Monday and I can't see me being able to drop the milk yet!

Do you think trying to introduce another piggies poop, via poop soup would help her?

When I feed her the critical care she goes absolutely crazy for food and I'm not sure that is doing her any good either, It's about finding the balance to wean her I think.

I'll have a look at the articles, thank you..

She's not interested in eating again this morning, it just feels like a continuous cycle

 

[Julieo]

I’m sorry that you lost the other two pups. You are doing a great job with the little one. I would consider continuing with the syringe feeding. How old is she? If she is over 6 weeks then she may not need formula anymore. They’re usually weaned around 3 weeks I believe (don’t quite me!). Is she eating hay by herself as well as some veg and pellets?

Have a read of the guide I’ve linked to below. All of it is useful but the 3rd section may be more useful (assuming she’s over 3 weeks of age). Someone with more experience will be along in good time once they see the thread. They’ll be able to give you more information and support. I hope your little one pulls through.

https://www.theguineapigforum.co.uk...pport-feeding-orphans-and-tiny-babies.159468/

Thank you very much for this.

She will be eight weeks on Monday.

She can actually lap the milk, I put it in a little bowl for her.

Its the critical care and fiberplex I have been syringing. I just gave her one of each last night to see her through the night as it always seems to be the morning, some mornings, where she has lost her appetite.

Not even looking at a wheatgrass this morning, not nibbling hay either so I guess I will have to give her critical care to get her going for the day.

I'll read all I can, thank you agsin

 

[Wiebke]

Thank you for this, It is as I thought.. I think her tummy lacks the microbiome to eat what she should be eating on her own and without the support of the formula it's not enough. She will be eight weeks on Monday and I can't see me being able to drop the milk yet!

Do you think trying to introduce another piggies poop, via poop soup would help her?

When I feed her the critical care she goes absolutely crazy for food and I'm not sure that is doing her any good either, It's about finding the balance to wean her I think.

I'll have a look at the articles, thank you..

She's not interested in eating again this morning, it just feels like a continuous cycle

PLEASE drop the milk asap and just feed her Critical Care made up with water. At 8 weeks, she is LONG past weaning age now!
Guinea pigs are precocious and can survive on an adult diet from a few days old; the usual shift from relying mostly on milk and eating solids happens throughout the second week of the life; soon after, between 2-4 weeks, the gradual weaning process happens in which the mother increasingly discourages the babies from drinking milk.

Have you actually read the really important information links in my first post? From your remarks I'd expected her to be much younger and still at weaning age.
Do you have any sows you could feed her with so she can learn to eat veg by watching them eat it and gradually train her microbiome?
Babies learn from their elders what is safe to eat and what not by smelling their mouths and by snatching food from it; it makes the process much easier. They are also learning social behaviour. Is your baby getting that crucial early age socialisation?
Otherwise, you will have juice veg or include in the critical care for her learn the taste and start feeding her properly, with real veg once she knows the taste.

Here is more in-depth information about development. The first three chapters deal with newly borns, suckling babies and then the formative 'school' week between weaning and teenage - the latter is sadly lost and badly disrupted by the pet trade in babies. Journey through a Lifetime: The Ages of Guinea Pigs

 

[Julieo]

PLEASE drop the milk asap and just feed her Critical Care made up with water. At 8 weeks, she is LONG past weaning age now!
Guinea pigs are precocious and can survive on an adult diet from a few days old; the usual shift from relying mostly on milk and eating solids happens throughout the second week of the life; soon after, between 2-4 weeks, the gradual weaning process happens in which the mother increasingly discourages the babies from drinking milk.

Have you actually read the really important information links in my first post? From your remarks I'd expected her to be much younger and still at weaning age.
Do you have any sows you could feed her with so she can learn to eat veg by watching them eat it and gradually train her microbiome?
Babies learn from their elders what is safe to eat and what not by smelling their mouths and by snatching food from it; it makes the process much easier. They are also learning social behaviour. Is your baby getting that crucial early age socialisation?
Otherwise, you will have juice veg or include in the critical care for her learn the taste and start feeding her properly, with real veg once she knows the taste.

Here is more in-depth information about development. The first three chapters deal with newly borns, suckling babies and then the formative 'school' week between weaning and teenage - the latter is sadly lost and badly disrupted by the pet trade in babies. Journey through a Lifetime: The Ages of Guinea Pigs

I have read the links you sent, thank you.

I hadn't read them before I replied, I was just replying directly after reading.

They (this one and this little one that died just over a week ago) were doing really well with the weaning, trying lots of different veggies and fruit. Eating lots of hay and grass. Topping up on milk but I kind of leaned back on the milk a little when they got sick because I knew they would eat it. That is what I wanted to know, is it good or bad, helping her digestion or not. Thank you, No more milk.

No sows, no Guinea. pigs, I'm a complete guinea pig novice and never intended to keep them, I just wanted to give them a fighting chance.

I've reached out to a couple of rescues here in France, the Mum guinea pig wasn't mine.. I just intervened for a friend to give these little ones some sort of chance, now I realise why the vet looked at me with a raised eyebrow, its been a very delicate and timely procedure indeed. I took the Mum to the vets after visiting my friend and realising it wasn't afterbirth. (The Mum had pushed out her uterus and her intestines giving birth)

My friend had no intensions of breeding Guinea Pigs, she was told she had bought two sows.

I know you are in the UK so not much you can do for us here in France but regardless, thank you for all the great advice and information.

 

[Louby]

Wow! What a tough start to learning about guinea pigs! I also wondered if you need an older guinea with her. Older sows can make great aunties. As well as teaching her how to be a guinea pig, their poop might be useful for your baby. You could try feeding her some of their poop, which would help her microbiome.

 

[Engel]

Wow you've been through a lot! I'm so sorry you've found yourself in this situation and thank you for giving them all a fighting chance. Hope this one makes it. Remember to weigh them daily. This way you'll be able to see if the little one is getting enough food in them. Still give the baby access to hay and try some pellets (only 1 tablespoon and you can soak them) to nibble on between feeds. Make sure the baby stays warm too. Keep us updated and keep up the good work, you're doing great!