Bonding boars. Lots of questions

[Inokillzombies]

Hi,

I have 4 guinea pigs (Blossom, Totoro, Bilbo and Ponyo).
Blossom, Totoro, and Bilbo are almost 6 months old. We don't know the age of Ponyo, but we know he is an adult and at least 1 year old.

At first, we had two guinea pigs that came from different places and that we had bonded, their names are Blossom and Totoro. Everything was fine at first but then they started fighting really bad, so we had to separate them. Totoro bit Blossom right on top of his eye and he had an eye infection, which we took care of with some medication that the vet prescribed. They were two dominant pigs and things just didn't work out between them.

Then we got two other guinea pig which were not together. Their names are Bilbo and Ponyo. We tried to bond Bilbo and Blossom and it did not work. Then we tried with Ponyo and another fail. Blossom is too aggressive and wants to be the dominant one. We tried Totoro and bilbo, it seemed to work at first but then things got heated. Same thing for Ponyo and Totoro, it seemed to work at first and then things got a little heated. So finally, its Ponyo and Bilbo who bonded together. I was happy we got at least one match, knowing how difficult bonding boars can be. Now we have a big cage that all connects but is separated for each boar and the bonded pair. Blossom lives alone next to Totoro. And Totoro lives alone next to the bonded pair. Totoro has been laying next to the bonded pair and chatting with them for the last few weeks and they seem to get along and enjoy each other's company.

Yesterday, we decided to let them play with each other a little, for like 10 minutes. We were rigth next to them in case something happened. I know 10 minutes isn't enough time to tell if they can be bonded, but Totoro was really calm, and it seemed like it could work as a trio. Totoro seems to get along well with Ponyo. However, he did snap at Bilbo twice. He did not hurt him, he just gave him a warning. Apart from that everything was fine, they were all laying next to each other.

Sould I try to bond them or not? I know having trios can be quite tricky. I don't want to risk breaking the bond of the other two by bringing a third pig in. So should I try making a trio with Ponyo, Bilbo and Totoro. Also, Bilbo is starting to be a little hormonal and getting into small fights with Ponyo. But nothing alarming that would lead to them separating. And I only saw this behavior yesterday. But just in case things do not work out between the two, should i just wait befor making any moves. Because if this happens, I know Ponyo and Totoro could maybe work together.

Or should I try reintroducing Blossom and Totoro once they are older and less hormonal?

Or should I try bonding my four males together? Is there any way I could make Blossom less aggressive towards the others? He is very sweet to humans but he seems to be too eager to be the dominant one with other pigs. He always display dominance behavior when he meets other pigs and he makes himself looks bigger by puffing his fur. I know bonding males can be quite tricky. I just want what is best for them. Should I just leave them as they are right now (which means Totoro and Blossom living alone next to each other and next to the bonding pair)?

Thanks for reading and for giving me advice. I really need it.

 

[Siikibam]

I would not risk trying for a trio. Mainly because trios with teens are almost always likely to fail. But also because you could risk the bond of the pair leading to four separated boars again.

Laying next to the divider is not an indicator of how they would get on. It can actually be territory marking behaviour.

I would leave them as they are. Of course we always want them to have a live in friend. But living as neighbours is the next best thing.

Lastly, I wouldn’t label Blossom as aggressive. He just didn’t get on with the piggies you decided to introduce him to. Dominance/top pig doesn’t equal aggressiveness.

If you want (and you have the space and funds etc), you could take the singles dating so they can pick their own friend. That’s the best way to find friends as they make the choice. When you take on guinea pigs from elsewhere, you have to bear in mind it may not work out. But it sounds like you’ve got them all nicely organised

PS I would not put the trio together again. Each meeting is a bonding time for them and can cause stress when it’s ‘interrupted’ (they go back to their separate cages).

 

[Piggies&buns]

I can only agree with Siikibam on all counts - leave them exactly as they are and don’t allow them together for short meetings (this can cause the bonded pair to fall out)
Both trios and quartets are likely to fail (in fact a quartet has pretty much a 0% chance of working).

You cannot make blossom ‘less aggressive’. He is simply not compatible with the other piggies and trying again when older will not produce a different outcome. If they are not compatible now, then they will not be compatible later.


Adding More Guinea Pigs Or Merging Pairs – What Works And What Not?

 

[Inokillzombies]

Thanks for the advice. Right now I don't have the place to have any more piggies. But later on, I will try to bring them with me so that they can pick their own friend. I asked at the rescue where I rescued Ponyo if I could bring one of my pigs to see if they would match, but they didn't want me to bring him because it could stress Ponyo. So I just took Ponyo home from the rescue without knowing if he would match with any of my piggies. So I was happy that he bonded with Bilbo. The other option is to neuteured the singles and put them with females later on. But I'm not sure if I should do it. I know there are some risk with neutering. For now I will leave them as they are. I wasn't sure if I could put them together for short meetings. But now that I know it's better not to, I won't do it anymore. And yeah Blossom doesn't seem to get along with the other pigs, it must just be because he haven't found his match yet. But since I separated Blossom and Totoro (which was a few months ago), they seem much happier alone.

 

[weepweeps]

I had four boars once who all lived separately. If you’ve managed to get a pair then don’t do anything to break their bond. Good luck.

 

[Piggies&buns]

Thanks for the advice. Right now I don't have the place to have any more piggies. But later on, I will try to bring them with me so that they can pick their own friend. I asked at the rescue where I rescued Ponyo if I could bring one of my pigs to see if they would match, but they didn't want me to bring him because it could stress Ponyo. So I just took Ponyo home from the rescue without knowing if he would match with any of my piggies. So I was happy that he bonded with Bilbo. The other option is to neuteured the singles and put them with females later on. But I'm not sure if I should do it. I know there are some risk with neutering. For now I will leave them as they are. I wasn't sure if I could put them together for short meetings. But now that I know it's better not to, I won't do it anymore. And yeah Blossom doesn't seem to get along with the other pigs, it must just be because he haven't found his match yet. But since I separated Blossom and Totoro (which was a few months ago), they seem much happier alone.

If you were to neuter and bond Blossom and Totoro with a lady friend each, then you would be advised to keep them in a separate room to Bilbo and Ponyo.
Ideally sows should not be put into a room where a bonded pair of boars lives. For Bilbo and Ponyo smelling any sows has the potential to cause them to fight with each other and therefore running the risk of their bond breaking.

A Comprehensive Guide to Guinea Pig Boars

 

[Inokillzombies]

Thanks! I didn't know I would have to put them in a different room. My sister has two females in the same room as her males. She bought two females and one of them was pregnant. She gave birth to three beautiful boys. Now the boys are 1 year old. They all live in the same room, but different cages. The males all lives in a 6x2 c&c cage and the female in two Midwest cages. Should I tell her to house the boars in a different room? The three brothers get along really well and they are really chill pigs. They never had any fights. But back to Totoro and Blossom, if I neuter them should I give them each one a single female or should I do herds of females for each males?

 

[Siikibam]

When boars grow up around sows, they generally do not have the same ‘reaction’ to their hormones and smells. But that isn’t to say it’s a possibility.

Did you consider trying your sister’s boars with your two singles? Or does she live separately to you?

It depends what they want and what you can manage in terms of finances (vet mainly) and housing space. I would say that rescue isn’t one you should return to for bonding. Simply because they didn’t want you to bring a boar to try with Ponyo.

Surgery always carries a risk but if the vet is experienced and has carried out many neutering operations, they will be able to reduce the risks.

 

[Inokillzombies]

I really wanted to rescue Ponyo. So even if he would not have bonded with one of my guinea pigs, I would have still kept him. But we were lucky and he bonded with Bilbo. I would never return a guinea pig. If I decide to keep him, it's for life. Somebody gave him up and he had knots in his hair and really long nails. I wanted to give him a better life. My sister doesn't live with me and she wants to keep all of her guinea pigs. But they would have been good candidate because of their calm nature. They don't really try to mount each other or other pigs. They are very gentle. But I respect her wish to keep her piggies. I know she loves them very much.

 

[Inokillzombies]

Pictures of my boys. Blossom, Totoro, Bilbo and then Ponyo.

 

[Piggies&buns]

Thanks! I didn't know I would have to put them in a different room. My sister has two females in the same room as her males. She bought two females and one of them was pregnant. She gave birth to three beautiful boys. Now the boys are 1 year old. They all live in the same room, but different cages. The males all lives in a 6x2 c&c cage and the female in two Midwest cages. Should I tell her to house the boars in a different room? The three brothers get along really well and they are really chill pigs. They never had any fights. But back to Totoro and Blossom, if I neuter them should I give them each one a single female or should I do herds of females for each males?

As your sisters boys have grown up around sows, those boars are much less likely to be affected by sow pheromones. It’s when boars are not used to being around sows that you should ideally not suddenly put sows into a room.

Your sister is incredibly lucky if she has three boars living successfully together! A boar trio is the most unstable grouping and most will fail sooner or later, a functioning boar trio is a very rare thing. Especially given her cage isn’t as a large as would be recommended for a boar trio - something more along the lines of a 9x3 cage is needed for a boar trio to give them each a square metre of territory to stop the risk of space related issues.

 

[Inokillzombies]

I think my sister trio works mainly because they are brothers. They are also very calm and friendly guinea pigs. But I will tell her that her cage is too small for three guinea pigs. My sister lives with my parents so she has less space for them. But once she moves out, she will probably put them in a bigger c&c cage for their well being.

 

[Piggies&buns]

I think my sister trio works mainly because they are brothers. They are also very calm and friendly guinea pigs. But I will tell her that her cage is too small for three guinea pigs. My sister lives with my parents so she has less space for them. But once she moves out, she will probably put them in a bigger c&c cage for their well being.

No its nothing to do with them being brothers - it’s character compatibility which is keeping them together. Brothers will fail exactly the same way as non-related piggies will do if they don’t have compatibility.

A 6x2 is a good size if she had sows or if she had two boars, but three boars need so much more space. If they are ok for now, then thats fine, but it’s always something to bear in mind. A boar trio is unstable and it’s always something to be very aware of and have a plan in case the harmony breaks down.

 

[Piggies&buns]

. But back to Totoro and Blossom, if I neuter them should I give them each one a single female or should I do herds of females for each males?

This depends on how much you can manage and how much space you have for them.

A boar with one sow will need a 4x2 c&c cage
A boar with two sows will need a 5x2 c&c
A boar with three sows will need a 6x2
And so on

 

[Inokillzombies]

I think if the harmony breaks down, she will separate them in different cages next to each other. Or maybe I will have a new candidate for my singles boars.

No its nothing to do with them being brothers - it’s character compatibility which is keeping them together. Brothers will fail exactly the same way as non-related piggies will do if they don’t have compatibility.

A 6x2 is a good size if she had sows or if she had two boars, but three boars need so much more space. If they are ok for now, then thats fine, but it’s always something to bear in mind. A boar trio is unstable and it’s always something to be very aware of and have a plan in case the harmony breaks down.

 

[Inokillzombies]

This depends on how much you can manage and how much space you have for them.

A boar with one sow will need a 4x2 c&c cage
A boar with two sows will need a 5x2 c&c
A boar with three sows will need a 6x2
And so on

If I neuter them, I will only put them with females once I have more space. Right now I live in a apartment so I have less space. My boars lives in the dining room. This is their long cage right now. We always put grids for the two boys at night and when we are not there. We don't want them to jump and fall down. We are not done arranging the cage though. We might put some plexiglass in the front instead of grids. Do you think they have enough space? Can I neuter them at whatever age or does it have a age limit where it can become too dangerous for them?

 

[Piggies&buns]

Slightly difficult to tell because it doesn’t look like they are normal c&c grids, but in terms of measurements -
For a single piggy, a 120x60cm (8 square feet) as a minimum but 150x60cm would be recommended.
In a c&c cage this equates to a 2x3 as a minimum but ideally a 2x4 cage.

A boar pair need 180x60cm (12 square feet) or in a c&c cage that’s a 2x5.

For neutering, the important thing is having an experienced vet. You would have to speak to your vet about the upper age limit at which they would be comfortable neutering a boar.

 

[Piggies&buns]

One thing I would add is that I recommend you measure the amount of pellets you are giving them, its not always easy to tell from a picture but it looks like there might be more than the recommended amount in the bowls.
Its just one tablespoon of pellets per piggy per day as you don’t want them to have access to a lot of pellets nor have access to them all day.
A nice idea to help keep piggies entertained is to scatter feed veg and pellets. Mix their one tablespoon of pellets into their hay trays. That way their pellets becomes a foraging exercise which encourages natural activity and stops them from just guzzling them down.

 

[Inokillzombies]

Thanks for the info, I will give them less pellets. I will try your idea to scatter the veggies and the pellets . Right now I give them veggies in the morning and in the evening. Is there any toys you would recommand ? I don't want them to become bored.

 

[Piggies&buns]

Thanks for the info, I will give them less pellets. I will try your idea to scatter the veggies and the pellets . Right now I give them veggies in the morning and in the evening. Is there any toys you would recommand ? I don't want them to become bored.

Piggies don’t really need commercial toys. They spend a lot of time foraging so replicating that in their environment works very well at keeping them occupied - big piles of hay so they can get right inside to forage through, food hidden in hay, cardboard boxes with two holes cut in are just a few ideas which work well.
This guide may also help you
Enrichment Ideas for Guinea Pigs

 

[Inokillzombies]

Thanks for all of the advice ! I learned a lot today. I thought I had done my research well and knew a lot about piggies, but there were a lot of things I still didn't know.