Bladder stone

[Toastypenguin]

Hi everyone,

I’m new here and I’m desperate for some help. My 3 and a half year old Guinea pig Nyla was diagnosed with a bladder stone about 2 weeks ago. The day of surgery, she actually passed the stone on her own and surgery was no longer needed. She was giving an extensive list of medications for the next 2 weeks. The list is as follows.

Metoclopramide- 0.55cc twice daily
Metronidazole- 0.22cc twice daily
Enrofloxacin- 0.22cc twice daily
ProBi- 0.1cc twice daily
Meloxicam- 0.22cc twice daily
Polycitra-K- 0.1cc twice daily for life


In the beginning, she would not eat at all so I would feed her critical care 4-5x a day and give her water through a syringe. Now she has somewhat of an appetite and will eat only vegetables so I only give her critical care twice a day. She will only eat a few strands of hay here and there, has only touched her pellets once, and will sometimes drink water but not as often as she should be. I have tried everything to get her to eat hay and pellets on her own but she won’t give in. She’d rather let herself starve until she gets vegetables. I’ve tried spraying hay with a spray bottle and sprinkling critical care on it, turned critical care into a ball for her to eat, spread hay all over her cage to encourage eating, mixed in fresh hay with the older hay, etc. I’ve even tried giving her different kinds of hay (Timothy, Orchard, Botanical) and nothing seems to work. It is nearing on 2 weeks since she’s passed the stone and I’m going on my second bag of critical care and she’s still not eating fully on her own. Is it normal for her to take so long to eat on her own?

The vet will tell me she just needs time but I’d really appreciate a second opinion. Her urine went from an orange to a bright yellow color, her poops are still small and skinny.

 

[Piggies&buns]

I’m sorry to hear this.

How much veg is she eating? One cup per day is the recommended amount so if she is eating more than that then maybe that’s putting her off eating hay?
Has she seen the vet since the stone passed?

Critical care syringe feeds replace the hay she is not eating for herself so she needs to get enough of it to keep her weight stable. Are you weighing her daily so you can monitor her more closely?

 

[weepweeps]

Hello and welcome to the forum. It’s such a worry when they are poorly. You could try mixing her normal pellets with warm water and leaving a bowl in with her. Weigh her daily to see if she’s eating enough. If not you’ll have to up the critical care. I hope she perks up soon.

 

[Free Ranger]

Hi - is that 2 types of antibiotic she is on at the same time?
I know that antibiotics can interfere with appetite . It's not a problem we've seen personally but we've never had two at once. I had a little sow the same age that passed a stone and she was on Baytril (enrofloxacin) for nearly 3 weeks to combat infection and was fine on it for that time. Once the stone was passed and the pain controlled (meloxicam) she was back to normal. ABs typically take 2 or 3 days to work (in our case she stopped being in pain when she peed and the bloody urine disappeared) and then it should just be a matter of completing the course.

If Nyla has a healthy piggy friend you might be able to make a 'poop soup' to repopulate her gut flora. Collect some fresh poops from the friend - as fresh as you can get - and suspend in a little water, then mix some of the suspension into her CC portion. Give it about an hour after her antibiotics - if you give at the same time the ABs just kill off the good bacteria in the soup. It's nature's probiotic.

Dos she still squeak in pain when she pees? Or hunch up, or wince? Does she look well generally apart from lack of appetite or does she look a bit rough.

Perhaps she has been x-rayed since passing the stone to make sure there's not another one or a broken off piece that is stuck somewhere. Not every vet needs to put them under for the x-ray... we've always been able to do a conscious one by swaddling tightly in a bath towel. Has she seen the vet since passing the stone?

I wouldn't wet the hay - it can go mouldy and cause even more issues. Just make the CC more sloppy if you are worried about water intake.

If you can get fresh grass anywhere (careful it hasn't been sprayed, peed on by dogs or covered in traffic fumes) you might be able to tempt her. This can also keep the teeth down.

There is something called cystease (here it is Feliway Cystease because it's for cats) which people give as a bladder support food supplement. Search our threads for Sterile Interstitial Cystitis (SIC) and cystease and you will be able to find out more as it's not something I have experience with. It can be bought without prescription because it is a food supplement rather than a medicine but it takes maybe 2 weeks to see any effects. I'm not saying your girl has SIC but this can be used to help inflamed bladders for other reasons too.

She sounds better than she was but it sounds like there is still something else going on. 2 weeks on 2 types of antibiotics at once sounds a bit heavy handed - but I'm not a vet. It Might be worth giving them a call if you will be waiting a while for your next appointment and discussing this - perhaps they will be happy to let you drop one of these off to see if she can regain her appetite?

Good luck poor little Nyla and her devoted owner x

 

[Wiebke]

Hi!

As far as I can see, your girl is on two antibiotics (enrofloxacin is the active ingredient in baytril); they can also impact on the gut microbiome.
Meloxicam/metacam is an analgesic (anti-inflammatory and painkiller).
Polycitra is there to minimise the risk of another stone forming quickly until other measures like dietary changes can kick in, which usually take several weeks to work their way through the body.
Pro-B is gut support to help with the impact of antibiotics.
I hope that this helps you?

Please switch from weighing your girl daily at the same time on your kitchen scales instead of once weekly and be aware that around 80% of the daily food intake is hay and not veg - and that you cannot control that by eye. Any feeding support it mainly there to keep up the grass/hay fibre supply that is crucial for the dental and digestive system.
Here is our post-op and our syringe feeding care advice so you can support your girl as best as you can:
Tips For Post-operative Care
Complete Syringe Feeding Guide

What you to do for the longer term are changes in the diet. Keep in mind that more calcium comes with the water and pellets than with veg, unless you are grossly overfeeding on veg and especially on high calcium veg. Most stones do have other contributing factors in derailing the complex calcium absorption process, which we cannot influence; diet is the one area we can make a difference. The trick is not to cut out all calcium all together because too little can also contribute to the formation of stones but to reduce the oxalates in the diet (which our veg diet does with which we have made long term good experiences over the better part of the last decade or so) and to keep things in the 'soft spot' area between extremes.
Please take the time to read our advice in the special diets chapter to avoid more stones. here is the link: Long Term Balanced General And Special Needs Guinea Pig Diets