Bereavement and Bonding - What to do next?

[Chettsgenie]

I'm trying to figure out what to do for the best for my male piggies, and if anyone has relevant experience or advice I'd appreciate it.

I lost my elderly, arthritic and deaf piggy (Tweek, 6 years old) about six weeks ago, and his cage mate hasn't picked any of his happy behaviours back up yet. His name is Custard (2.5 years old), and he's still eating and running around, but he used to rumble when petted and he used to popcorn a lot. He stopped doing these things and now he even sometimes will push my hand back when I pet him which he has never done before in the year and a half that I've had him.

I got a new piggy (Spaghetti, 1.5 years old) a few weeks ago, thinking I needed to get him a new friend fast since his behaviour has changed. I let the new piggy settle in etc in a separate cage before starting a bonding attempt a week ago. The new piggy was being dominant but it wasn't too bad, however Custard was mostly ignoring him and wouldn't relax. So the new piggy kept laying down, cleaning his face etc, showing all the signs that he was comfortable with being bonded to Custard, but Custard was sort of riling the new pig up (stealing a carrot from under his nose, starting to chase him every time he started to lie down), which made the new pig tooth chatter a bit, and Custard didn't lie down or clean his face once in the hour or so they were together in the pen in neutral territory. Also Custard made annoyed coughing sounds several times which he has never done before (I had a previous piggy who would make these sounds whenever children were around). In contrast when he bonded to my elderly piggy Custard was very sweet and immediately licked his face and lay down next to him.

I've been lucky with bonding in the past, and I think this is because my elderly piggy was involved both times. I think he would have accepted most piggies since he always seemed to prefer piggy company to humans and most piggies would have accepted him since they got to be the dominant piggy. It seems like this time it's not going to work out and I'm trying to figure out what to do. I know they didn't full on fight, but Custard clearly wasn't happy and he ate less the next day until I realized and put a blanket over the bars separating them - he perked up after I did this and was eating fine again etc. They're currently in a 2x6 C&C - one at each side with the cage split with bars down the middle. I have spare bars so I can make a 2x3 - that's what I used for Spaghetti before I put them together. I'm thinking about getting 2 x new 2x5 cages ordered soon to keep them side by side. I could always join the cages up if I tried again later and they bonded.

I think Custard is still grieving and I'm worried about him. I've been spending more time with him, and he licked my face which he'd never done before. I was told Spaghetti also lost his cage mate before I adopted him but he just seems like a normal happy piggy, popcorning all over the cage and wheeking whenever he hears a bag rustling. I've been spending time with him too and he has settled in really fast despite the failed bonding attempt.

Q: Does anyone have experience with a piggy's behaviour changing after a bereavement? Did they eventually get their happy behaviours back? Is there anything I can do to help? Note - When he was in the 2x6 alone he was basically staying in one half of the space so I don't think it's bothering him to have a bit less space for now. I will be ordering the new cages soon.

Q: I'm considering the possibility of getting them each a female piggy as a cage mate (not immediately but in a few months time) because I know it's hard to bond boys, but I don't know if it's okay to have two m/f pairs in cages next to each other? Note - If I did this I would have to get the females spayed and I would only get them and do this if I found a vet with the experience to do it. Does anyone have experience with any of this? Any advice/tips etc?

If anyone has any other suggestions I'm open to hearing them.

I want to do what's best for them and I'm still thinking about what to do. I'm going to give it some time before doing anything, which is why I'm looking for advice now so I can think it over and figure out the best solution.

Thanks in advance!

 

[Piggies&buns]

I’m sorry to hear there are issues in the bonding.
It all comes down to compatibility and you can never gauge how it’ll go until you do it.

You say they were in neutral territory for an hour. Is that when you then decided it wasn’t working and separated them?
It’s normal to see dominance behaviours and it actually takes two weeks of being in the same cage together for a bond to be fully settled. Obviously if you weren’t happy with what you were seeing then it’s right to call it.

I had four boys - one pair; and two singles (who were a pair but they had a fight so were separated). When one of my pair was bereaved, he lived alongside the others for two months (so three singles). I then bonded him with one of the others. He was happier once he and his new friend were settled together after the first few weeks but to be honest, he didn’t really show signs of being ‘sad’ about the passing of his friend although I know he would have been.

Can I ask why you would have to get the females spayed? It’s a major surgery and that mostly only done if there is a medical need (ie she had ovarian cysts). It’s safer to get the boys neutered.

 

[Chettsgenie]

I’m sorry to hear there are issues in the bonding.
It all comes down to compatibility and you can never gauge how it’ll go until you do it.

You say they were in neutral territory for an hour. Is that when you then decided it wasn’t working and separated them?
It’s normal to see dominance behaviours and it actually takes two weeks of being in the same cage together for a bond to be fully settled. Obviously if you weren’t happy with what you were seeing then it’s right to call it.

I had four boys - one pair; and two singles (who were a pair but they had a fight so were separated). When one of my pair was bereaved, he lived alongside the others for two months (so three singles). I then bonded him with one of the others. He was happier once he and his new friend were settled together after the first few weeks but to be honest, he didn’t really show signs of being ‘sad’ about the passing of his friend although I know he would have been.

Can I ask why you would have to get the females spayed? It’s a major surgery and that mostly only done if there is a medical need (ie she had ovarian cysts). It’s safer to get the boys neutered.

Yeah, that's when I decided it wasn't working. I'm thinking I could try again and leave them for longer, it could be that Custard is just sad at the minute. Just not sure how long to leave it before trying again. Maybe a couple of months is a good idea. The way Custard is acting at the moment is making me think it won't work so I suppose it depends if his behaviour changes back or not.

I'd heard that getting females spayed is better because it can prevent them from getting female cancers later in life which can be fairly typical, but it depends on if you have an experienced vet as the procedure is riskier. There doesn't seem to be a health reason for neutering boys so that's why I thought it was the better option. I'm not super keen on any kind of surgery to be honest, I just don't know what else to do. I think they both deserve a cage mate if possible.

 

[Piggies&buns]

If they don’t get on and aren’t compatible then they won’t change their minds about each other, no matter how long you wait.
They are usually ready for a new friend between 1 and 4 weeks after their cage mate passed away but you have to get the right new friend.

Living side by side is a perfectly acceptable option though. I have side by side piggies (although one is now bonded with one of my other bereaved boars).

Sows can get ovarian cysts but not every sow with ovarian cysts requires a spay. Spaying is not normally done for bonding purposes and is usually only done when the medical need arises due to it being major surgery. If you can find a vet willing to do it without there being existing medical need then it’s an option you can consider.
Neutering the boys is what normally happens for bonding purposes because it is a much easier and less invasive surgery with an easier recovery (and it’s usually much cheaper).

 

[Chettsgenie]

Thanks for the advice. I'll let them be side by side friends for now.