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Anorexic piggy

Scoop

Scoop

New Born Pup
Joined
Jan 13, 2019
Messages
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Points
175
Location
Sheffield
Hi everyone
I have a 3 year old girl who won’t eat. She has been eating less and less independently for over 3 weeks. She is physically able to but won’t unless I give he critical care and then offer her veg or hay. She is up to the maximum amount of critical care I can get into her twice a day and has gone from 1.3kg to 970g. The exotic vet can’t find anything wrong. We have been back 3 times. She has had antibiotics for a slight lump under her chin but has no other signs of a problem. She regularly has a sticky eye but even that is ok. She is on pain medication, has has anti sickness and probiotics. She has been eating her mates poop so Even tried poop soup tonight. Anyone any suggestions before I take her back to the vet for the final time.she is still moving around the living room but very quiet. She is normally such a wonderful excitable piggy it is heartbreaking to see her.
 
When you say she is up to the maximum amount you can get into her twice a day - what exactly do you mean by that?
Are you only able to feed her twice a day?

If you are home and are able to feed more often, then feeding as much as she will take every couple of hours is the way to go where possible. You are aiming for at least 40-60ml in each 24 hour period.

Have her teeth been checked?
Has the lump been investigated to find out what it is?
 
Hi, she will tolerate 15ml twice a day but only managed 10ml this evening. On some days she will let me give her another 10ml late evening but it depends what time I am home from work if I can get her to have a third dose. They have checked her teeth and there are no major issues. They could see an old ulcer but said it was healed. I have a dental pig. He stops physically being able to eat when his teeth need doing. Floss can eat anything I give he but will only eat about 10 strands of hay or a small lettuce leaf then refuses anymore. I have every kind of veg and 3 types of hay and some grass all around the areas she sits but she won’t touch most of them. The lump was the size of a pea in the loose skin under her chin. It has shrunk to the size of a grain of rice with antibiotics. The vet didn’t seem to be worried about it.
 
I'm assuming that you went first to the vet because she was losing the weight? Or was she eating OK until she had the antibiotics and has not picked up since...
If you offer her the CC in a bowl will she eat it? I'm guessing not - although you would have thought she'd be hungry and she should be capable of it.
If I'm doing CC we don't get more than 15ml in a sitting - I'm guessing they're full then.

If she's after the other's poop she's perhaps thinking her tummy is off for some reason - so are her poops OK?
 
Free Ranger said:
I'm assuming that you went first to the vet because she was losing the weight? Or was she eating OK until she had the antibiotics and has not picked up since...
If you offer her the CC in a bowl will she eat it? I'm guessing not - although you would have thought she'd be hungry and she should be capable of it.
If I'm doing CC we don't get more than 15ml in a sitting - I'm guessing they're full then.

If she's after the other's poop she's perhaps thinking her tummy is off for some reason - so are her poops OK?
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She had lost weight initially. she would eat soft pellets in warm water initially but won’t eat that now. Unfortunately she wont eat the critical care on her own. It is really difficult not having a reason for her not eating. I would happily continue and stay up through the night if needed but whatever is wrong seems to be getting worse as she is needing more and more critical care. I managed to maintain her weight for 2 weeks on under 20 mls a day But with her now loosing weight and tonight not wanting even 10 mls I am not seeing a way forward for her. she is still mobile, just showing no interest n anything except the odd bit of hay an her mates poop
 
Has your vet suggested any sort of scan (x-ray, ultrasound etc) on the abdomen to check for any anomalies?
 
Free Ranger said:
Has your vet suggested any sort of scan (x-ray, ultrasound etc) on the abdomen to check for any anomalies?
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He mentioned X-ray an bloods. I am just not sure she is up to the anaesthetic or what they could find that might be treatable. He mentioned possible liver or kidney disease but they would be treatable. She has no signs of ovarian cyst, there is no bowel obstruction. Her heart and lungs seem fine.
 
You can ask them if they can do a scan conscious. My girls have had many conscious ultrasounds, x rays and even CT scans. Bloods however I know they do normally need to be under for. But if conscious scans is something they can do it’s so worth while as I myself was so worried about them going under. It’s definitely worth having that done to see if there’s anything underlying going on ❤️
 
Mine have had conscious x-ray and ultrasound. You have a point when you say what could they find that is treatable. In our experience x-ray is very quick. My vet does it conscious with piggy swaddled in a towel. Sometimes a vet wants to give a 'whiff of gas' which can put piggy out for a few minutes. They should be able to talk you through the procedure, what they can detect and what they might be looking for.

When my little sow stopped eating (completely - for about 6 weeks) we couldn't find anything wrong. They did an ultrasound to look for anomalies in the abdomen - we found nothing. But in order to do that they had to shave her tummy and put gel on and she was unhappy about that. The whole thing was a battle and she certainly needed a soft surface to lie on back at home. Physically no harm, but she wasn't my friend!

Money is always a consideration, of course, but so is her wellbeing as you are very much aware. You are weighing up giving her a procedure against whether they will find anything treatable. But as someone who has lain awake at night turning my Ivy's situation over and over I should also suggest that you add peace of mind into the equation. If you find something untreatable at least you've found something...
 
Free Ranger said:
Mine have had conscious x-ray and ultrasound. You have a point when you say what could they find that is treatable. In our experience x-ray is very quick. My vet does it conscious with piggy swaddled in a towel. Sometimes a vet wants to give a 'whiff of gas' which can put piggy out for a few minutes. They should be able to talk you through the procedure, what they can detect and what they might be looking for.

When my little sow stopped eating (completely - for about 6 weeks) we couldn't find anything wrong. They did an ultrasound to look for anomalies in the abdomen - we found nothing. But in order to do that they had to shave her tummy and put gel on and she was unhappy about that. The whole thing was a battle and she certainly needed a soft surface to lie on back at home. Physically no harm, but she wasn't my friend!

Money is always a consideration, of course, but so is her wellbeing as you are very much aware. You are weighing up giving her a procedure against whether they will find anything treatable. But as someone who has lain awake at night turning my Ivy's situation over and over I should also suggest that you add peace of mind into the equation. If you find something untreatable at least you've found something...
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Your poor piggy 😳. can i ask if she started eating again? I can persevere as long as she will let me if there is a chance she might start eating again.
 
I'm sorry, no she didn't. She dropped to 950g and maintained that on Recovery food alone - but we think her issue might have been some sort of swallowing problem. She would chew her tiny mouthful of slurry for an absolute age. I fed her about 40-45ml a day (not through the night) typically split between 5 feeds and it took several hours each day. But seriously, she dropped her food pellet one day and walked off, and that was it. She didn't try to eat anything else. She was on painkiller but didn't seem to be in any pain (but she liked metacam so what the hey). She'd had various ABs but no real sign of infection. She had to have her teeth done at one point - that was when she first stopped eating but they weren't especially overgrown so the vet started out by suggesting this might not be a dental issue - it's just that the stopping eating is what we detect. She was in fine fettle for weeks with shiny coat and bright eyes and then all of a sudden one weekend she deteriorated - hunching and hiding away from her cage mate, fur all on end. She seemed to have given up but she also looked physically ill for the first time. When I took her in for pts with our lovely vet she said it was very quick - she was ready to go. She was 3 1/2.
Part of me wonders if I should have gone for a post mortem but to be honest I was absolutely broken and couldn't face it.

I don't think your girl has the same mystery condition though, because she's still eating a range of things. She has no issue with swallowing. Pigs with mouth issues present in different ways but as you might have seen with your dental piggy they typically can struggle with 'hard' foods like hay or nuggets but favour softer veg, grass or slurry, at least initially. Over time they then become unable to chew even the softer things. I think the fact that she is still able to eat everything even if she's not feeling the urge is why your vet might be considering what might have gone wrong with other areas like kidneys or liver.

My old boy has just been through a very tricky month on and off (and on again) an antibiotic that is working but putting a terrific strain on his gut and really knocking his appetite. He was on probiotic mixed in with his recovery food but now I've added poop soup into the mix he does seem to have turned the corner and his poops are much more normal - at least for him! But it did take a few days of spiking every feed with poop soup to assure myself that he was improving. I hope you can see some improvement for your girl. In your shoes I would at least ask about the procedure if they wanted to take x-rays and/or bloods. I would want to know what they were looking for and how likely they might be to find it so I could balance that against her welfare.

Good luck little lady, I'm sorry for your troubles x

PS - Did they definitely rule out ovarian cysts? Some of them can be very tiny but I think they can affect appetite. It's just things like behaviour changes and hair loss on the flanks tend to be better known symptoms...
 
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I think an xray, ultrasound or ct scan may be worth a try if funds allow, my boys had both had conscious ultrasounds and xrays with no issues.
It's so hard when there's obviously something wrong but you can't find it!
Hopefully one of these methods may find something, depending on what your vet thinks.
Best of luck to you and your piggy ❤️
 
Free Ranger said:
I'm sorry, no she didn't. She dropped to 950g and maintained that on Recovery food alone - but we think her issue might have been some sort of swallowing problem. She would chew her tiny mouthful of slurry for an absolute age. I fed her about 40-45ml a day (not through the night) typically split between 5 feeds and it took several hours each day. But seriously, she dropped her food pellet one day and walked off, and that was it. She didn't try to eat anything else. She was on painkiller but didn't seem to be in any pain (but she liked metacam so what the hey). She'd had various ABs but no real sign of infection. She had to have her teeth done at one point - that was when she first stopped eating but they weren't especially overgrown so the vet started out by suggesting this might not be a dental issue - it's just that the stopping eating is what we detect. She was in fine fettle for weeks with shiny coat and bright eyes and then all of a sudden one weekend she deteriorated - hunching and hiding away from her cage mate, fur all on end. She seemed to have given up but she also looked physically ill for the first time. When I took her in for pts with our lovely vet she said it was very quick - she was ready to go. She was 3 1/2.
Part of me wonders if I should have gone for a post mortem but to be honest I was absolutely broken and couldn't face it.

I don't think your girl has the same mystery condition though, because she's still eating a range of things. She has no issue with swallowing. Pigs with mouth issues present in different ways but as you might have seen with your dental piggy they typically can struggle with 'hard' foods like hay or nuggets but favour softer veg, grass or slurry, at least initially. Over time they then become unable to chew even the softer things. I think the fact that she is still able to eat everything even if she's not feeling the urge is why your vet might be considering what might have gone wrong with other areas like kidneys or liver.

My old boy has just been through a very tricky month on and off (and on again) an antibiotic that is working but putting a terrific strain on his gut and really knocking his appetite. He was on probiotic mixed in with his recovery food but now I've added poop soup into the mix he does seem to have turned the corner and his poops are much more normal - at least for him! But it did take a few days of spiking every feed with poop soup to assure myself that he was improving. I hope you can see some improvement for your girl. In your shoes I would at least ask about the procedure if they wanted to take x-rays and/or bloods. I would want to know what they were looking for and how likely they might be to find it so I could balance that against her welfare.

Good luck little lady, I'm sorry for your troubles x

PS - Did they definitely rule out ovarian cysts? Some of them can be very tiny but I think they can affect appetite. It's just things like behaviour changes and hair loss on the flanks tend to be better known symptoms...
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So sorry you both had it so rough. I had something similar with a previous pig but his again was dental. I wondered about cysts as she has some thinning hair to her chest and she is rumbling around her cage mate. As she is quite thin now and they cant be felt and she is also still young the vet though it unlikely an as he couldn’t feel anything he said if they were there, they would be too small to cause an issue. Thanks for all your advice. I managed to get a bit more critical care in her tonight and she has had some dill. I left her munching hay. She tends to do this while i am watching then when i walk away she gets in her bed and doesn’t move again. I will check her weight again in the morning
 
Thanks everyone. I have her booked back in the vet tomorrow night. If she is still not eating enough i will see if an X-ray or ultrasound can be done consciously.
 
Here's our link for sow-related issues which includes ovarian cysts, Sows: Behaviour and female health problems (including ovarian cysts) although it doesn't really discuss loss of appetite.

@Wiebke does this sound like it might be a cyst problem or something further. This caring owner is contemplating which (conscious) scans/tests might give answers to why her little 3 year old sow has lost her appetite and usual lively personality. Piggy can eat the full range of foods but doesn't (owner has a dental piggy too). Weight down from 1.3kg to 970g over 3 weeks. Being supplemented with CC.
Scoop said:
I wondered about cysts as she has some thinning hair to her chest and she is rumbling around her cage mate. As she is quite thin now and they cant be felt and she is also still young the vet though it unlikely an as he couldn’t feel anything he said if they were there, they would be too small to cause an issue.
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Scoop said:
Thanks everyone. I have her booked back in the vet tomorrow night. If she is still not eating enough i will see if an X-ray or ultrasound can be done consciously.
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Hi

I hope that your vet visit has gone well.

It is unfortunately much better to sedate guinea pigs for any scans because they have to be manipulated into more awkward positions sometimes in order to work out what is going on and where exactly in the body it is located three-dimensionally.

It is difficult for us to make any informed guesses because without access to your piggy, we can only guess on the basis of your own perception and speculations - and none of us is a vet.
 
Hi everyone, Despite almost 40mls syringe feed she had lost another 20g. The vet dint think bloods or X-rays would add value or find anything that could be treated. She started to refuse syringe feed yesterday morning and wouldn’t let me give her any last night without a fight. Despite wanting to keep trying to help her the vet thought it was in her best interests to have her put to sleep. It was a hard decision but having lost a almost a third of her body weight and being a shadow of her former loud and excitable self, i didn’t see another option. Her poor cage mate has now lost 3 of his partners 😔 Thank you for all your help and support 🙏
 
I'm so sorry. Losing a piggie can be really traumatic. Take care of yourself while you deal with what happened x
 
Oh I'm so sorry for your loss. It was a decision made out of love 💕
When they get something seriously wrong and their instinct takes over to stop eating and hide away it can sometimes feel cruel to try and prolong things because piggies don't really understand we're trying to help them. And they do get things wrong that we just can't do anything about, and nature takes over, but we can spare them further suffering. A trusted vet is the best person to guide you in that situation because they will have seen piggies coming to the end far more often than most of us owners. Rest in peace little lady x

Spend some time with your boy as it will help both of you come to terms with it. After losing Ivy I sat with George in the kitchen in the morning and had him on my lap in the afternoon. I'd put my bare arm in the cuddle sack and he'd snuggle up to the warmth. We took comfort in each other till I could find him new friends.
 
Free Ranger said:
Oh I'm so sorry for your loss. It was a decision made out of love 💕
When they get something seriously wrong and their instinct takes over to stop eating and hide away it can sometimes feel cruel to try and prolong things because piggies don't really understand we're trying to help them. And they do get things wrong that we just can't do anything about, and nature takes over, but we can spare them further suffering. A trusted vet is the best person to guide you in that situation because they will have seen piggies coming to the end far more often than most of us owners. Rest in peace little lady x

Spend some time with your boy as it will help both of you come to terms with it. After losing Ivy I sat with George in the kitchen in the morning and had him on my lap in the afternoon. I'd put my bare arm in the cuddle sack and he'd snuggle up to the warmth. We took comfort in each other till I could find him new friends.
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Thank you for your kind words 💕it is difficult not to go through everything you could have tried and wonder if you had just one more thing would it have made the difference Her cage mate max has had 3 dentals for tongue trapping. He is needing them every 5 weeks. He is likely to be due another soon. If he continues to respond as well as he has to them i will find him a new buddy. He bounces back amazingly and eats as soon as he is home at the moment. 🤞🏻He is currently sitting next to the grid of the girls cage next door snuggling up to one of them. Unfortunately her cage mate won’t tolerate him 🤦🏼‍♀️so it can’t be them.
 
Scoop said:
it is difficult not to go through everything you could have tried and wonder if you had just one more thing would it have made the difference
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I can tell you that even when you've tried everything possible you're still left wondering. It's because we care... and it's also evolution. When something goes wrong with anything we humans sit and ponder and turn things over so if we're in the same circumstances again we'll know 'better' what to do. Right from the days when we were dodging sabre-tooth tigers. And because we care for our pigs we tolerate the terrible hurt of going over their final weeks because our big planning brains are trying so hard to learn for next time. But sometimes there's just nothing we can do.

Early on in my piggy history I had a lovely shy girl who was actually quite young compared to our usual pigs. We'd got her by mistake, as we thought she was alone in a neighbouring village, but it turned out that it was another village with the same unusual name about 60 miles away! By then we'd made arrangements to meet the owner after work on a certain day etc. and we didn't want to abandon a lone piggy. Then when hubs got there she wasn't alone, she was a breeder piggy who was surplus to requirements offloaded for rehoming. Anyway, home she came and she got used to the different set-up and our neutered husboar. He thought she was the bees knees! We'd only had her for a few months when she started to hide away although she showed no obvious symptoms other than looking a bit down. The vet suspected some sort of blockage in the gut. She went in for surgery and I sat in the car park racking my brains as to how she had a chance to eat something she shouldn't. But it turned out my poor girl was full of cancer and had never stood a chance. She was pts on the table. And because I'm human I still went over and over it, although nothing would have made any difference. Her little life was destined to be short, and all we can do for piggies like that is look after them as best we can. That's what you did for your girl and she had a fine life full of veggies, companionship and loving care 💕
 
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