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Am I being cruel?

Livia Rabideau

Adult Guinea Pig
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Feb 14, 2018
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Kentucky, U.S.
We have has a bad year. Lost 4 rats and 3 piggies so far. We moved to a different state as well. My oldest girl is 9. She has been stiff legged for the last 6 months. Diagnosed with arthritis a year ago. My previous vet didn't want to keep her on metacam for fear of damaging her kidneys. Obviously at her age, they probably don't work 100 percent anyway. I wanted to keep her comfortable even if it meant for less time. He still disagreed. She did well until the last 2 weeks. She has been tipping over and sitting a lot more. I luckily was able to get her 2 a vet. She is now on hospice care. Metacam 2 times a day and buprenorphine as needed, which I hate because it just makes her like a zombie. She still seems happy. Eating, drinking, and no weight loss. I do give her extra greens, cucumber, and syringe water throughout the day in case she doesn't feel like getting up. Of course she has hay all over so she doesn't need to go far for food. My question is, am I being cruel for keeping her around? I cannot imagine losing her, but don't want her to suffer. The vet says she wouldn't euthanize yet, but I wanted your opinions. I also just started her on cosequin last week. Sorry I haven't been around, but it's been a sucky year. Thank you in advance for your support.
 
So sorry it’s been such a sad year. Your little lady is amazing to reach 9 years old! I think if she is still enjoying life and eating well then she has some more happy time yet. I think you will know when she has had enough, in the meantime enjoy your special time together x
 
So sorry it’s been such a sad year. Your little lady is amazing to reach 9 years old! I think if she is still enjoying life and eating well then she has some more happy time yet. I think you will know when she has had enough, in the meantime enjoy your special time together x
Thanks. I just always hang on too long. I wish I could break that habit. 😪
 

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We have has a bad year. Lost 4 rats and 3 piggies so far. We moved to a different state as well. My oldest girl is 9. She has been stiff legged for the last 6 months. Diagnosed with arthritis a year ago. My previous vet didn't want to keep her on metacam for fear of damaging her kidneys. Obviously at her age, they probably don't work 100 percent anyway. I wanted to keep her comfortable even if it meant for less time. He still disagreed. She did well until the last 2 weeks. She has been tipping over and sitting a lot more. I luckily was able to get her 2 a vet. She is now on hospice care. Metacam 2 times a day and buprenorphine as needed, which I hate because it just makes her like a zombie. She still seems happy. Eating, drinking, and no weight loss. I do give her extra greens, cucumber, and syringe water throughout the day in case she doesn't feel like getting up. Of course she has hay all over so she doesn't need to go far for food. My question is, am I being cruel for keeping her around? I cannot imagine losing her, but don't want her to suffer. The vet says she wouldn't euthanize yet, but I wanted your opinions. I also just started her on cosequin last week. Sorry I haven't been around, but it's been a sucky year. Thank you in advance for your support.

Hi

As long as your girl is eating normally all on her own, she still has the will to live and enough zest for life left. That is likely also your vet's main criterium.

Please make sure that you change the bedding in the area she is sitting in most of the time twice daily and gently the genital area/check for urine scald on the undercarriage as well as on the foot soles with a damp soft rag with baby warm water. To not overmoisten the foot soles as that will make them more prone for bumblefoot infection but remove any poos that cake on before they harden too much.
Our mobility care tips deals with all the little and larger adaptions and practical care issues that can make a real difference in the comfort: Looking After Guinea Pigs With Limited or No Mobility

We have a specific chapter in the section about looking after a terminally ill piggy that deals specifically with the issue about when to call it shots and what all plays into it.
In my own experience, the most difficult stage is coming up towards the line because you want to get it right between your own fears and your piggy's welfare - that is where you are at right now.

A Practical and Sensitive Guide to Dying, Terminal Illness and Euthanasia in Guinea Pigs (see chapter 4)
It will hopefully help you clear your mind even if it cannot ease the pain in your heart because you have already started your grieving process and are in fact going through it right now - the shock of knowing that the end is inevitable and not so far away is the second worst time in your grieving process with terminal illness, apart from the actual loss itself.
I would strongly recommend to read the whole chapter about terminal illness because it will enable you to be more in control of that time - both for your own benefit and your old lady's. She will have more quality of life without you being a twisted knot of anxiety over getting it wrong.

It is in fact not a clear line but a grey area within which you have leeway to find the point that is right for you unless he decision is taken suddenly out of your hands by your piggy. At this age, when the end comes naturally, it will be very, very quick.

9 years is a grand old age and a true testament your love and good care.

HUGS
 
Thank you for your kind words. I really appreciate it. I wish she would pass in her sleep, but I fear it won't be that easy. She is doing well, just stiff and a bit unstable at times. Especially when she first gets up. I am definitely keeping her area clean. She does move quite a bit still. I have fleece covered in soft bath mats. So far she hasn't been urinating on herself, but I do clean her face each day. She cannot groom it properly all the time. My vet said to let her rest, but I have read that gentle message and a little activity is beneficial. What are your thoughts?
 
Thank you for your kind words. I really appreciate it. I wish she would pass in her sleep, but I fear it won't be that easy. She is doing well, just stiff and a bit unstable at times. Especially when she first gets up. I am definitely keeping her area clean. She does move quite a bit still. I have fleece covered in soft bath mats. So far she hasn't been urinating on herself, but I do clean her face each day. She cannot groom it properly all the time. My vet said to let her rest, but I have read that gentle message and a little activity is beneficial. What are your thoughts?

She sounds pretty arthritic to me; the stiffness from it can affect the balance as I know from some of my own arthritic oldies who had a tendency of falling over because they no longer had the agility needed to compensate/correct. It is also a often contributing factor in falls in elderly people.
I would think twice about massaging a piggy with arthritis in the bones. Glucosamine and painkillers would be more effective.

The face is not a problem; it is the growing problem with balance and movement during a piggy wash and being able to clean the genitalia well. You can compensate for a piggy that is no longer able to clean themselves by gentle blushing to help spread the oil secreted from the grease gland across the fur coat and by taking over some of the cleaning at the bum end if that becomes too much of a problem.

Please take the time to read the links. It usually takes me several days to ensure that a guide is comprehensive and that all the little practical aspects are included. I cannot repeat them all in full in every single post and still have time for my own piggies. ;)
 
Thank you so much! I will read them.

I sincerely hope that it helps you to evaluate where you set the line and therefore to ease your fears and I also hope that it helps you to understand your own strong feelings better so you feel more in control.
 
Sorry to hear about your losses this year :hug::hug:

I have an arthritic oldie too, though she is "only" 6, 9 is an amazing age to get to. Winifred was diagnosed in late spring and the vet prescribed 0.2ml dog Metacam twice a day, which seemed to stabilise her weight-wise at least. In late August I then noticed her back legs underneath were nearly hairless, presumably overgrooming due to pain. The vet (a different one) didn't want to up the Metacam but gave us a short course of buprenorphine to try. It didn't seem to help, and like you I thought she was more inactive etc. So then the vet (the first one this time) prescribed Tramadol. That seemed to help, as the hair started to grow back within a few days - she looks almost normal now. Maybe it might be worth trying Tramadol for your piggy - unless of course there are contraindications in her case.

A couple of weeks ago I noticed that Winifred had a sore bleeding front paw - she had started to get bumblefoot due to not moving around much. The poor old thing is now on Baytril as well, so I'm not in her good books with all these yucky medicines!
 
Sorry about your piggy. I asked for tramadol, but she said no. Ugh. It's so hard to find a vet that is willing to try new things.
 
Oh, I'm sorry to hear that. It's a pity when vets won't look beyond how they've always done things.
I know vets are often unwilling to give high doses/long term metacam because of the possibility of side effects, maybe there's something like that with Tramadol/Tralieve, but surely it's better that an animal should be able to have a pain free if possibly slightly shorter life, than suffer pain without respite for the rest of their life.
 
She at least gave me metacam. My last vet wouldn't do long term and only gave a small amount. This vet doubled the dose 2 times a day for as long as she is here.
 
I don’t have much advice to offer beyond what others have already contributed but I just wanted to send positive thoughts to you and your gorgeous girl ❤️
 
She at least gave me metacam. My last vet wouldn't do long term and only gave a small amount. This vet doubled the dose 2 times a day for as long as she is here.
Yes, at least your current vet upped the Metacam, I guess it is working as she is still eating and maintaining her weight- Winifred has lost nearly 200g since her problems began. As per Wiebke's advice, I also give her glucosamine supplements, as in an Oxbow Joint Support biscuit (tho she's recently decided she doesn't like those any more!) and a cystease capsule mixed into some critical care.

I suppose you could ask again for Tramadol if your girl starts to show signs of pain, see if the vet might change their mind...
 
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